Question about Gold Dot Short Barrel ammo

[frogg]

I heard that I should use the same grain ammo for target practice training as I do for my self defense carry ammo.

I was thinking of purchasing Gold Dot Short Barrel Personal Protection 9mm Luger +P ammo for my M&P Shield 9mm handgun, to use as my self defense ammo.

It's 124 grain but say's it has less recoil, so do you think I can have the same recoil feel if I used 115 grain FMJ for target practice or should I get 124 grain ammo as well for target practice?

Here is the description:
At one time, packing a compact handgun meant sacrificing performance and ammunition selection. Speer® Gold Dot® Short Barrel® ammunition has changed that. It is designed to work in barrels as short as 1.9 inches while producing less felt recoil and achieving reliable expansion and penetration.

Muzzle Velocity 1150

Buy Gold Dot Short Barrel Personal Protection for USD 36.99 | Speer

PS I was thinking of going down to 115 grain ammo for self defense carry, because the other 124 grain ammo I've been using has a lot of recoil which makes it hard to get shots on target I noticed. But then I stumbled across this Gold Dot Short Barrel Personal Protection 9mm Luger +P ammo which looks good.

 

[BE Mike]

If you are focused on recoil impulse when training, you are focused on the wrong thing.

 

[Borderboss]

I don't see any benefit in using the same weight bullet in practice, within reason. I think the difference between 115gr and 124gr in 9mm is pretty marginal. And as Mike mentioned, don't concentrate on the recoil impulse during practice because in a self defense situation you're not going to notice the recoil impulse.

Generally I like the Speer Short Barrel ammo. It's well designed and ballistics gel testing looks very promising.

 

[Old Corp]

The Speer 9mm +P 124 gr GDHP Short Barrel is all I carry in my smallest 9 - a Kahr PM9. Shoots to POA and very reliable.
For the training and drills you should be doing to keep your hand in for CC, any target grade 115 or 124 gr. will not make any real difference.

 

[petepeterson]

The difference between 115 and 147-gr 9mm is noticeable to me if I shoot my pistols from a rest at around 20 yds. Maybe a few inches different.
Anything less than that, off-hand, and I'm not really noticing.
Pretty much the same with recoil. If you're feeling the difference, you may be focusing on it too much.

 

[zeke]

Have not noticed much of a difference in semi autos out to 25 yds. In revolvers there can be a very noticable change in poi and recoil.

 

[WR Moore]

I had the impression that the various Speer short barrel loads used different bullets from those used in standard loadings.

Now, the claimed (from what barrel length?) 1150 f/s is slower than what one generally sees from +P 9 mm. NATO spec ball is somewhere over 1200 f/s for the same bullet weight.

As others have mentioned there really isn't all that much difference in recoil between the various 9 mm loads. But, that can vary between product lines. I personally find Blazer aluminum case 9 mm to be loaded more stoutly than the Blazer Brass 124 gr. It sounds like you need more practice and some good instruction might help. You've gotta get used to the idea that the guns gonna recoil no matter what you've loaded it with and learn to deal with it.

 

[Nevada Ed]

The Speer short barrel +P ammo is only needed for a 3" barrel 9mm pistol
in order to get the correct fps for the bullet to work correctly.

The "Standard" load will work in barrels that are 4" long, with enough fps
for the bullet to work correctly.

As for practice ammo, any 115 or 124 cheap ammo is the way to go,
which lets you practice more, without spending more money, than needed
to improve your skills.

A instructor or watching training films will teach you "Good" habits
which can be helpful.

 

[reddog81]

Try a couple different varieties and see which one shoots the best or matches whatever amount of recoil you are going for.

115 grain bullets won’t necessarily have more or less recoil than 124 grain bullets. It’s all a function of what powder and how much is used to achieve whatever the velocity they are getting. And comparing velocities on boxes of ammo doesn’t necessarily mean anything unless the different manufacturers are using the exact same testing platform.

 

[Borderboss]

I had the impression that the various Speer short barrel loads used different bullets from those used in standard loadings.

I believe they all use the same bullet but have different loadings for burn rates. A Speer technician told me once that the Gold Dot in all calibers is designed to expand at 750fps and above.

 

[Nevada Ed]

I believe they all use the same bullet but have different loadings for burn rates. A Speer technician told me once that the Gold Dot in all calibers is designed to expand at 750fps and above.

