plastic guide rod replacement

[ruthless robbie]

I have a question about guide rods. I know on Glocks that they have plastic guide rods and they will go tens of thousands of rounds without fail. However, my concern is the design on the plastic guide rod on my SD9VE. I've attached pics and you can see where the guide rod meets the part of the barrel where it's held in place, it's bent. I'm going to assume that bending plastic isn't going to be a very reliable thing. I would like to note that I have had several glock 17's and the plastic guide rods in them fit flush so they aren't being bent just sitting still. If my SD9VE plastic guide rod also fit flush like the glock I would just leave it stock and not mess with it but knowing that it doesn't fit flush and that I have a bent piece of plastic in my gun doesn't make me feel like it's safe and reliable.

I don't want a gun that's not going to be reliable. I'm also going to assume the stainless replacement rods will take away this "bending" issue and it will be stronger and less chance to break or fail.



A quick search on Amazon and found a Galloway Precision stainless steel guide rod replacement for $35 shipped and with 77 reviews with a review rating of 4.9 our of 5 stars I'm not seeing where I could go wrong. Any input on this? Also, should I go for stock 17lb spring or 20lb spring?

 

[1lowlife]

I've bought a few SS captured guide rods for my Glocks.
Always ended up going back to stock plastic.
Every one of the SS guide rods I've tried for Glocks ended up having the allen head screw working it's way out of the end of the guide rod.
I'd take the bending plastic rod over losing a set screw and making the gun inoperable..

I've bought a few Sigs with plastic guide rods.
Replaced them with solid SS guide rods, only because of my OCD, the plastic ones worked fine.
But SS Sig rods are solid, no screw on the end....


If you go the SS guide rod, keep an eye on that set screw..

 

[OKFC05]

I'm going to assume that bending plastic isn't going to be a very reliable thing.

You are wrong. The stock guide rod assemblies are low failure rate items, and are more reliable than the aftermarket non-captive steel rods and piano wire springs. Most stock assemblies are replaced based on perception, not failures.

The Galloway captive assemblies are excellent products, and give great service, but cost over 3 times as much as the stock recoil assembly.

Buy yourself a spare trigger spring for sure, because they fail much more often than recoil assemblies. My comments are based on using SW/SD pistols as loaners and trainers for over 15 yrs.

 

[ruthless robbie]

The attached image is probably going to be what happens to my guide rod should i keep it stock. I could understand it breaking overtime if it was flush and only being bent under stress during the firing cycle, however that's not the case. The plastic guide rod in my SD9VE isn't positioned properly from the factory, it's not sitting flush therefore it's bent just from the pressure of it being in it's natural position. This means that it's bent just sitting there so during the firing cycle it would only bend even more. This is how I could see a failure and the end of it to break off just like shown in the attached pic.

 

[OKFC05]

The plastic guide rod in my SD9VE isn't positioned properly from the factory, it's not sitting flush therefore it's bent just from the pressure of it being in it's natural position.

Regardless of whether you decide to buy a Galloway, I'd contact S&W and ask for a replacement recoil assembly under warranty because yours appears defective.

If you want to buy any of the Galloway products simply because it is your preference, by all means do so. Galloway is a good company with quality products. However, there is no need to pretend that the gun is going to fly apart if you don't use aftermarket products; just buy whatever you want and can afford.

Personally, I would (and did) buy an M&P Pro for heavy competition use rather than spend much money modifying a SW/SD. Your money, your choice.

 

[brchambersjr]

When the pistol is assembled the guide rod is not touching the barrel lug as it does when the slide is removed. The base of the rod is seated in it's "bed" in the frame and supported. That "issue" is really a non-issue unless you absolutely have to change it to a steel guide rod. The only thing about a steel guide rod is that it will not flex like the factory guide rod is designed to do while firing.

Bill

 

[AnthemBassMan]

And the front of the spring rests against the slide, not against the actual end of the guiderod. Any part, regardless of materials used to manufacture, will fail at some point in time. But again, the stock parts have quite a long track record of reliability. If you absolutely must change it out for peace of mind, then go for it. Nobody will change your mind otherwise. For my SD40-VE, pretty much the only thing I may change are the sights. May get a set of fiber optics for it for helping my eyes find them easier.

L8R,
Matt

 

[Coop de Ville]

Hi,
Just a thought. I had posted (I believe here) years ago about a frame failure I had on my ~2000 SW40E. Around 2004, while at the range, the slide slid off the end of the frame and landed on the ground. I noticed that the locking bar portion of the frame had basically dissintegrated or crumbled apart.

Why this happened I can't say. But I will tell you what I did prior. I had soon after purchase, replaced the guide rod with a steel captured rod
(I believe from ISMI). It was I believe a heavier spring. It was recommended as to reduce recoil. I had also used gunscrubber to hose it out following range sessions.

This was not a high round count gun. I would say less than 3K rounds or so.

S&W took it back and replaced the frame free of charge. I have since put the original spring back in and left it stock (with the exception of an Apex trigger kit recently installed).

I can not tell you if the spring was at fault. What I can tell you is that I believe it is best to leave firarms stock... for the most part anyway. This was a carry gun, and I should not have messed with it. A range gun then whatever.

I believe this inforation to be accurate, as I posted the original so long ago. I will try to pull it up.

In any case, your spring looks comple7ely normal.

