Possible Reloading Problem With 9mm (SECOND UPDATE)

[Mike0251]

Plunk the barrel your having an issue with! I reload a boat load of 9mm and I'm sorry to say that range brass that "may" have full auto and or some Glocks tend to make the case dia larger close to the base, approx .002+/-. This is due to their chamber design/specs. I have a CZ Shadow II Orange with a tight barrel/return to battery etc. Pulled the barrel and checked 400+ loads. I have about 125 in a bag off to the side that did not plunk for the MPX. No more issues with the CZ.
Note, full length resizing does not touch the case that low. It is what it is. Shoot the ones that don't plunk that barrel in another gun.

 

[garandsrus]

I had the same issue with a new S&W Range officer in 9mm. Some of the reloads would hang up about 1/8” from the case head. You could sometimes see a slight bulge.

These rounds work fine in my other 9’s and most of the rounds hanging up drop easily into a Dillon case gauge. I need to contact Dillon to see if they make a tighter gauge. Roll sized cases may be worthwhile.

 

[stansdds]

I did the plunk test and it plunks. However, it plunks better in a Smith 669 barrel. It just goes in easier in the Smith barrel. I think the RIA might have a tight chamber. I will try the ammo in another gun next week.

The reason I was slow on the plunk test, was I have the most difficult time getting the RIA back together. I have been working with 1911's since 69 when I went through MP School at Ft Gordon. I have several other 1911's and I can put them back together in seconds. The RIA barrel link just doesn't want to line up.

Sounds like a minimum spec chamber in that RIA 1911. That's good for accuracy, but can sometimes create reliability issues.
Two options; either don't use those reloads in the RIA or run a finish reamer in the chamber to ever so slightly increase its diameter.

 

[kbm6893]

I did the plunk test and it plunks. However, it plunks better in a Smith 669 barrel. It just goes in easier in the Smith barrel. I think the RIA might have a tight chamber. I will try the ammo in another gun next week.

The reason I was slow on the plunk test, was I have the most difficult time getting the RIA back together. I have been working with 1911's since 69 when I went through MP School at Ft Gordon. I have several other 1911's and I can put them back together in seconds. The RIA barrel link just doesn't want to line up.

My father in law finally bought his first gun. He’s comfortably retired and money is no object so he had sucker written all over him when he walked into the gun shop. He lives in Las Vegas so I wasn’t there to help him. Last time he visited I let him handle some of my guns. He didn’t like striker fired and preferred the hammer. He liked my Beretta Vertec.

But he let the guy sell him an $1100 Springfield 1911 in 9MM. I’ve sent him field stripping videos but he’s cursing at taking it apart. It’s been apart for a week because he got frustrated and walked away from it.

I only shoot 124 grain reloads in all my 9MM’s. I use HP38, same powder as 231. I only use Lee dies and i crimp separately with the Lee Crimp Die. I think I load 4.2 grains with an OAL of 1.125, but I’d have to check that. Never had one issue.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

Plunk Test for a semi-automatic pistol

I did the plunk test and it plunks. However, it plunks better in a Smith 669 barrel.

Not trying to be a wiseguy but either it plunks correctly or not. One plunk can't be better than the other & they both be "okay".

(The orange colored entry below is an important step, IMO.)

.

From a previous post of mine:

Plunk Test for a semi-automatic pistol:

This is how you do a "plunk test" but for me it's most important, and accurate, how the assembled "test" round sounds, and feels, when you drop it in the barrel's chamber, as much as where the rim is in relation to the hood. (The rim should not extend beyond the end of the hood.)

When you drop the round in the removed barrel's chamber, it should make a nice metal to metal clink, "plunk", sound. (Make sure you've added a minimal (taper) crimp that's just enough to remove any case flare from the sample round before, otherwise the results are deceiving.) That's the case mouth hitting the chamber's shoulder, where the cartridge headspaces on. If the bullet is seated out too much (long) then the bullet's ogive hits the rifling & you don't get the same sound, but rather a dull thud.

Additionally, if you rotate the round in the chamber it should be nice & smooth (case mouth on chamber shoulder). If it's too long, it'll feel rough because the bullet's ogive is rubbing against the rifling. (Remember, eliminate any flare before checking.)

