Reloading 38spl

[Porc1148]

I am reloading 38special for my smith model 19. I am loading for target shooting. I started with new star line brass and Mag tec 158 grain round nose bullets over 3.4 grains of hp38. My problem comes when I seat the bullet it shaves part of the lead around the rim of the case. I tried adjusting the flare but nothing seems to work. The bullets all chamber ok with no jams or hang ups. Is this normal using lead bullets? Should I try plated or jacketed? Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[derek45auto]

try more flare

 

[OKFC05]

First check that you have the round nose punch in your seater die.

Then flare a case, take it out of the machine and set a bullet on it. Looking from the top, there should be a small ring of flared case showing around the bullet base. Adjust as needed.
When seating, hold the bullet vertically inside the flare ring...watch your fingers!

 

[bigggbbruce]

Reduce the amount you crimp.

When to much crimp it will tighten up the case on the bullet before it's fully seated shaving lead just like this.

 

[joe44va]

You may want to try crimping as a separate step.

 

[SLT223]

Is the case mouth actually belling when you go to flare it?

 

[Wee Hooker]

Reduce the amount you crimp.

When to much crimp it will tighten up the case on the bullet before it's fully seated shaving lead just like this.

Crimp would also be my guess. If it's not too much crimp, your die may be adjusted so that the crimp process starts two early in the cycle. Readjust your dies per factory instructions and try again.
Bottom line is that cast 158 gr heads have been loaded into the straight walled 38 spl cases by the trillions over the years. No need to change components.

 

[daniel lawecki]

Size cast measure in ID then measure Od of said bullet. If you are flaring case and still having shaved lead then bullet fit may be the problem but I would rather have more case tension less.

 

[ontargetagain]

Something isn't right if you can't get the case mouth to flare? Do you have the die set correctly to start with as far as depth? Sooner or later you should get flare or extreme flaring. Check for proper set up of die in press for flaring step.
Karl

 

[glenwolde]

I take it that the lead is shaving up near the ogive of the bullet, not at the base. The flare would be an issue if it was shaving lead of the base as the bullet was seated.

If it's shaving off further up the bullet, it probably is the crimp. I looked at that bullet and there does not appear to be much of a crimp groove, if any.

Consider that the bullet is still moving as the crimp is closing. If there is little or no groove to accommodate the case mouth as it crimps in it will shave the bullet.

The seat and crimp in separate steps is a good suggestion, see if that clears it up. A lot of reloaders will seat and crimp in separate steps as a matter of habit.

Here's the Magtech I think you are using, and a cast 158 gr SWC where you can see a substantial crimp groove is provided.

Of course with no crimp groove, you can't give it much of a crimp. You may not shave lead, but you'll still deform the bullet. When there's no crimp groove present I usually use a taper crimp. Oh Boy! Something else to buy!

 

[robert1804]

Some dies these days use a stepped expander. The actual flaring part is another 2/32" or so past this step. If your die has a threaded expander plug, remove it and look closely for this step. An unflared case from this type of expander die will easily shave a sliver of lead.

 

[BC38]

...Of course with no crimp groove, you can't give it much of a crimp. You may not shave lead, but you'll still deform the bullet. When there's no crimp groove present I usually use a taper crimp. Oh Boy! Something else to buy!

So I was curious about this. Xtreme plated bullets have a VERY slight cannelure. I've been using a medium roll crimp anyway. Not enough to crack the plating, but not a light roll crimp either.

To my way of thinking this will make a bit of a ring-shaped indent around the bullet, but I don't see where this is a problem. I figured it would be little or no different than a factory cannelure - which is a ring-shaped indent around the bullet.

So what am I missing here? What is the issue with sort of "putting your own cannelure" in the bullet by giving the case a medium or even heavy roll crimp?

 

[Nevada Ed]

I use the Mag-Tech 158gr LRN without any problems.

Adjust your die to flare your case to where you can actually see it, don't be skimpy about it, this bullet is soft and needs room to slide into the case.