Regards,

-Coop

 

[brchambersjr]

Coop,

I changed my guide rod in my sd9ve to a ss and noticed that my frame was showing some possible hammering on the polymer area right in front of the take down/locking plate. I firmly believe that since the factory guide rod is designed to flex during recoil, once I changed it to the ss one the rigid end was pounding the frame and if I continued to use it mine could have broke apart as yours did.

I had changed springs and triggers and other things but now both my 9 and 40 are factory (except for the tritium night sights) and I do not plan to change anything else out.

Bill

 

[leejack]

I'm a fan of the stock guide rod. I'm confident that it will work every time.

 

[shawn mccarver]

Replacement guide rods are an answer to a question no one is asking. Like the after market FLGRs made for the 1911, they serve no purpose. If you really feel afraid of a failure, just get a spare. I bet you will never need it.

 

[federali]

Frequent topic

When my Glock 19 was new, I had frequent failures to go into battery with factory ammunition. I suspected that flex in the guide rod was depriving the slide of the force it needed to consistently return to battery.

I made my own guide rod by turning a hex-bolt to the proper dimensions, installed it in the gun and the stoppages vanished. I've since gone to captive spring systems.

 

[ruthless robbie]

got the replacement guide rod in today, fits perfectly, and guess what, NO BENDING!!! can't wait to shoot it.

 

[ruthless robbie]

I'm looking at my M&P 9 and wondering why it doesn't have a plastic guide rod? Hmm, maybe because they wised up?

watch the video below from the start of the video until 1:30

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSQOB93GgUg

start watching @ 3:30 in the video below

Tungsten Guide Rods - YouTube

a quick google search and you can find MANY people who have been to the range and their plastic guide rod failed them.

Broken guide rod after two months of use. - AR15.Com Archive

the problem here is, what if these people weren't at the range? what if they were officers on duty? what if they were using their gun on someone breaking in their home?

I just wouldn't put that much faith in tiny piece of plastic.

.

 

[BrianE]

Because the SD9VE is like a value series to the M&P. Cheaper parts = cheaper gun. They've had value series guns in the past..... and parts got swapped then too...

 

[ruthless robbie]

Because the SD9VE is like a value series to the M&P. Cheaper parts = cheaper gun. They've had value series guns in the past..... and parts got swapped then too...

I get that, I believe the VE actually stands for "Value Enhanced". However, I was wondering why the M&P doesn't come with a plastic guide rod if there is nothing wrong with them? I honestly believe that the M&P got the upgrade because this is the first upgrade for most glock owners, as many glocks have had broken plastic guide rods., a quick google search will show you that.

 

[cbr6864]

I fully trust plastic guide rods, I don't think I could afford the ammo required to see a failure. Also on at least two of my guns that I upgraded to a metal guide rod I am seeing a good amount of wear in the front of the slide where the guide rod is wobbling out the hole. I'd much rather buy a new plastic guide rod vs new slide.

As to why the M&P line comes with a metal guide rod it's the same reason it comes with metal sights as the gun cost $200-250 more. Take away all the upgrades the M&P has over the sigma/SD then there is no point in buying the M&P

 

[ruthless robbie]

I fully trust plastic guide rods, I don't think I could afford the ammo required to see a failure. Also on at least two of my guns that I upgraded to a metal guide rod I am seeing a good amount of wear in the front of the slide where the guide rod is wobbling out the hole. I'd much rather buy a new plastic guide rod vs new slide.

As to why the M&P line comes with a metal guide rod it's the same reason it comes with metal sights as the gun cost $200-250 more. Take away all the upgrades the M&P has over the sigma/SD then there is no point in buying the M&P

I'm not trying to be disrespectful but I'm trying to figure something out. On one hand you're saying a metal guide rod wears out the internals of the gun and can cause it to damage the slide. But, on the other hand, you're saying the M&P has a metal guide rod because it's an "upgrade".

So, it's an "upgrade" that "wears out" your gun?

 

[cbr6864]

There is a huge difference between a factory part and after market. After market parts don't fit exact. You seem to be really concerned about the recoil spring so why not replace it then? It's a sub $300 gun what are you expecting? Besides there are plenty of much higher quality and price range handguns that come with polymer guide rods.

 

[ruthless robbie]

There is a huge difference between a factory part and after market. After market parts don't fit exact. You seem to be really concerned about the recoil spring so why not replace it then? It's a sub $300 gun what are you expecting? Besides there are plenty of much higher quality and price range handguns that come with polymer guide rods.

Agreed, the Glock for example is a higher quality and higher priced gun that also comes factory with a polymer guide rod. However, the most popular first "upgrade" glock owners do to their gun is replace the polymer guide rod as it's common knowledge in the glock world that the polymer guide rods do break as mentioned by glock themselves in the videos above.

And I'm not concerned about the "recoil spring" I'm concerned about a bending plastic guide rod and we all know plastic that bends also weakens and eventually breaks.

I bought my SD9VE for $319 at Academy Sports last week, put a $35 stainless guide rod and now feel that I have a very reliable $355 gun. And would suggest to all owners that have plastic guide rods that a stainless replacement should be done for reliability. There's been many many guide rods break on glocks and like I mentioned earlier, if the gun fails at the range then that's fine but what if it fails when it's needed in a self defense situation? As a matter of fact, the SD part in our gun stands for "Self Defense". You would think that with how anal gun owners are with owning a gun in general that we should all agree on reliability and that should be the main focus point. We're talking about a tool used for self defense, not a wrench for a car.

Just a suggestion.