Kelly Green
Member
I've never heard of a round exploding as it's being ejected, especially from a S&W.
Round explodes while Ridgefield officer clears gun | The Columbian
Round explodes while Ridgefield officer clears gun | The Columbian
Round explodes while clearing S&W .40
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losingle
Member
I'm not sure I believe it. Clearing a semi-auto must have happen millions of times a day. Will someone explain how that could happen?
He pulled the trigger.
OP
Kelly Green
Member
Yup, that's what I was thinking. Accidental discharged labeled a freak accident.
badguybuster
Member
Yup. Sounds about right
Agreed, sounds like he pulled the trigger.
I don't have a pistol but I've been researching for one. I've read that if you pull the slide back too quickly and all the planets align perfectly, the ejector can strike the primer and cause a discharge. Is this possible, or just an old wive's tale?
By the way, once I scrape enough pennies together I'm gettin' an M&P 40c.
By the way, once I scrape enough pennies together I'm gettin' an M&P 40c.
scooter123
Member
A falling round that has the primer hit a small pebble or sharp corner on a rock can, on rare occasions, discharge. However, the casing of one of these types of discharges has a rather distinctive ballooning.
Personally, I'll agree with everyone else in that the officer pulled the trigger unless or until pictures of that discharged rounds are published.
Personally, I'll agree with everyone else in that the officer pulled the trigger unless or until pictures of that discharged rounds are published.
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Since an honest answer out of anyone who just had such an embarrassing thing happen is likely not forthcoming, S&W will be blamed, they will buy Glocks because "it won't happen with those."
No, I would be willing to bet that this guy tried to clear his weapon in such a way that the round's primer slammed into the ejector, a known issue for which there is a clear warning in the owner's manual.
What is pathetic is that this abecedarian is the "range officer." That speaks volumes.
Reminds me of that federal agent in a class room full of kids who announced he was the only one in the room competent to handle a firearm right before he proceeded to negligently shoot himself with his own gun in front of a class room full of kids. Moron.
If this reported instance involves a live round detonating in the open ejection port of the duty weapon, while the user was unloading the weapon, it's something I've heard armorers warned about in armorer classes.
It's not uncommon in armorer classes to hear warnings against covering the ejection port of a pistol with any part of your hand when unloading the barrel's chamber. (Meaning like how some people seem to think they should try to catch the ejected live round as it clears the ejection port.)
The reason for the warning against this practice is because if the live round being extracted/ejected from the chamber slips off the extractor while the slide is being pulled to the rear, and the rear of the case tips the wrong way, it's possible for the ejector to make contact with the primer cup.
If this happens hard enough, like when the slide is being energetically yanked rearward, it's possible for the ejector to act as a firing pin if the round shifts so the ejector hits the primer cup.
In one of my armorer classes they showed a picture of someone from a police agency who had his fingers seriously injured while he was reportedly trying to catch the live round being unloaded from the chamber. When the primer went off, the case was exposed in the open ejection port under his fingers (not contained within a chamber, as intended during firing of the round). Shrapnel. Really nasty injury.
Since first hearing those warnings in some classes over the years, I've always slowly retracted the slides to extract/eject chambered rounds, tipping the slide to the right (away from me), and NOT covering the ejection port with any part of my hand (especially fingers), so the live round is helped to fall free by gravity. It falls free of the slide with the ejection port facing away from me (into a safe direction/area), and with the ejected round landing on a soft surface.
A safer unloading practice can be used to try and help prevent this sort of thing.
It reminds me of the time I was in the locker room when one of the guys tossed his duffel bag into the bottom of his locker ... and not gently. There was a muted pop. Opening the bag, we found several loose .357 Magnum rounds in the bottom of the bag ... as well as an empty case, a loose bullet, and a lot of burned & unburned powder. It was apparently just one of those rare instances where one of the loose Magnum rounds he had in the bottom of his duffel somehow managed to have its primer come into contact with something when he threw the bag into his locker, in just the right manner to set it off.
It's not uncommon in armorer classes to hear warnings against covering the ejection port of a pistol with any part of your hand when unloading the barrel's chamber. (Meaning like how some people seem to think they should try to catch the ejected live round as it clears the ejection port.)
The reason for the warning against this practice is because if the live round being extracted/ejected from the chamber slips off the extractor while the slide is being pulled to the rear, and the rear of the case tips the wrong way, it's possible for the ejector to make contact with the primer cup.
If this happens hard enough, like when the slide is being energetically yanked rearward, it's possible for the ejector to act as a firing pin if the round shifts so the ejector hits the primer cup.
