PPC set the record straight

[pwh1500]

Bob,
You are spot on. That is the reason why PPC has gone ffrom 600 competitors in Jackson to 290+ in Albuquerque.
It is another reason why I went to Bullseye. It is truly harder and more demanding than PPC but the effort is worth it. Welcome to Bullseye
Philip

 

[CALREB]

Thanks Phil, Unfortunately Im not going to make it to the NPSC again this year, back surgery 8 weeks ago ,hasnt come around like I was hoping, just taking longer.
Anyway, what I really wanted to attend for was the chance to try and stem some of this damage (as I see it) to the sport.
In reviewing the latest posted rules I see that (whoever decides this stuff) has recently decided that any sight cut not done at the factory now disqualifies your gun as a non factory modification to the slide or frame. If Im interpreting this stuff correctly.
WHO do they think came up with Distinguished semi autos BEFORE the major companies made them. SO anybody's Alan Tanaka, Bob Jones or other non factory made Dist S/A is illegal now!!!!! Even my 12 year old Springfield that was made from a standard model by Springfield , isnt allowed because it originally came with Novak sights.
Same with stock models that maybe didnt come with Bomar type sights arent ok for stock auto if it didnt come from the factory that way. I hope Im looking at this wrong, but I dont think so.
You know they are carrying this (catalog item) thing a bit far , S&W Performance Center guns are not catalog items- BUT their Distinguished Gun is ok, because they dont know how to change that after 13-14 years.
But you order a TOTALLY custom 1911 where you choose, barrel ,trigger,checkering,finish ,grips,AND then wait 14-18 months and you get a catalog distinguished gun. AND does anyone really think Springfield has made 1000 6" PPC SEMI AUTOS, I dont think so !
I have been shooting a Springfield gun for over 10 years ,so I have nothing against their gun, but come on, its not a Distinguished gun. I just dont understand the thinking, and I would like the officials that thought it up to explain it to me.
I would hate to be standing in line as the refs try to decide if a sight cut on a semi auto is factory or done after by a competent gunsmith.Or worse the poor competitor who read the rule that he can change the sights, but didnt realize he couldnt change the sight cut , and admits " OH yes, it had fixed sights and I had Bomars installed" SORRY your gun is now illegal, even though the Factory sells that exact model" what a potential mess, maybe the refs will take control and say this is bunk . Anyway good luck to all that go. Bob

 

[MKT]

Well, for the PPC shooters, here is a new twist compliments of the NRA Law Enforcement Activities Divison; they've begun reclassifying shooters based on their off-duty and stock auto/revolver matches.

The classification system has always been based on the PPC course (1500) and when they started shooting the "little" guns, you shot in your appropriate class. One of the shooters here in Albuquerque, who just recently posted a Sharpshooter score as a Classified shooter, was properly reclassified as a Marksman. Then on 9/6/11 he was reclassified again as a Master and the NRA Competitions folks told him it was because he shoot better than 98.1% on his stock auto and off-duty auto matches. He will be shooting way out of his ability shooitng in the Master class.

It appears they have begun reclassifying all of the shooters based on their "little" gun scores the week before the Nationals. And for those who wonder, I was reclassified too with the auto after two good runs with the stock auto.

 

[jackpilot]

I was wondering why my classification just jumped up last week. Hmmm, well...I'm no sandbagger...so, bring on the competition I reckon.

 

[CALREB]

Well ,, that make a whole lot of sense, I have heartburn and Im not even there. Nice that they dont put out that info before NPSC, another bait and switch , like the first year in Albuquerque.!!!
So now some moron has figured that because you can shoot just a few points down on a very easy short gun course, its only fair that you compete in the High Master class or Master Class in the open gun divisions. MAYBE they just dont have enough to do!!!
I mean, here is a competitor, who shoots his duty pistol well,cause thats all he's had. Suddenly he invest a big gun and wants to compete in the open competition and he finds himself thrown in the master/HM class. BOY, thats gonna keep him coming back !!!!
I tell you, I think the NRA has put out the word, to get PPC shutdown any way possible, so they can just do 3 gun , cause they think thats where the real money is.
Which is all they really care about....Good luck guys, now Im really upset for our new shooters. OH Well, I was so mad had to come back after I calmed down and edit the spelling.

 

[MKT]

Yea Bob, let me tell you there are a bunch of hot folks here in Albuquerque.

One of the CA shooters from Indio has been shooting semi-auto as Classified all year and at the Paradise classic he punched a low Sharpshooter score, so he gets reclassed as Marksman properly. Then, because he's had a couple Outstanding runs with the little guns, he gets reclassed again at a Master. Now he gets to compete with those higher classed shooters while barely able to break 1400. That will really do wonders for the sport!

