Patent Number on Top of Barrel?

[robertwhite]

Can anyone tell me if S&W ever stamped patent numbers,dates,or patent pending, etc on TOP of a barrel? This stamping would be in addition to the S&W info on the left side and caliber info on the right side of the barrel.

 

[deadin]

To the best of my knowledge S&W never put patent numbers on their guns.
Patent dates were put on the guns from the very beginning. (Usually on the barrel but sometimes on the cylinder.)

 

[robertwhite]

To the best of my knowledge S&W never put patent numbers on their guns.
Patent dates were put on the guns from the very beginning. (Usually on the barrel but sometimes on the cylinder.)

What I originally wrote didn't come out right. I have change the wordage in the original post.

Key here is that there are stamping (I was told it is patent dates) on TOP of the barrel which I personally have never seen before.

So if they put the dates, were they ever on top of the barrel?

 

[deadin]

I personally have never seen before.

You need to look at some older revolvers....

Nearly all revolvers that have patent dates are marked on the top of the barrel. Only the very short barreled (less then 2 1/2 inch?) have them on the side. They pretty much stopped putting on the dates after WW2.

 

[robertwhite]

You need to look at some older revolvers....

Nearly all revolvers that have patent dates are marked on the top of the barrel. Only the very short barreled (less then 2 1/2 inch?) have them on the side. They pretty much stopped putting on the dates after WW2.

Thanks Dean.

So now here is a bigger oddball thing. This particular gun dates to 1947/8 according to its serial number in SWSC. So if they stopped stamping dates after 1945, how would a gun that is 2-3 years newer get stamped?

This gun appears to be all original.

Also, if said gun had a very early C prefix serial number, does it add any value?

 

[deadin]

I said "pretty much stopped". I'm not sure of the exact dates of when each model quit the marking.

 

[dinghysailer]

You need to look at some older revolvers....

Nearly all revolvers that have patent dates are marked on the top of the barrel. Only the very short barreled (less then 2 1/2 inch?) have them on the side. They pretty much stopped putting on the dates after WW2.

I have a very early 1905 4th change with the patent dates on the side of the barrel. My understanding was that the stamp was on the top for the 6" barrels, and was moved to side on the 4" barrels, as the front sight was in the way.

Allan

 

[deadin]

Allan,
You're right. I was thinking is was the snubbies only, but if the markings were too long for the top of the barrel, they went on the side.

 

[robertwhite]

I have a very early 1905 4th change with the patent dates on the side of the barrel. My understanding was that the stamp was on the top for the 6" barrels, and was moved to side on the 4" barrels, as the front sight was in the way.

Allan

Interesting. Though this particular gun is a 4". May have just been a barrel that was still in the parts bin at the time the gun was being assembled.

 

[JP@AK]

I know you don't have this gun in hand. But in the future, you can always look at the flat on the bottom of the barrel to see if the barrel is original to the gun. It should match the serial number on the butt.
Once you get to about the mid-1950s, this will not work. But on a gun assembled in the late 1940s like this one was, you will find the serial number in that location.
Jack

 

[Hondo44]

Interesting. Though this particular gun is a 4". May have just been a barrel that was still in the parts bin at the time the gun was being assembled.

Robert,

You are exactly right. Left over pre war barrels with patent dates were used up after the war and those guns with them are referred to as transitional models and highly collectible. Pre war barrels also have a notch for the larger pre war extractor rod knob.
Immediate Pre war and during war extractor knob ‘barrel’ style and barrel notch shown:

 

[mmais]

Date when it left the factory has nothing to do with when the barrel or any other part was made.

Mike

 

[robertwhite]

Robert,

You are exactly right.

Left over pre war barrels with patent dates were used up after the war and those guns with them are referred to as transitional models and highly collectible.[/quote]

Actually, jack is exactly right. But thanks.

Pre war barrels also have a notch for the larger pre war extractor rod knob.
Immediate Pre war and during war extractor knob ‘barrel’ style and barrel notch shown:

That's a good bit of info. Unfortunately, I can't see a cutout in the sellers photos. It does have the small knob though.

In the end, without being able to handle this particular gun and look for all the clues, at his asking price (which is firm and probably $100-150 too high), I am going to keep looking.

 

[Hondo44]

Left over pre war barrels with patent dates were used up after the war and those guns with them are referred to as transitional models and highly collectible.

Actually, jack is exactly right. But thanks.[/QUOTE]

Jack is rexactly right too, but so were you. I was referring to your post #9

 

[robertwhite]

Actually, jack is exactly right. But thanks.

Jack is rexactly right too, but so were you. I was referring to your post #9

No, I know you were. Jack had already clued me in privately.

I really do appreciate all you folks here willing to share their knowledge.

 

[Hondo44]

You were both "rexactly" right then...did you like my spelling above?

If it wasn't for bad typing, I wouldn't have any skills at all!

 

[Elroy]

I have a very early 1905 4th change with the patent dates on the side of the barrel. My understanding was that the stamp was on the top for the 6" barrels, and was moved to side on the 4" barrels, as the front sight was in the way.

Allan

Please be advised that 4" barrels had "top stampings" too

 

[Hondo44]

As usual w/Smith; The main rule is, there are no rules.

 

[wheelgun610]

Please be advised that 4" barrels had "top stampings" too

It's not difficult to apply a roll mark like the one on a four inch barrel. A lot of people just naturally assume that all roll mark dies are circular. In reality - they're not.... In 21 years in firearms manufacturing, I used plenty of 'em that weren't completely circular.

Mark

 

[Skeetr57]

I wonder why S&W continued to stamp the patent dates on the barrels long after the patents had expired. I am looking at a .38 M&P with an S prefix SN that was shipped in 1948, and the last patent date stamped on the barrel is 1914. That patent would have expired in 1934, so what purpose does the stamping have?