I use a OAL of 1.55" with this bullet design.... it is not a WC that can get away with just 1.48" of OAL and still work.

Your crimping die needs to be adjusted to where it crimps in the last .04" of the final movement. If you mark you base unit and your die........ a light to heavy crimp on my RCBS unit will only measure 3/4 of an inch, with the thread movements.

I have used a light to heavy crimp with this bullet with over eight powders and it has worked well for me in snubs to 6" barrels, from 525 fps to 1024 fps.

Good luck getting those dies set correctly.

 

[bigggbbruce]

So what am I missing here? What is the issue with sort of "putting your own cannelure" in the bullet by giving the case a medium or even heavy roll crimp?

The issue is that a heavy crimp closes the neck down while the bullet is still being seated causing it to shave lead.

My lesson was with 45ACP. Using Berry's 230gr plated I tried to crimp the neck from .471 down to .469 I started getting rounds with coating and lead above the rim and fail to feed because of it.

Reduced my crimp and never have the issue anymore.

The press applies significant leverage. It doesn't take much to roll the neck in. Back off your die and use a light touch for crimp.

 

[Steve C]

The case belling die does 2 functions. 1. It expands the ID of the sized case to accept the bullet and it flares the case mouth to allow the bullet to enter the case without crushing the case or shaving the bullet. As others have mentioned, you need to add enough bell to avoid shaving the bullet.

 

[gibekim]

case length also matters

I agree with the previous posts that suggest that the shaving is a result of the the roll crimp being to heavy. You may also want to measure several of you cases to see the variants in case length. 38 specials cases can vary from 1.145 to 1.155 in length.
The longer cases will shave more lead when the crimping edge in the die begins to contact the case mouth. Good and consistent roll crimps require cases of the same length. Sort your brass or try trimming them.

 

[BC38]

The issue is that a heavy crimp closes the neck down while the bullet is still being seated causing it to shave lead.

My lesson was with 45ACP. Using Berry's 230gr plated I tried to crimp the neck from .471 down to .469 I started getting rounds with coating and lead above the rim and fail to feed because of it.

Reduced my crimp and never have the issue anymore.

The press applies significant leverage. It doesn't take much to roll the neck in. Back off your die and use a light touch for crimp.

I guess I should have mentioned I'm crimping in a separate step with the Lee Factory Crimp Dies.

The seat-and-crimp-in-one-step idea doesn't make sense to me. Trying to crimp the case while at the same time still pushing the bullet further into the case just seems like a recipe for frustration. Maybe less so with a taper crimp, but certainly with a roll crimp.

So, then, if done as a separate step, what is the problem with roll crimping bullets with no cannelure - or is there even a problem with doing that?

 

[LostintheOzone]

You may want to try crimping as a separate step.

I think this will solve your problem. I had the same problem with 45 acp LRN. Seater/crimp dies can sometimes be hard to adjust. I just do them in separate operations to avoid the hassle. I use an adjustable crimp die. I'm not a big fan of seating and crimping at the same time.

 

[Nevada Ed]

When you get everything ironed out..................
your load should look close to this one. ( medium crimp )

 

[glenwolde]

So I was curious about this. Xtreme plated bullets have a VERY slight cannelure. I've been using a medium roll crimp anyway. Not enough to crack the plating, but not a light roll crimp either.

To my way of thinking this will make a bit of a ring-shaped indent around the bullet, but I don't see where this is a problem. I figured it would be little or no different than a factory cannelure - which is a ring-shaped indent around the bullet.

So what am I missing here? What is the issue with sort of "putting your own cannelure" in the bullet by giving the case a medium or even heavy roll crimp?

If all your cases are of the same brand, mileage, and length it might work fine. But if case length or thickness varies at all then the cannelure you're creating will vary. Variation in that will cause variation in the tightness of the crimp and pressures, and hence accuracy. Now it may not be enough to notice in most cases given all the other variables, but the theory is sound.

If there's no crimp groove I always use a taper crimp.