 

[Have gun-will travel]

I feel like a no body reading these posts from what I call "some of the best PPC shooters in the country"When I started ppc in the early 80's I had a 4 in mod 19.Then bought myself a 6 in mod 28.after shooting for 1 year my scores were good enough to get me into the N.C Governors twenty.After that year I decided to order a Bill Davis custom.It arrived 3 days befor My first out of NC match,Beltsville, MD.Well I was in awe seeing some of the greatest shooters in the world on the same firing line that I was on. This one Guy was beside me on the line and he looked at my brand new Bill Davis Custom PPC double action only revolver and he said "Son how do you like you gun?" I told him that I was sure it would shoot alot better than I was capable of shooting.HE looked at me and said "I want to shake your hand .I'm Bill Davis and I built that gun Two weeks ago. Most people blame the gun not their ability to shoot it on there poor scores ." Well that day I think I shot a 1428 .After that my scores kept climbing until I finally broke 1480.That was my highest score that I ever fired.I did make the Gov twenty for 16 years,never made it to the nationals, and gave up shooting ppc in 1998 because the next year the league went semi auto duty guns.I'm a revo guy not a jamamatic guy.I finished my last year in 3rd in NC .I still have My Bill Davis gun and still take it out to the range once in a while.Thank you guys for bringing back memories.

 

[pzlehr]

So is PPC open ONLY to LEO's? I thought I read that somewhere and have been trying to do some searching and thought you guys would know for sure. I would love to shoot in PPC, if I can't I am thinking of setting up my little home range to at least shoot through some of the stages ( I don't know about all the stages aand what they are like as yet). Being able to shoot in any kind of match of PPC would be great though. Also, does anyone know if there are matches similar to PPC a civvy could shoot in? Thanks in advance!

 

[MKT]

You don't list where your from, but some states have civilian PPC leagues in conjunction with the regular LEO leagues. Other states are stictly by the active or honorably retired LEO rule.

 

[Have gun-will travel]

N.C. used to have a civilian category in the PPC matches but now they don't shoot ppc any longer.Their new format is Police Tactical 3 gun.Lot's of fun but a lot more expensive too.

 

[pzlehr]

Figures...I am from western NC and there is not a whole out this way unless you drive a few hours. That's why with the land I have I may just set up my own PPC from what I read and the videos on Youtube Handy to be sure to go out and shoot but it's just not the same as going to a real match. Some sites have postal matches which I have taken part in....on the honor system. Maybe there is a site that has that category. I think it could be done that way...all you need is a place to shoot, guns,targets and a timer. Not sure how far one can go on the honor system though...all the way to number one I guess if they don't go by it

 

[H Richard]

First, I'm not a LEO. But in the 80's and into the 90's I was an auxiliary member of the IL Police Assoc. That enabled me and quite a few others to compete in statewide match's, (but we competed against other auxiliary members for statewide but against all shooters locally). We shot a 48 round match, no 50 yd distance. We all shot service level guns or tuned 6" revolvers. I still have my early 686 with a wonderful trigger. I eventually went to a Gold Cup. It was great while it lasted, until the local dept. lost it's range. My most favorite match was when I won 1st. Expert, and my 17 yr old son won 2nd Expert. Best I ever did was 2nd Master the day I shot a 478 @ 480.

The local dept. at that time would also have invitational shoots, open to the public. It was really neat to see nearly 100 people turn out to shoot a match. That only lasted until the one dept. individual that had the gumption to coordinate it was killed in a boating accident.

It's really great when a local dept. and the community civilians can cooperate in a common sport.

 

[MKT]

Well, a quick update on the last minute reclassifications.

Apparently enough folks filed protests and the decision was made to restore everyone's classififcation to whatever they had prior to 9/6, unless they shot well enough to bump up in the 1500 match. Most of the reclassifications were based on the short gun courses and not the 1500's. It is a total cluster as far as who won what in what class, but it'll all be worked out in short order.

After all that, it was a great day with the semi auto for me.

 

[SW CQB 45]

MKT.....when you get a chance....update plz.

good luck, have fun and send some cooler weather to South Texas with about 4-6 inches of rain!

 

[h8rsMadEf4mou5]

Im pretty new to pistol <revolver> shooting <only been doing it for a few years since I got out of the Corps, <I was a 0311 SAW gunner, not much pistol time> all my shooting since that has all been private in the desert, all alone heh.

