Pre27 v. Pre28: Case Closed (AFAIAC)

OK, I am not sure why you started this thread as I don't think the difference is noticeable enough by the human hand (barring an obvious mechanical issue). If one could perform the same test mechanically then I would buy into it more (I know you don't care).

Having said that, now repeat the test with the post war 357 and your pre war 357 and post the results. In that comparison I DO believe it is humanly noticeable with the pre war gun winning hands down.

You know I gotta mess with you SP ;) and I also know you don't care.
 
I am dismissing all opinions stated here. Going to my range and test fire thousands of rounds. Model 27 and 28. Then will keep results to self.

A wise decision.:rolleyes:
The responses here remind me of a site catering to black blocky shaped guns.:(
After 30 some years experience with both models, I tend to agree with SP.
 
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10 yds.?.....Shoot 25 or 50 yds., and vary the ammo. Shoot from sand bags, or a Ransom Rest, and take out all the other varibles. Just one ammo don't count in my opinion( one gun may like it better than the other gun). I personally don't think that is a good example of a test. I'm not saying that one gun is more accurate than the other, but I'd like to see them both shot with different loads, and an overall view can be gained with the two revolvers, not the shooter.
 
A wise decision.:rolleyes:
The responses here remind me of a site catering to black blocky shaped guns.:(

Iggy, this is a forum bro, means folks get to "express, their own opinions" no guarantee on the accuracy of the observation, Saxon was just bored and had a desire to "pontificate". I did read most of the posts, so I musta been really bored, but the sun just came out, so I'm gone.
 
I think that this thread takes away much of the credibility that Saxon Pig has built up here, for himself, over the years.

Oh well, at least he can still be the forum expert on all things +P. :D
 
I think that this thread takes away much of the credibility that Saxon Pig has built up here, for himself, over the years.

Oh well, at least he can still be the forum expert on all things +P. :D

Actually although I have disagreed with SP a lot over the years, his credibility to me is his desire to debunk myths pervasive in the gun world. While I don't think his premise is misaligned I do think some of tests lack substance.

What it boils down to is he does contribute to the forum and is not a like man or a cool gun man as are several people on here that have built post count doing the afore mentioned.
 
AFAIAC- "As far as I am concerned". I had to look that up, and it does slant the thread more favorably to the OP.
 
QUOTE That's your prerogative. QUOTE


I don't know about the rest of you guys, but that is either and insult or something you don't discuss in polite society......:cool:
 
Sax,

So what you're ssentially saying is that if the M27 and HP were cars, the M27 would be the Chrysler Fifth Avenue while the HP would be the Plymouth Gran Fury? ;)
 
While I don't think his premise is misaligned I do think some of tests lack substance.

SP isn't hard to figure out. He posts stuff like this to "stir the pot". This test most certainly lacked substance.

No sense in further discussion...SP says "case closed"....he's taking his ball and bat and going home. Game over. :D
 
Hello SP, lets throw a same era 4" Python in on the next trip to the range.
I would like to read your opinion. I have gotten to old and shaky to get a nice group. Best, Mike2796

Will you accept a six-inch Python (two of them) against several M-27's and three M-28's? One pre-27 had a 6.5-inch barrel; all the rest had six-inchers.

Ammo varied, but consisted of Speer 140 grain JHP, 145 grain Silvertip, and some 125 grain stuff from Remington, Winchester, and Federal. Quite a lot was Remington's 158 grain SP and JHP stuff. And I shot various .38 Special loads, too.

I'd read that Colts outshot S&W's and Rugers and were the darlings of the PPC crowd. I expected the Pythons to do better.

Honestly, I couldn't see any difference by brand. Results overlapped so much that I concluded that there was no practical difference between the S&W's and the Colts. Both shot VERY tight groups at 25 yards and if I hadn't marked the targets, I probably couldn't have told which guns shot which targets. I should probably note that I was then a very good handgun shooter and hit the range several times a month. My groups were SUBSTANTIALLY better than almost any that I've seen posted on the Net. I also handled Magnum recoil better than most do. If I shot like some men who post pics of their targets, I wouldn't put them on the Net. I'd be too ashamed and I certainly wouldn't claim to have conducted any meaningful testing. These guys who get their first .357 and fire a lousy group at just 10 yards and claim to have tested the gun are an embarrassment to all gun owners. They do a disservice to newcomers who then think that revolvers are inaccurate!

If you can't put all six holes touching closely in a pretty tight ragged hole at 25 yards from "offhand" at least fairly often, you aren't a very good pistol shot, and need to keep your results to yourself. And you shouldn't hunt live animals with a handgun.

