S&W factory trigger job vs. DIY Wolff springs

[Razorburn]

I'm trying to decide if I should send my M27 to S&W PC for their combat trigger job--or just buy Wolff springs from Brownells and DIY install. I've heard that the PC installs Wolff springs for their trigger job, plus they do stoning...but will stoning result in a *significantly* better trigger than if I just replace the springs myself and call it good?

Thanks.

 

[H Richard]

Yes, stoning will make a great difference. Replacing springs just takes less pressure to move the trigger. Stoning makes a "smooth" feel that enhances your trigger pull.

 

[PERAZZI]

properly stoning to remove burrs, on the proper surfaces, in addition to replacing springs, I like the Power ribbed mainsprings, and trigger return springs. will give you the greatest bang for your buck.

The trick is in having it done correctly and not done to excess....

 

[shawn mccarver]

I'm trying to decide if I should send my M27 to S&W PC for their combat trigger job--or just buy Wolff springs from Brownells and DIY install. I've heard that the PC installs Wolff springs for their trigger job, plus they do stoning...but will stoning result in a *significantly* better trigger than if I just replace the springs myself and call it good?

Thanks.

If the revolver is to be used for self-defense, then have S&W do it and tell them that is the purpose, as opposed to competition where a failure to fire will not get you dead.

Spring replacement alone does not a trigger job make.

 

[Hapworth]

If every moving part on your M27 is already butter smooth, you don't need an action job and the correctly chosen springs can lighten pull.

If every moving part on your M27 is NOT already butter smooth, lighter springs will magnify any felt grit, catch or hiccups in the action.

 

[tomcatt51]

I'm trying to decide...

I'd recommend getting Jerry Miculeks' "trigger Job" video and then deciding if this is something you want to get into. Yes, you can do much better than what S&W will do.
TRIGGER JOB | Brownells

 

[TAROMAN]

What Tomcatt said.
I used Jerry's DVD to great effect on a number of revolvers.
Also had the PC my NY-1. Its action was about the same as the ones I did myself.

 

[Berserker]

I have wondered, is it really that hard to polish or stone, yourself? Though I have read certain metal parts, you need to be careful not go through the top layer. I want to learn more about that. Probably get a book. I'd like to have a better understanding of cause and effect. I'd like a lighter DA pull, but my guns are for self defense or hunting.

I threw in a India fine stone, to a order I placed, and was thinking of trying it.

 

[garbler]

I have wondered, is it really that hard to polish or stone, yourself? Though I have read certain metal parts, you need to be careful not go through the top layer. I want to learn more about that. Probably get a book. I'd like to have a better understanding of cause and effect. I'd like a lighter DA pull, but my guns are for self defense or hunting.

I threw in a India fine stone, to a order I placed, and was thinking of trying it.

A few suggestions on this topic and warnings but I have no intentions of conducting a gunsmith class here. First a couple of springs is not an action job anymore than any other quick fix product. Wolf springs are okay for certain applications but keep in mind people trying to sell you drop in hands, or new and improved springs or a action job dipping solution are marketing a product to a public looking for something for free. There is a reason why gunsmiths go to school, spend so much on tools and parts and generally make just enough to keep the doors open most of the time. It's a skill and not a gimmick.

As for buying a couple of stones and going after your lock-work and riding surfaces all I can say is how will you know where to stone and how much. Are most of you proficient with a stone or file I mean good enough to work around a cocking notch ledge only .012-.014" deep and hold a true working surface ? Do most of you know how deep the case hardening is and how to deal with it ? How about the correct SA trigger bevel or the angular relief on the sear for a smooth DA . For repeatable close tolerance work like this there are fixtures and tools you can buy but they are not cheap and like most tools you still have to learn how to use them.

Books will show you pictures of this and so will a video but only a hands-on gunsmithing class will give you the ability to work on these parts without ruining your good gun and have somebody there to tell you when you have gone too far or getting close. I am not saying it is rocket science I am only saying that the really good mechanics generally learned from somebody else had to do so cause there are no shortcuts. Just cause you can buy a lathe and milling machine doesn't make you a machinist — it just gives you the ability to cut steel.

I have to say most people think a lighter trigger pull is an action job. They don't know any better cause they never had a gun with a real good action job that gives the shooter a revolver timed to the nuts, less cylinder drag, smooth and positive staging and a reliable 5-6 # DA pull with a loaded gun and 2.5# SA drop. An action job is all about reducing small amounts of drag and friction from every moving part without compromising the guns design and reliability. Some parts are only polished others are re-cut with new faces and angles to promote easier transfer of force or energy through the lock-work. A good job like a Ron Power action job involves the re-work of just about every moving part in the gun. There are no short cuts to a real action job.

