questions about "restoring" my grandpas old M and P.

[ajbaker]

After my grandpa passed away my grandma asked me to get rid of a gun he had. I'm a gun guy and since it was his and we were close I would like to "restore" it a bit. He retired as a tug boat Captain on a tug from Anchorage to Seattle to Honalulu. I think he must have kept it on the boat because the finish is pitted. To top it off he or someone else cut the barrell off just behind the front sight and did a bad job at it.

I didn't know what to do with it until reading the newest issue of American handgunner. There is an article written by Mike "Duke" Venturino on big bore snubbies. There is a picture of two of his revolvers he cut the barrells on and did a home made parkerizing jobs on.

I live in Washington but also do not mind shipping the gun to a smith in another state. Do you guys have any suggestions on a smith to recut and recrown the barrell and mount a new front sight?

What about suggestions on what to refinish the gun with? Blue/black finishes not nickle or hardchrome. I do like blued finishes but since it is pitted I imagine it can not be reblued.

I attached two photos of the gun and the serial number is 221XXX. Any idea how old it is?

Thanks for any info and suggestions!

 

[Beemerguy53]

Well, here's my two cents' worth on this...

What you should do TO this revolver depends upon what you want to do WITH it.

If you are going to shoot it, I would think almost any competent gunsmith can crown the barrel, mount a new sight, and refinish it using one of the modern gun finishes. But if you go that route, I think you'll probably have a lot more money in this piece than it will be worth, and it will be unrecognizable as your grandpa's gun.

If you do not plan to shoot it much, or if you place any value on its significance as a family artifact, I would just leave it as it is, for its condition is part of its history.

For an idea of what's possible and what it might cost, I would suggest you check out Cylinder and Slide's website.

Good luck to you, and please keep us posted on what you ultimately decide to do!

 

[murphydog]

Welcome to the Forum. I agree with beemerguy's thoughts about the gunsmithing.

From the photos, your gun appears to be a Military & Police. You didn't mention the chambering but they were made in .38 Special and .32/20. If the stocks are original to the gun it was probably made late in the 1910 decade, but several Forum members keep track of SN ranges and can probably get you closer to the exact year it shipped.

 

[Andy Griffith]

The other option would be to rebarrel it- sometimes 4" .38 Special barrels show up for fairly reasonable online. That is another option- and may actually be about the same as having a new crown cut and sight installed.

 

[Art Doc]

If it were mine that gun would remain as is. In its present condition it is a memento rather than a usable firearm. Restoring it would be very expensive. Doing so would also destroy the character and history of the gun.

If you want a gun to shoot then buy one in better shape. That would be much faster and cheaper.

If you want a keepsake, you have it. The gun is much more meaningful now than it would be if restored.

I would frame it with a photo of granddad and a photo of his ship.

 

[handejector]

If it were mine that gun would remain as is. In its present condition it is a memento rather than a usable firearm. Restoring it would be very expensive. Doing so would also destroy the character and history of the gun.

If you want a gun to shoot then buy one in better shape. That would be much faster and cheaper.

If you want a keepsake, you have it. The gun is much more meaningful now than it would be if restored.

I would frame it with a photo of granddad and a photo of his ship.

Excellent advice I could not have stated better.
ANYTHING you do to it leaves you with the same end result- a refinished/altered gun that has NO collector value, and does not even approacch the value of an orig, unaltered low grade shooter.

The value of that gun is the history of Grandpa using it, and the rightly attached sentimental value. A reblued/parked/rebarreled clunker ain't Granpappy's pistol any more, and you paid more than it's worth to destroy that personally historical piece!

 

[DCWilson]

With a serial number in the 220,000 range, it is a .38 Special. The .32-20 M&Ps didn't get much above 150,000.

A .38 with that serial number would be from about 1914-1915.

I agree with the others who are telling you to honor granddad by leaving it alone. If you want a gun like the one you propose to make, either find a two-inch .38 snubby from the 1940s or '50s, or find a different older M&P to modify as you want. As a practical matter, a gun manufactured after 1921 would have improved heat treating, which would make it a little more durable. Notice that there is an ejector rod locking lug under the barrel of your gun. To make a two-inch barrel from a longer one, you lose that locking lug, which makes the gun not as tight in an operational sense. In fact, a lot of WWII lend-lease revolvers were modified in exactly that way. If you find a two-inch .38 without a locking lug, the barrel has been shortened. It has also probably been converted from .38 S&W to .38 Special, which purists will tell you is not a good thing. If you find a two-inch M&P with a locking lug and a short ejector rod, it was designed that way and, if the action is sound, would be a reliable gun.