In one of my armorer classes they showed a picture of someone from a police agency who had his fingers seriously injured while he was reportedly trying to catch the live round being unloaded from the chamber. When the primer went off, the case was exposed in the open ejection port under his fingers (not contained within a chamber, as intended during firing of the round). Shrapnel. Really nasty injury.
Since first hearing those warnings in some classes over the years, I've always slowly retracted the slides to extract/eject chambered rounds, tipping the slide to the right (away from me), and NOT covering the ejection port with any part of my hand (especially fingers), so the live round is helped to fall free by gravity. It falls free of the slide with the ejection port facing away from me (into a safe direction/area), and with the ejected round landing on a soft surface.
A safer unloading practice can be used to try and help prevent this sort of thing.
It reminds me of the time I was in the locker room when one of the guys tossed his duffel bag into the bottom of his locker ... and not gently. There was a muted pop. Opening the bag, we found several loose .357 Magnum rounds in the bottom of the bag ... as well as an empty case, a loose bullet, and a lot of burned & unburned powder. It was apparently just one of those rare instances where one of the loose Magnum rounds he had in the bottom of his duffel somehow managed to have its primer come into contact with something when he threw the bag into his locker, in just the right manner to set it off.
Printer
US Veteran
I have heard of that before. The best way to find out is to check the primer indent. It is possible that while pulling the slide to the rear that the extractor lost control of the round as it was pulling it rearward out of the chamber and it might have hit the top round in the mag and went right into the ejector and it went off. The expended rnd. would show that by the indent mark. Bob St.George
HotRoderX
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The only other thing I could think of is a extremely delayed fire or perhaps a miss seated primer? I say delayed fire because once a round has been hit and the primer does not go off there always the possibility it might. That would also beg the question of why the deputy had a misfired round loaded in his gun. I would find it kinda hard to believe the gun was at fault. Thought lately 40cal Smith and Wesson's seem to be grabbing a lot of attention on this forum for issues.
jdesro1911
Member
Yes, it happens. Usually the result of the primer hitting the ejector as the slide is being drawn quickly rearward. For some reason, .40's seem more prone to it, but it can happen with any caliber.
It is somewhat rare, but I have heard about it often enough, and seen the photos of mangled fingers, to make sure I keep my hand clear of the ejection port when ejecting any live rounds.
It is somewhat rare, but I have heard about it often enough, and seen the photos of mangled fingers, to make sure I keep my hand clear of the ejection port when ejecting any live rounds.
TexasG
US Veteran
I hear ya Fastbolt and I would never discount anything you post and appreciate your precise diagnosis.... but - This reads like another "manufactured crisis" to "scare" the public....
Delos
Member
Clearing a 40
So what is "Police Protocol for clearing a 40"
All it says is they were outside the station.
All that we know for sure is that he should remove the magazine so as to not accentally load another round.
And with the magazine removed their is no support below the cartridge as it is being ejected.
If they do not want the cartridge caught, by tilting to right and catching it with fingers, what exactly do they want. Do they have a padded box to dump them in?
Do they dump the live cartridge out the handle?
So what is "Police Protocol for clearing a 40"
All it says is they were outside the station.
All that we know for sure is that he should remove the magazine so as to not accentally load another round.
And with the magazine removed their is no support below the cartridge as it is being ejected.
If they do not want the cartridge caught, by tilting to right and catching it with fingers, what exactly do they want. Do they have a padded box to dump them in?
Do they dump the live cartridge out the handle?
Delos
Member
Unloading a 40
Thank you. I should have read this before posting.
If this reported instance involves a live round detonating in the open ejection port of the duty weapon, while the user was unloading the weapon, it's something I've heard armorers warned about in armorer classes.
It's not uncommon in armorer classes to hear warnings against covering the ejection port of a pistol with any part of your hand when unloading the barrel's chamber. (Meaning like how some people seem to think they should try to catch the ejected live round as it clears the ejection port.)
The reason for the warning against this practice is because if the live round being extracted/ejected from the chamber slips off the extractor while the slide is being pulled to the rear, and the rear of the case tips the wrong way, it's possible for the ejector to make contact with the primer cup.
If this happens hard enough, like when the slide is being energetically yanked rearward, it's possible for the ejector to act as a firing pin if the round shifts so the ejector hits the primer cup.
In one of my armorer classes they showed a picture of someone from a police agency who had his fingers seriously injured while he was reportedly trying to catch the live round being unloaded from the chamber. When the primer went off, the case was exposed in the open ejection port under his fingers (not contained within a chamber, as intended during firing of the round). Shrapnel. Really nasty injury.
Since first hearing those warnings in some classes over the years, I've always slowly retracted the slides to extract/eject chambered rounds, tipping the slide to the right (away from me), and NOT covering the ejection port with any part of my hand (especially fingers), so the live round is helped to fall free by gravity. It falls free of the slide with the ejection port facing away from me (into a safe direction/area), and with the ejected round landing on a soft surface.
