foothill17
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Optics explained
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mikehoncho
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in this setup you are cowitnessing the red dot with the iron sights.
1. sight in your irons first
2. mount optic
3. adjust optic dot to sit just on top of the front sight post while looking through the small aperature of the rear sight assembly
4. make final elevation and windage adjustments to the red dot at the range
the advantage of this set up is that you can use a non-magnifed red dot optic for parallax free, both eyes open shooting. this allows for fast target acquistion at relatively close ranges. cowitnessing with the iron sights allows you to keep shooting if your optic fails (battery dies, breaks, mount comes loose, etc.). in addition, if you shoot while looking through the rear sight aperature the red dot may make it easier for you to place your sights on target (some guys have a hard time focusing on the front sight post and keeping it and the target clear).
hope that helps.
1. sight in your irons first
2. mount optic
3. adjust optic dot to sit just on top of the front sight post while looking through the small aperature of the rear sight assembly
4. make final elevation and windage adjustments to the red dot at the range
the advantage of this set up is that you can use a non-magnifed red dot optic for parallax free, both eyes open shooting. this allows for fast target acquistion at relatively close ranges. cowitnessing with the iron sights allows you to keep shooting if your optic fails (battery dies, breaks, mount comes loose, etc.). in addition, if you shoot while looking through the rear sight aperature the red dot may make it easier for you to place your sights on target (some guys have a hard time focusing on the front sight post and keeping it and the target clear).
hope that helps.
OP
foothill17
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chuck s
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Or vice versa. But zeroing the irons is the better method as your iron sights are going to be primary when the dot fails.
Assuming the irons and dot "co-witness" (and in this mounting they should) the dot should be right at the tip of the front sight when looking thru the iron sights. How you get the dot and front sight to match is your choice.
After zeroing this is the last time you look thru the irons to use the dot. Or close one eye.
The rest of the time you should shoot both eyes open and look over the rear sight. The dot will "float" down range and all bullets will strike within the dot. No matter what your sight picture, if you can see the dot the bullets will go there. This is what makes a dot sight so fast. My daughter calls this The red dot of death!
I find I can transition extremely fast between multiple targets with the sight as far forward as possible. Too much "stuff" on military M4s to do this anymore, but that doesn't prevent you (and I) from this mounting. Try it for a while.
I prefer tube rather than reflective dot sights as the reflective tend to get dirty quickly. Both are effective.
BTW, only the rear cover need be off using the M68 type sight if you keep both eyes open. Prevents the dot from showing to the front and is especially useful at night.
M4 Top. M&P 15-22 Bottom. (In case you couldn't tell.
)
-- Chuck
Assuming the irons and dot "co-witness" (and in this mounting they should) the dot should be right at the tip of the front sight when looking thru the iron sights. How you get the dot and front sight to match is your choice.
After zeroing this is the last time you look thru the irons to use the dot. Or close one eye.
The rest of the time you should shoot both eyes open and look over the rear sight. The dot will "float" down range and all bullets will strike within the dot. No matter what your sight picture, if you can see the dot the bullets will go there. This is what makes a dot sight so fast. My daughter calls this The red dot of death!
I find I can transition extremely fast between multiple targets with the sight as far forward as possible. Too much "stuff" on military M4s to do this anymore, but that doesn't prevent you (and I) from this mounting. Try it for a while.
I prefer tube rather than reflective dot sights as the reflective tend to get dirty quickly. Both are effective.
BTW, only the rear cover need be off using the M68 type sight if you keep both eyes open. Prevents the dot from showing to the front and is especially useful at night.
M4 Top. M&P 15-22 Bottom. (In case you couldn't tell.
)
-- Chuck
ChattanoogaPhil
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Nice explanation, both above.
Chuck, (aka Daddy Red Dot Death
) there are some folks who have spoke about complications from having to look through the rear aperture to the red dot. How does this method work for you?
Chuck, (aka Daddy Red Dot Death
) there are some folks who have spoke about complications from having to look through the rear aperture to the red dot. How does this method work for you?mikehoncho
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Nice explanation, both above.