But I have become very interested in PPC courses and competition. I would like to start shooting competitively, I just don't know anything about nothin hehheh. So any advice you guys have or the poster especially would be like gold for me. Also any pics of your PPC courses, matches, guns, or any of your competitions would be amazing!!

 

[mr.elite]

Great post! Make me want try harder! I remember last year when I looked into PPC, I told myself how hard can it be? You’re at a standstill with the target right front of you. So, I bought my self a PPC revolver that was built my bob jones from gunbroker and went to the first match in long beach. Let me just say it was a humbling experience. It’s so challenging, that’s what got me hooked. I’ve been to all the CPPA matches except one this season. It’s expensive but well worth it. Counting the days till next season. I just hope to see more new shooters. Thank you Mr. barnes for the tips and plumb-bob.

 

[KAC]

In an earlier post I laid out my problems with awards I was supposed to receive from the 2010 NPSC. I spoke to several NRA people at the 2011 NPSC but really didn't get any satisfaction. Today I received a letter from NRA that stated I hadn't really won the rifles they originally said I did. Let me lay out the details:

In the Official Program for the 2010 NPSC the rules were spelled out for the "New Shooter" awards. Simply stated, on the registration form, you had to have never competed in a NPSC, OR, had not competed for at least 3 years. This rule was also repeated in the Official Program booklet that all competitors received when they registered at the range. I have a PPC High Master classification, as I have had since, well it has been a long time. However, since I had not competed in a NPSC since 2004, I signed up as a New Shooter - their rules. At the end of the 2010 NPSC I was told that I had not won any firearms. In January of this year I received a 1099 for over $6,000, way more than what I had in my hands. After contacting the person at NRA who issued the 1099 I was informed that I had won 3 rifles whose total value was in excess of $5,500. Since I had not received these rifles, in fact had not been informed that I had won them, I asked to have an ammended 1099 issued, which NRA did. The discussions I had at this years NPSC revolved around wheither or not I had won the rifles. The issue was not resolved, but I was promised a resolution as soon as possible.

Today's letter stated that I had originally been awarded the rifles as a New Shooter. However, the letter continued, this was done in error because of my classification. Now, this year the rules for New Shooter have been changed and apparently NRA is retroactively applying those new rules to the 2010 NPSC. I was p.o.'ed to say the least and have registered my displeasure. It will probably take several more months to hear back from NRA, but as I hear more I will post it here.

Al Culbertson

 

[CALREB]

Gee Al, no love for us from CA, Check 2009 , I think the new shooter was a fellow from Texas who also was a HM , and the year before an EXP or master, not knocking them ,thats the present rules but , why the problem with you ???
THEY consistently make up the rules as they go along.Look at the first years there, no pre match pamplet , you get there and oh we forgot to tell you , WE changed the awards rules , sorry . I wish they would try that ****## at the Bianchi Cup and see what happens.
We just spent a ton of money fitting PPC 9s with sights and now after 2 years , suddenly they are not allowed.I really wish they would get it together, but the current guys are BOZO's and thats all you can say. When they pushed out or lost Patty , Martha and Toy, and took in the last couple Guys its gone consistently downhill. Im too old to change to another sport, maybe bullseye, when I retire,
But for right now my health is back and Im seriously considering making an effort to get something done or make their life miserable. They cant do anything to us , what not give me a gun, big deal, I know you have given away more stuff than most guys win . I just hate to see it going so badly, it seems that they almost want to drive guys away.
You know when they came out with all this slide cut ,other than the factory stuff, I thought , who do these guys think built the first Dist Semi autos,or for stock, technically by their rules all Tanaka, Jones, Clark, such, autos are altered weapons , not allowed ,cause they werent done by the factory, if I read it correctly .It leaves you shaking you head.

 

[KAC]

Yeah, what I think happened is they saw another High Master won the new shooter awards so they made the decision to change the rules after the event was over. Doesn't seem like they are the most honest bunch. Hard to believe they were peace officers at one time. I agree with you, too, about the PPC9/Stock Auto decision. I shot the 2010 and 2011 NPSC with my ppc9 as a stock auto and the ref's didn't give it a second look. What we have is a group making decisions on rules that have not shot in years, and have no idea, or don't care, about how their decisions affect the competitors. No more nationals for me until they fire the two idiots running them.

 

[m4bgringo]

My local club has a PPC event we do once a month. We do this match for fun, not a sanctioned event. I am curious as to what the "real" PPC event entails.

We only use one handgun and a perfect score is 600.

I see the 1500 number being the "magic" number for the PPC events being discussed above.

I enjoy it and find it very difficult to do well. There are a LOT of semi-auto .22's in there, but I stick with my revolvers in either .38 Special, .40 cal, or .45 ACP.