A safer unloading practice can be used to try and help prevent this sort of thing.
It reminds me of the time I was in the locker room when one of the guys tossed his duffel bag into the bottom of his locker ... and not gently. There was a muted pop. Opening the bag, we found several loose .357 Magnum rounds in the bottom of the bag ... as well as an empty case, a loose bullet, and a lot of burned & unburned powder. It was apparently just one of those rare instances where one of the loose Magnum rounds he had in the bottom of his duffel somehow managed to have its primer come into contact with something when he threw the bag into his locker, in just the right manner to set it off.
Thank you. I should have read this before posting.
We put a sand-filled 55 gal clearing/loading barrel at the range for people to use for this purpose. It catches the ejected live round without it having to hit the concrete (in addition to serving as a safe backstop for any potential unintentional discharges - ND's).
Out on the firing lines they can allow any ejected live rounds to fall to the sand or grass.
If ejecting a live round at a shooting station with a table, I'd make sure the round could fall into a clear spot on the table (no open boxes/trays of live ammo). I've not seen, myself, but have heard reports of ejected empty (fired) cases landing on an open tray of live rounds (primers up) and hitting a primer, causing a round to go off.
Naturally, proper muzzle & trigger safety has to be maintained while focusing on the task of unloading the chamber.
Different ranges may have their own preferences or rules, too.
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Well, folks can get concerned whenever they hear about unintentional discharges of firearms, especially in the hands of, and being manipulated by, LE.
I know it's certainly gotten my attention, and been not a little "scary", when someone has experienced a ND in close proximity to me.
It can happen
Been there, working the line, saw one happen; also have seen dropped rounds go off at least 4 times as well. You can tell students all day long not to cover the ejection port with their hand when clearing a gun, but some refuse to listen. They put grasping groves on the slide for a reason. I guess bending down to pick up the ejected round after the line is safe is too much work.....
I will say that it was a Sig 228. Have never seen it happen with a Beretta, due to the open top of the slide not having a surface to catch the front of the bullet and drive it back. Military guys seem to be big on catching the chambered round, not sure why.
Been there, working the line, saw one happen; also have seen dropped rounds go off at least 4 times as well. You can tell students all day long not to cover the ejection port with their hand when clearing a gun, but some refuse to listen. They put grasping groves on the slide for a reason. I guess bending down to pick up the ejected round after the line is safe is too much work.....
I will say that it was a Sig 228. Have never seen it happen with a Beretta, due to the open top of the slide not having a surface to catch the front of the bullet and drive it back. Military guys seem to be big on catching the chambered round, not sure why.
If this reported instance involves a live round detonating in the open ejection port of the duty weapon, while the user was unloading the weapon, it's something I've heard armorers warned about in armorer classes.
It's not uncommon in armorer classes to hear warnings against covering the ejection port of a pistol with any part of your hand when unloading the barrel's chamber. (Meaning like how some people seem to think they should try to catch the ejected live round as it clears the ejection port.)
The reason for the warning against this practice is because if the live round being extracted/ejected from the chamber slips off the extractor while the slide is being pulled to the rear, and the rear of the case tips the wrong way, it's possible for the ejector to make contact with the primer cup.
If this happens hard enough, like when the slide is being energetically yanked rearward, it's possible for the ejector to act as a firing pin if the round shifts so the ejector hits the primer cup.
In one of my armorer classes they showed a picture of someone from a police agency who had his fingers seriously injured while he was reportedly trying to catch the live round being unloaded from the chamber. When the primer went off, the case was exposed in the open ejection port under his fingers (not contained within a chamber, as intended during firing of the round). Shrapnel. Really nasty injury.
Since first hearing those warnings in some classes over the years, I've always slowly retracted the slides to extract/eject chambered rounds, tipping the slide to the right (away from me), and NOT covering the ejection port with any part of my hand (especially fingers), so the live round is helped to fall free by gravity. It falls free of the slide with the ejection port facing away from me (into a safe direction/area), and with the ejected round landing on a soft surface.
A safer unloading practice can be used to try and help prevent this sort of thing.
It reminds me of the time I was in the locker room when one of the guys tossed his duffel bag into the bottom of his locker ... and not gently. There was a muted pop. Opening the bag, we found several loose .357 Magnum rounds in the bottom of the bag ... as well as an empty case, a loose bullet, and a lot of burned & unburned powder. It was apparently just one of those rare instances where one of the loose Magnum rounds he had in the bottom of his duffel somehow managed to have its primer come into contact with something when he threw the bag into his locker, in just the right manner to set it off.
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