Initially, seat the bullet out farther than needed & slowly adjust your seating die deeper, doing a plunk test between adjustments until you get the proper results. Then set your final crimp & double check the results. Verify it's fit/feeding in your magazine also before continuing loading.

It doesn't take long to get the right adjustment & once you record the OAL", for that specific bullet, you can use that measurement next time & forego the plunk test, if you like. Make sure it's at or below the SAAMI max. OAL" for that cartridge. (I like to load mine as long as possible while still passing the plunk test & not exceeding max. OAL")

Also, different guns have different amounts for freebore/leade (space between the chamber shoulder & the start of the rifling), so one gun's barrel that can handle a max. OAL" assembled cartridge may find it not to be ideal for anothers, due to bullet shape, so double check if in doubt.

I've never seen the need for a case gauge (for pistols) as the barrel/chamber already acts as the "custom gauge" that you are trying to match. Also, I have no idea how they could indicate if your particular gun's leade would interfere with the bullet you were loading for. It only takes a minute to remove & use the barrel in question & eliminate any doubts.

.

 

[fredj338]

I tumble all of my cases. They look nice and bright. No residue that I can see or feel. I plan on shooting again Monday and will try another gun.

So you are saying the fired brass is sticking & not ejecting or loaded rounds are sticking & not chambering?
Have you inspected fired cases? Do they look normal? Your load, if accirate, isnt over pressure. Most Springfields have minimal throats & tight chambers, but unless the bullet is wedging into the rifling, shouldnt be causing pressure issues that would stick a case with that load.
First I would take a round apart & weigh the charge, try to verify the powder. Then check the oal in your bbl, plunk test. You know the pistol is fine, it has to be the ammo.

 

[mikld]

I don't think plunking has much to do with cases getting stuck in the chamber after firing. Unless the bullets are jammed in the rifling, raising chamber pressure to the point of sticking cases...

 

[mikld]

So you are saying the fired brass is sticking & not ejecting or loaded rounds are sticking & not chambering?
Have you inspected fired cases? Do they look normal? Your load, if accirate, isnt over pressure. Most Springfields have minimal throats & tight chambers, but unless the bullet is wedging into the rifling, shouldnt be causing pressure issues that would stick a case with that load.
First I would take a round apart & weigh the charge, try to verify the powder. Then check the oal in your bbl, plunk test. You know the pistol is fine, it has to be the ammo.

"I was shooting them in my RIA and some cases were sticking in the chamber and not ejecting. I had to knock them out with my squib rod."

 

[max]

I pulled another of the rounds and weighed the powder and it is right on the mark at 4.5.

 

[max]

I got back to the range this morning and the rounds work just fine through my Sig. The problem must be a tight chamber on the RIA. Thanks all for your help and thoughts.

 

[rwsmith]

Chamber roughness.........

I got back to the range this morning and the rounds work just fine through my Sig. The problem must be a tight chamber on the RIA. Thanks all for your help and thoughts.

Some chamber roughness could be a cause for sticking.

 

[cmj8591]

What happens to the slide when the empty sticks in the chamber? Does it cycle at all?

 

[max]

No. it doesn't

What happens to the slide when the empty sticks in the chamber? Does it cycle at all?

 

[cmj8591]

Provided that the cases are sized properly and the ammo is in spec, it has to be the chamber, as some of the other posters here have said. Start with the easiest first. Take a bronze brush and scrub the snot out of the barrel. Finish up with a good coating of CLP. If that doesn't work, there's a pretty good chance that the fix will require some gunsmithing. One of the posters mentioned reaming the chamber, which might be the fix your looking for. Your problem is that a chamber reamer is an expense and if you have never used one, there is a learning curve. I doubt that the problem is too light of a load because if that were the case, the gun wouldn't cycle but once you manually cycled it, the case would come out with little, if any, effort. I would try the cleaning first and if that didn't work, I think your fix is to send the gun back to SA.

 

[max]

The gun has worked fine for the past 2 years with all the factory ammo I have shot through it. I just decided to try some of my reloads and that is when the problems started. I may stick to factory with this one.