Chuck, (aka Daddy Red Dot Death
i know this question was posed to chuck s but i'm going to answer it too if you don't mind.
until i got my BUIS i would sight through the large rear sight aperature to my red dot. because i have the stock collapsed until my nose in on the charging handle, that aperature is huge and almost useless for iron sight purposes. i would also shoot over the rear sight but typically had no issue with both eyes open through the large aperature if you're stock isn't fully extended.
sorry for butting in.
ChattanoogaPhil
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You're never butting in, Mike. I always very much appreciate reading your experiences and opinions here. I just addressed Chuck cuz he's often quiet so I wanted to prompt him for reply.
chuck s
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There's no reason to look thru the rear sight if you have a properly mounted and zeroed red dot sight. Any eye position where you can see the dot is all ya need. No need for the dot to be centered in the sight, just visible.
The only reason to look thru the irons with the dot illuminated is to zero the rifle. There is no accuracy benefit looking thru the rear sight -- and it makes target transition slower as folks tend to close their other eye.
Both eyes open works wonderfully and, as noted, only the rear cover need be open on a tube type dot sight and the ACOG Reflex. The EOtech's may be similar. Or not.
A red dot collimator or reflex sight allows you to use both eyes to speed your focus onto the target. One eye never leaves the target scene. Binocular aiming means that while your view through one eye remains focused on the target, the other eye sees a red dot as the weapon is aimed. The result is a super-imposed dot on the target. Your brain automatically adjusts any contrast.
These sights work especially well if you're used to using the iron sights and assume a good shooting position nearly automatically. The dot WILL be visible if you're even close. No need to try to squint thru the rear sight to see it. No need to remove either the front or rear sights when using one.
-- Chuck
The only reason to look thru the irons with the dot illuminated is to zero the rifle. There is no accuracy benefit looking thru the rear sight -- and it makes target transition slower as folks tend to close their other eye.
Both eyes open works wonderfully and, as noted, only the rear cover need be open on a tube type dot sight and the ACOG Reflex. The EOtech's may be similar. Or not.
A red dot collimator or reflex sight allows you to use both eyes to speed your focus onto the target. One eye never leaves the target scene. Binocular aiming means that while your view through one eye remains focused on the target, the other eye sees a red dot as the weapon is aimed. The result is a super-imposed dot on the target. Your brain automatically adjusts any contrast.
These sights work especially well if you're used to using the iron sights and assume a good shooting position nearly automatically. The dot WILL be visible if you're even close. No need to try to squint thru the rear sight to see it. No need to remove either the front or rear sights when using one.
-- Chuck
Fondis Firearms
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I am pretty new to long guns, (shot a lot of pistols) and this is the first time I put optics on anything... I put a red dot on my 15-22, but for some reason I thought it was supposed to be all the way back on the rail. I see you put yours way forward. What are the advantages of this? This gun is a lot of fun, but everything about it is new for me.
chuck s
Member
Straight from FM 3-22.9, "RIFLE MARKSMANSHIP M16-/M4-SERIES WEAPONS", page 2-17:
These sights work by the way our brain fills in "missing data" from our binocular vision. By keeping both eyes open we see the target(s) and just the Red Dot of Death (tm) floating downrange. We do not see the front or rear sights, nor do we see the dot sight hardware if we keep both eyes open. All the bullets will fit into the dot.
The forward mount on my M4 is very rigid. More rigid, in fact, than the forward mount issued to put the M68 COO on a standard M16A2 rifle. The front rail on my M&P15-22 isn't so rigid, but enough for shooting a .22LR at 50 yards.
I've tried the AGOG Reflex, EOtech, and AimPoint sights. I strongly prefer the AimPoint M68.
-- Chuck
These sights work by the way our brain fills in "missing data" from our binocular vision. By keeping both eyes open we see the target(s) and just the Red Dot of Death (tm) floating downrange. We do not see the front or rear sights, nor do we see the dot sight hardware if we keep both eyes open. All the bullets will fit into the dot.
The forward mount on my M4 is very rigid. More rigid, in fact, than the forward mount issued to put the M68 COO on a standard M16A2 rifle. The front rail on my M&P15-22 isn't so rigid, but enough for shooting a .22LR at 50 yards.
I've tried the AGOG Reflex, EOtech, and AimPoint sights. I strongly prefer the AimPoint M68.
-- Chuck
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