BTW, I also owned a Colt Trooper .357, the old model, not a MK III. It shot pretty much on par with my Combat Magnums, several examples, including those marked as M-19's. One was a pre-19. It was, with an early M-29, as fine a revolver as I've owned. Later, I bought my M-66-3, which is among the most accurate four-inch .357's I've shot.

The Trooper and those M-19's were all with four-inch barrels. I have owned a couple of six-inch M-19's, but will not incude them here, as they were easier to shoot well and gave exceptional results, about on par with the N-frame guns.

It is possible that extremely skilled shooters who routinely win tough matches can detect that Colts shoot better. Most of us are not able to establish that. I make no claim to be a master marksman.

For what it may be worth, I do believe that Ruger's GP-100 averages better accuracy than did their previous Security-Six series. This is subjective and I've owned only a couple of them. But present GP-100's probably overlap S&W accuracy.

Some revolvers do prefer certain ammo, so should be fired with several brands to see what they like best.
 
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I see this is where the ultimate internet theoretical shooting match is occurring.
 
...and according to the interwebs Dan Wesson's were the best shooting double action revolvers.
 
Sax,

So what you're ssentially saying is that if the M27 and HP were cars, the M27 would be the Chrysler Fifth Avenue while the HP would be the Plymouth Gran Fury? ;)

How 'bout Hyundai Sonata LTD 2.0T vs. Chrysler 300 LTD/200S?

Iggy, this is a forum bro, means folks get to "express, their own opinions" no guarantee on the accuracy of the observation, Saxon was just bored and had a desire to "pontificate".

You gotta fight, for your right, to par-tay, but evahbooty git to press thar minions. That thar is in yor daily constitushun.
 
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Again, this was never intended to be a scientific test. It was just a quick exercise to demonstrate what I already believed to be true.

Looking at the internals will reveal nothing. I think it quite plausible to think that as a 27 came into the fitting room the tech took just a bit more time to make sure things were as near perfect as they could be. The 28 was a cost cutting gun and the guys on the line knew it. A brief visual examination will not show this.

On the pre-war Magnum comparison, I have only shot one RM and I cannot discern any substantial difference between it and the 27s. But mine has a replacement hammer so it may no longer be as fine tuned as it was when it left Springfield.

Throwing the Python into the mix will really stir things up. I have stated many times in the past that I love the 27s, own more of them than any other gun, but I think the Python is slightly superior in fit, finish, and action smoothness. I am in the minority on this one and I know it.
 
. . . If I shot like some men who post pics of their targets, I wouldn't put them on the Net. I'd be too ashamed and I certainly wouldn't claim to have conducted any meaningful testing. These guys who get their first .357 and fire a lousy group at just 10 yards and claim to have tested the gun are an embarrassment to all gun owners. They do a disservice to newcomers who then think that revolvers are inaccurate!

If you can't put all six holes touching closely in a pretty tight ragged hole at 25 yards from "offhand" at least fairly often, you aren't a very good pistol shot, and need to keep your results to yourself. . . .
Worth repeating, particularly because there may be some beginners reading these posts who don't already know the above. I thought that mosr of us did, but even that may not be the case.

Anyway, thanks for posting.
 
The Python is "superior" until you own a Registered Magnum (or pre war "non- registered" magnum)!!! The Python is IMO vastly over-rated. The Python is no better than a S&W "357" or Combat Magnum made before Bangor Punta and as time went on, Python quality declined anyways. One of the reasons the Pythons get so much hype is the internet, and the fact they are not made anymore. At one time, they were like having a Ford Mustang or something, pretty common, and so many people had experience with them, that their "legend" err MYTH grew to astronomical proportions. Their lockwork was a vintage design, the sights left something to be desired, the factory grips were terrible (1st gen full checkered Python grips do feel ok in your hand) and the DA pull stacked. On top of that, the cylinder release is vastly inferior to that of a S&W. So whats left? A pretty blue and a vent rib? Pre war S&Ws have a pretty blue, and the vent rib itself was more for looks than anything. Does anyone here really think that if Pythons were HALF as great as people claim, that Colt would not still be making them? Get real! Many people don't have RMs, or never heard of them, some don't have the coin, etc. and so the RM vs X comparisons are not common. Pythons were made much later and are way more common than even post war 5 screw model of 1950 357s, hence more people yak about them.

As far as the OP's topic, there are far too many variables to consider to put forth anything of the such with any degree of certainty. As others have stated, I would think a wide sample size is a requirement before trying to suggest anything to this effect on the S&W 27 vs 28 for function.

I wouldn't trade these 3 RMs for 8 Pythons! If you want to pay big money for the "best revolver of all time" that Colt mysteriously completely stopped producing on their own, you be my guest!

IMG_3041_zps5ee4942d.jpg
 
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