Provided that the cases are sized properly and the ammo is in spec, it has to be the chamber, as some of the other posters here have said. Start with the easiest first. Take a bronze brush and scrub the snot out of the barrel. Finish up with a good coating of CLP. If that doesn't work, there's a pretty good chance that the fix will require some gunsmithing. One of the posters mentioned reaming the chamber, which might be the fix your looking for. Your problem is that a chamber reamer is an expense and if you have never used one, there is a learning curve. I doubt that the problem is too light of a load because if that were the case, the gun wouldn't cycle but once you manually cycled it, the case would come out with little, if any, effort. I would try the cleaning first and if that didn't work, I think your fix is to send the gun back to SA.

 

[Rule3]

The gun has worked fine for the past 2 years with all the factory ammo I have shot through it. I just decided to try some of my reloads and that is when the problems started. I may stick to factory with this one.

What if anything from all the suggestions have your tied to get those rounds to work in that specific gun??

If factory ammo works than it is just something simple with those reloads. It really is not a a hard problem to correct/fix?

Have you run them through the LFCD, Played with the bullet seating depth??
Or, just throw in the towel??

 

[max]

Have not used the LFCD yet. Been busy loading 45's

What if anything from all the suggestions have your tied to get those rounds to work in that specific gun??

If factory ammo works than it is just something simple with those reloads. It really is not a a hard problem to correct/fix?

Have you run them through the LFCD, Played with the bullet seating depth??
Or, just throw in the towel??

 

[WR Moore]

Late to the party but after reading through most of the thread:

Pull the extractor and check it. i had similar problems at one time with a .45 and the extractor was chipped. The 9 mm extractor is not the same as the .45, so make sure you get the right part if you buy one. A good spare is a real good idea. However, just saw where you say the slide doesn't cycle when the case sticks, so this probably isn't the issue.

Your overall length is longer than what Hornday shows in their manual. They give a OAL for a 115 gr FMJ RN of 1.100 in. OK, they plunk in, do they drop out? If the bullet is resting on the edge of the lands, your pressure is going to be much higher than if the bullet gets a running start. Different barrels are going to have different rifling leades.

 

[k22fan]

I would shoot all of that batch in the Sig and reload another batch specifically for the Springfield.

If the problem is chamber to carbide sizer fit then I would solve the problem by using a different sizer. The inside diameter of the carbide rings in my 9 mm dies varies a lot. Also the size of the entry cone or bevel in the bottom of dies varies. Generally the older the carbide ring the less entry bevel it has. My first carbide die, part of a Hollywood .44 Magnum set that I bought in 1973, has no bevel at the bottom at all. Obviously its sharp edge does not work worth a hoot in a progressive press. Progressive presses were seldom encountered and very expensive in 1973. As progressive presses became more common carbide rings were given larger entry bevels. The result is that they do not resize down near the case head. I have mailed rifle resizeing dies back to RCBS and Lyman along with cases fired in the rifles that they did not size brass small enough for. Both companies happily sent back free dies that they made or selected to fit my rifles. Believe it or not they expect this to happen a small percent of the time. If by luck a customer who owns a rifle with a minimum chamber gets a sizer at the maximum end of resizer tolerances then the combination is not going to work. They solve those occurrences by replacing the sizer under warranty. That is what both companies technicians told me. I have no doubt that they would do the same with pistol dies. Talk to the manufacturer or your 9 mm sizer die.

By the way, when 9 mm carbide sizers first became common they were priced higher than carbide sizers for revolver cartridges and .45s pistols. The reason for the higher price was the carbide rings in 9mm Luger sizers were full length and tapered. It's too bad that you can not step in a time machine and buy a 1973 Pacific Durachrome 9 mm carbide sizer like mine. On the other hand it would not have as much entry bevel as is usually desirable for a progressive press.

 

[max]

I got the Lee LFCD and then had to order a 9mm shell holder as I couldn't find mine. I ran a few cased through the LFCD and they worked just fine in the RIA this morning. I tried a few that had not been through the Lee and they did not work.

Now I have something to do with my time. Will be running my reloads through the Lee die.