Would you believe a 38 special, 125gr , six pedal, over 836fps ??

 

[chief38]

If just practicing combat style shooting on a silhouette target and at a relatively close distance, grain weight would only slightly change POI. If bullseye shooting at 50 feet, I always like to use the same grain weight bullet as I do find lighter bullets usually print low.

 

[Borderboss]

Would you believe a 38 special, 125gr , six pedal, over 836fps ??

Speer doesn't have a 125gr, but they sell a 135gr Short Barrel .38 Spl. Based on the test HERE by Lucky Gunner, it looks like expansion is haphazard.

 

[stansdds]

There is not a huge difference between recoil or where the bullet will impact the target at distances of 25 yards or less when considering 115 and 124 grain 9mm ammo. I have found that at least some 115 grain ammo is less accurate than 124 grain ammo, I'm thinking that the shorter bearing surface of the 115 grain round nose (FMJ) negatively impacts accuracy.

 

[Paul in Nevada]

The short barrel magic is in the powder, not the bullet.

 

[Nevada Ed]

Speer doesn't have a 125gr, but they sell a 135gr Short Barrel .38 Spl. Based on the test HERE by Lucky Gunner, it looks like expansion is haphazard.

Please look up Speer's 38 Cal, 125gr JHP box #4012.

Just because it is not listed on the Luckygunner.com site test, does not mean that it is not made.

Ammo to go has 125 Gold dots.

 

[Borderboss]

Please look up Speer's 38 Cal, 125gr JHP box #4012.

Just because it is not listed on the Luckygunner.com site test, does not mean that it is not made.

Those are bullets. We're talking about loaded ammo in this thread. Speer only loads the 135gr GD in ammo.

 

[smithra_66]

I heard that I should use the same grain ammo for target practice training as I do for my self defense carry ammo.

I was thinking of purchasing Gold Dot Short Barrel Personal Protection 9mm Luger +P ammo for my M&P Shield 9mm handgun, to use as my self defense ammo.

It's 124 grain but say's it has less recoil, so do you think I can have the same recoil feel if I used 115 grain FMJ for target practice or should I get 124 grain ammo as well for target practice?

Here is the description:
At one time, packing a compact handgun meant sacrificing performance and ammunition selection. Speer® Gold Dot® Short Barrel® ammunition has changed that. It is designed to work in barrels as short as 1.9 inches while producing less felt recoil and achieving reliable expansion and penetration.

Muzzle Velocity 1150

Buy Gold Dot Short Barrel Personal Protection for USD 36.99 | Speer

PS I was thinking of going down to 115 grain ammo for self defense carry, because the other 124 grain ammo I've been using has a lot of recoil which makes it hard to get shots on target I noticed. But then I stumbled across this Gold Dot Short Barrel Personal Protection 9mm Luger +P ammo which looks good.

Recoil is simply a function of bullet weight and bullet speed.

Marketers try to say things like "less recoil" but the only way to change recoil is by changing the weight or speed of the projectile, or the weight of the firearm.

 

[STORMINORMAN]

I do know that the 45 caliber 230gr'ers for the Short Barrel & the standard GDHP do physically differ, their stated sectional density is the same, ballistic coefficient different, and the load data is exactly the same...

I would opine it is really a bullet design function related to expansion velocity: the SBs shoot great in my 45 Colt, BTW! Same situation re: the load data.

Cheers!

 

[WR Moore]

I believe they all use the same bullet but have different loadings for burn rates. A Speer technician told me once that the Gold Dot in all calibers is designed to expand at 750fps and above.

Possibly depending upon when you talked to Speer, that isn't necessarily true. Several years back I bought a box of 125. gr .357 Gold Dots and the "hollow point" was a dish rather than what one expects. Outstanding performance at Magnum velocities. IIRC, pretty much nothing at .38 Spl velocities.

.357 diameter bullets (esp. the lighter ones) have a severe challenge. If they'll expand at .38 velocities, they often fail at .357 velocities. OTOH, if the do well at Magnum velocities, expansion at .38 velocities can be most disappointing. The Remington 125 SJHP does well on expansion at both velocity envelopes, but if you're looking for the FBI mandated penetration, you'll be disappointed. The Sierra 125 JHP does better penetration wise, but doesn't expand as much.