 

[dkees]

Leave it alone, Grandpa didn't think it needed refinishing.

It has his character and is a class piece of machinery.

Just sayin.

 

[The Gila Bender]

A buddy of mine has a bunch of wall hangers in his home office, "crime guns" confiscated by New Orleans PD many years ago. None of them are particularly collectible, but they share a common story: They were used against my buddy's uncle, who was a N.O. police officer in the 50's-60's. All have evidence hang tags. Just looking at them conjures all sorts of images of old New Orleans.

I have my grandad's pocket pistol that he carried when he was a conductor for the Great Northern RR out of Havre, MT. He wasn't a gun guy but he had to have one when the train carried mail, so he bought a cheap Saturday Night Special from a co-worker. Its pure junk but it sparked my interest in revolvers. So much so that I bought a 640-1 as my first concealed carry firearm and qualified for a CCW permit with it. Still have both and my interest in quality revolvers continues to grow.

So hang your grandad's revolver on the wall next to a photo of him and his tug boat. That will have much more value than money spent on restoration.

 

[kennyb]

i must agree with the other posters..leave the gun as is....

 

[mikepriwer]

Generally I'm not one for destroying history. However, in this case,
its not really history but rather a family momento that is involved.
This issue can get very personal, as one can tell from the response here.

My feeling is that I would, at the very least, deal with the cut barrel.
Since its not known when it was cut, who's to say that he did it the
day he got it ? Probably not, so perhaps during a good part of his
use of it, the barrel was uncut.

I would get the barrel fixed. Replacement barrels are available, but
of course their finish would not match the gun. Competent gunsmiths
like Dave Chicoine can repair that easily. It can be properly crowned,
and a replacement sight silver-solder on to it. That will help its
appearance immensely.

If it were mine, I would also get those grips recheckered. The wood
is incredibly nice, showing lots of grain definition. Keith Brown does
a wonderful job with that. Of course, they will look a lot nicer than
the rest of the gun, but that would be OK . They are such a nice piece
of wood that it would help the appearance of the gun.

I would also clean up the surface. Get some Corroision-X oil, or
Kroil, or WD-40, etc, and either some 0000 steel wool or burlap, and
get all the rust and discoloration off the surface. Just use lots of oil
when rubbing the surfaces.

Once you get it semi-presentable, then you can think about doing nothing
further to it, or think about getting it reblued. This, of course, makes it
look almost new, but its still his gun, and it would be in the condition
that he got it, decades ago.

Mike Priwer

 

[n4zov]

...............The value of that gun is the history of Grandpa using it, and the rightly attached sentimental value. A reblued/parked/rebarreled clunker ain't Granpappy's pistol any more, and you paid more than it's worth to destroy that personally historical piece!

I completely agree. The wear and tear - even the shortened barrel - come from your grandfather's use of the gun. Keep it as it is. Let me suggest that instead of having the gun reworked that you document your grandfather's life by interviewing your grandmother and let her talk about his life. Gather photos and document his service on the tug. That combined with his revolver will be something you can pass on to future generations. Good luck!

 

[Jim Watson]

I'm with Mike; I would get a front sight put back on.
I would want to be able to shoot Grandpa's Gun with some hopes of hitting something. No need to pretty up otherwise, though.
My Dad had a similar sawn off Police Positive Special but with the sight remounted, you could even see the heat colors where it was soldered on and the gun not refnished.

 

[ajbaker]

Thank you for all of the replies. I am not going to refinish it at all after reading the replies and thinking about it.

As for the barrell, whoever cut it didn't even cut it straight so I have to at least make that right in order to shoot it. If a smith is going to straighten the cut, he would at least recrown it. At that point I might as well have him put a front sight on it.

Any suggestions on a front sight that would work well?

Thanks again for all of the replies and information,

Aaron

 

[dant]

Having been in the "refinishing " business for many years, this gun, as said above falls into the 'unique' catagory of 'family provenance/history', and I too would tell you to NOT 'refinish' the gun, yes, if the barrel is cut crooked (you sad bad job) then the ONLY thing I would say is "make it square,even" and recut the crown so it will at least SHOOT straight...as for the sight, we've seen MANY old S&W , as well as Colt single action armies that were used as 'work guns' and have NO front sights on them, they do work and can shoot well to the guys who had them..........
wish you were around here, I'd make the muzzle (crown) look and work proper...ANY good 'smith should be able to at least do that for you, the rest, leave 'er be, its 'history'....... may grandpa rest in Peace...............
Merry Christmas