Pocket carry for LEO backup gun?

[WC145]

I see my old thread has been brought back from the dead. A few comments...

I tried the font pocket pants carry but it didn't work out for me. There's just too much stuff on the belt, especially now that we carry tasers. A taser serves a very valuable purpose in the grand scheme of the use of force. I'd rather have a taser on the weak side instead of a backup gun in the front pocket. Of course I DO carry a backup gun, on the front of the vest. Lately it's my 2" 625 with extra loaded moonclips in my bag.

There seems to be some hostility toward the very concept of the backup gun. Mine sees frequent use on the street, dispatching sick and injured animals in an often urban environment using shot loads or reduced loads. There has never been any collateral damage. I'm well aware that the day might come when it saves my life. Likely, no; possible, yes.

And the best news of all? I'll be retiring ASAP after the new year.

Dave Sinko

Geez, Dave, a 2" 625 on your vest? How do you explain away the giant tumor? That's worse than the guy pocket carrying Commanders and G17s, who dresses you guys?

 

[Doug M.]

NEVER, EVER, DID I HEAR AN ACCOUNT FROM ANY LEO WHO EVER HAD THE NEED FOR A SECOND HANDGUN.

In addition, I personally never had a need for a second handgun and have been involved in many incidents requiring use of a gun. That includes both on- and off-duty scenarios. Moreover, I have never had a non-intentional misfire/fail to fire in almost forty (40) years of shooting.

To opine that command officials were derelict in their duties is simply ignorant on your part. Even more ignorant are your statements regarding safety rules and the union contract. I can assure you we were wholly in compliance.

Be safe.

*
I'm a police legal advisor. Been doing LE legal in different settings for a long time. Your experiences may support your position, and I have never needed a BUG either, but I cannot imagine working without one. You are one of very few I have ever heard assert that it is not a safety violation to prohibit second handguns (and a few savvy arguments have been made for 3rd, which is where they place the J frame). I was first sworn in 1989, and as far as I can recall, never worked in a uniformed slot where I did not carry a BUG.

I've seen what our state analog to OSHA does to agencies that have unsound policies because of stupid command tricks, and even mere inattention. Big fines for allowing a uniformed officer to work without a vest; big fines for a holster that is not sufficiently secure. Big fines for unreliable or otherwise inadequate radio systems. It would be very hard for a command officer to make it through a Loudermill hearing for taking a position against ordinary, threshold minimum safety gear such as a BUG. They certainly would be savaged in a deposition in a civil suit resulting from an officer being injured. I also would never expect a reasonable civil defense attorney for an agency to attempt to defend it; there would be a settlement once that silliness became of record. I cannot imagine any qualified expert testifying for such a command officer, and if the union contract allowed for such silliness, that's disgraceful. Fortunately, I cannot recall hearing any command ranked officer, even at the most messed up agency in this state (I have one in mind, and I refer to them for cause as "The Adhocracy"), asserting that BUGs are bad. I've met a few Captains and plenty of Lts. in uniformed slots who carry BUGs, because they still remember from where they came.

 

[jimmyj]

Pocket Carry while sitting-too slow
Ankle Carry- too slow
Jimmy's Method- IWB Holster carried on vest with the metal clip clipped to vest strap. weapon is positioned on strong side with butt facing forward for draw with weak hand. (depending on the vest construction, IWB holster can be inside vest strap with metal clip on the outside of the vest strap)

 

[B Phillips]

I work plain clothes with issued glock 22 on right hip. Glock 42 in left front pocket.

 

[Kframerbluvr]

Long ago, when our policy did not flat out prohibit BUGS, I would carry a Model 38 Bodyguard Airweight in my weak side front pocket to have something to fight with just in case something happened to my issue M64. When we began issuing Glock 17 handguns in the late '80, BUGS were prohibited and still are. Off duty, I carry a old M60 or a 442 in a pocket holster as a BUG, or rarely as a primary. Even though I am plainclothes now (IA), I still insist on having a shotgun in the car. That is my "BUG" in a sense...

 

[shawn mccarver]

Most, but not all, of the LE officers I know amazingly do not carry a back-up. In almost all cases, these officers wear uniforms that are too tight to allow proper pocket carry, and even if the uniform is fitted properly, the equipment on the Sam Browne belt seems to interfere with pocket access so much that the officers cannot even put car keys in the pocket, instead hanging them on a belt prong or sticking a key behind the belt. On the strong side the holster, usually a Level 2 at least, with absolutely NO give or flexibility prevents any access to the front pocket, and on the weak side, it is a combination of the magazine pouch, handcuff case, ASP holder, Pepper Spray holder or Taser holder that prevents access.

For most of these folks, a vest holster is the only viable option, accessible when the uniform shirt is unzipped. The vest holster is fitted to the straps which secure the front and back panels of the vest. The holster is usually mounted in between the body and the straps in order to prevent it from "flopping" around during movement. Once tried, most have found this method uncomfortable, and refuse to do it on a daily basis. In addition, most find ankle holsters do not work, even the type designed for the combat type of boots they wear, and like vest carry, those who have tried it are not comfortable with that mode of carry.

This is unfortunate, as it seems to me that all officers should be allowed to carry a back up gun and they should have the ability, given issue or required equipment to have a place for that back up gun.