No. 3 New Model Screw Size

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


I am thinking of making some screw for my #3 NM
and I thought I would look into the size the screws
used to hold the side plate on. I removed the screws
and made measurements (which is straight forward)
but the thread pitch is a little more problematic.

Comparing the threads to my thread pitch gauge,
I find that the threads do not match any of the
leaves in my gauge. It appears to me that the
pitch is between 44tpi and 48tpi. I assume the
pitch is 46tpi (or very close to it). Does anyone
know for sure?

Also, does anyone know if the threads are 60°, 55°
or something else? I have read that the Springfield
used 55° Whitworth thread pitch on Trapdoors.

Check the pics and tell me what you think.


Cheers,
Webb

 

[opoefc]

S&W had its own screw thread pitch. I believe Roy Jinks has previously posted on the Forum the correct info., however I don't recall it off hand. I do know that some old Remington typewriters had small screws that are identical to S&W screws. Perhaps because the S&W typewriters were made by Remington ? Ed


E

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


Remington made typewriters up to the time they went into
bankruptcy and were sold to Marcellus Hartley of Schuyler,
Hartley and Graham and Thomas Bennett of the Winchester
Repeating Arms Co. in partnership in 1888. They broke up
Remington and sold off the typewriter division (but the buyers
were allowed to keep the "Remington" name). This helped to
pay off the other creditors and bring back the company (this is
when the name changed from "E. Remington and Sons" to
"Remington Arms Company").

I know that these firearms were made before Nation Standards
were founded for fasteners so each manufacturer design their
own "standards" but some copied the British and their Whitworth
thread (like the Springfield Armory).

I wish I had access to an optical comparator to put the screws
in and measure the thread.

Thanks for your help!


Cheers,
Webb

 

[rct269]

I, and presumably more than a few others, have a "THREAD LIST-SMITH & WESSON", circa "5-20-'09" which purports to show the specs for any and everything with threads for what I suppose were the items in production at the time; specif., 32 SAF, 38 SAF, 32 D.A., 38 D.A., 44 D.A., Model M, Model I, Model K, 44 H.E., and 38 PER. That's the good news.

The bad news is they don't show the sideplate screw sizes for each and every model shown------leaving us to suppose it's a one size fits all proposition----which at least makes a little sense.

So-------- the "PLATE Sc. small head" for those few shown is "E". "E" translates to what appears to be .105 for a diameter, 45 for a pitch, and .0834 for a tapping size. What these several items appear to be is open for interpretation-------in accord with the quality of the reproduction------which is pretty damn sorry. So, tell me where to send it (snail mail), and I'll send a copy which will be better than my copy-------but not much.

Ralph Tremaine

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

Ralph, PM sent. Thanks!

Cheers,
Webb

 

[frankynohankypanky]

David Chicoine's book "Gunsmithing Guns of the Old West" includes a full page chart listing screw sizes for Model No. 3, large frame top breaks.

My copy is the expanded 2nd edition.

The chart confirms 46TPI right hand for the sideplate screws. It lists most dimensions you might need. Doesn't mention the thread angle but elsewhere in the chapter he says most were 60 degrees.

FRANK STAIG.

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


Thanks for the information Frank. I already have his Antique
Firearms Assembly/Disassembly book but I didn't remember
seeing that information in that book (but I just skimmed it).
I guess I'll have to get a copy of his Old West gunsmithing
book as well.


Cheers,
Webb

 

[iby]

Col. Charlie Pate sent me a NM3 sideplate screw about 1 year ago
$5
He is a Forum member

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


Thanks for the offer but I don't need a screw. This is just a
project for me. Auto repair and gun collecting got me into
being a home shop machinist. There was always a tool or
part I needed and I got tired of buying them (when they are
simple to make).

Over the past 40 years, I have amassed a pretty well equipped
shop. There are a couple of machines I still would like to get
but I can do pretty much what I want with what I have.


Thanks Anyway!
Webb