Good luck

 

[Berserker]

They don't know any better cause they never had a gun with a real good action job

Good luck

Lots of good points. One problem for me is just not know where to go. It would be nice to have a local guy. But I don't know people that have trigger work done, to recommend a guy.

 

[garbler]

Lots of good points. One problem for me is just not know where to go. It would be nice to have a local guy. But I don't know people that have trigger work done, to recommend a guy.

I really don't know any of the local talent in your area. I do know Ron Power and Jim Clark are a couple of the go-to shops for first class competition revolvers but there are many others also. However you don't need that kind of service. What you need is a competent Smith & Wesson armorer who can make standard repairs and mods.

Good luck

 

[imashooter2]

My Performance Center 627 came with some very moderate polishing, a mainspring bent in the Miculek fashion and a stock rebound spring with coils clipped.

 

[hotrod150]

I do a very rudimentary "tune-up" on my j-frames. I install a lighter-weight rebound spring -- so far, the 13# Wolff has worked well on everything. And I use a fine arkansas stone to smooth out the rebound slide and the frame/sideplate surfaces where it rides. I do not have the knowledge or skill to mess with the trigger/hammer engagement surfaces, and for reliability's sake I do not replace the main spring. Midway sells a set of 3 Wolff 13# rebound springs for about $7, and a Norton fine arkansas stone for about $14. I'm sure a real trigger job by the S&W PC or a good revolversmith is way better, but my tuneup works for me & gives me pretty good bang for the buck.
Berserker, I originally bought a Norton fine India stone (Midway #342574) , and discovered that apparently "fine" is a relative term. It is way coarser than the fine arkansas stone (midway #537218) I bought next, which works pretty well. Bought the india stone because it was cheaper but (as often happens) that didn't work out as hoped for.

 

[cjw3]

I'd recommend getting Jerry Miculeks' "trigger Job" video and then deciding if this is something you want to get into. Yes, you can do much better than what S&W will do.
TRIGGER JOB | Brownells

This, and a Kuhnhausen manual.

You can do it

 

[Berserker]

I
Berserker, I originally bought a Norton fine India stone (Midway #342574) , and discovered that apparently "fine" is a relative term. .

Yep this is the one I bought, had a $50 gift card that had to get to $50.

 

[tomcatt51]

I originally bought a Norton fine India stone (Midway #342574) , and discovered that apparently "fine" is a relative term.

What I use most is a Norton fine India stone, 6 x 3/4 x 3/4, Norton # FF66. Nothing finer except for sear surfaces, then it's a fine ceramic stone.

Mostly, you're just smoothing surfaces. The fine Norton stone leaves a good enough surface finish that seems to retain oil nicely.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[hotrod150]

The "fine" india stone I ordered from Midway is a Norton FF14. Not what I'd call fine, but good for knocking stuff down. For smoothing the rebound slide surfaces.... not so much. The arkansas stone is very fine-- so fine, in fact, that it doesn't really feel like it's abrasive at all. But it does smooth things out after you rub for a while.

 

[stc1]

I'm trying to decide if I should send my M27 to S&W PC for their combat trigger job--or just buy Wolff springs from Brownells and DIY install. I've heard that the PC installs Wolff springs for their trigger job, plus they do stoning...but will stoning result in a *significantly* better trigger than if I just replace the springs myself and call it good?

Thanks.

Lots of good advice here and many different approaches. I work with stone polishing equipment in my job and one suggestion I have is to use a Jewelry rouge like Bam. it will smooth and polish without removing much material because of the fine particulates. It will also not alter the shape as will files and stones used aggressively. Having said this there is a simpler way to smooth the action if your willing to put the time into it - oil it and use it much. The metals used are designed to wear evenly when rubbing against each other (iron sharpeneth iron scenario). If you do use the latter method make sure you clean it from time to time. Oil attracts dust and can gum up the works internally.

 

[tomcatt51]

The "fine" india stone I ordered from Midway is a Norton FF14. Not what I'd call fine, but good for knocking stuff down. For smoothing the rebound slide surfaces.... not so much.

By "fine" I'm just going by what Norton calls it and is printed on the stone. The "fine" FF66 is what I use on rebound slides. Anything "finer" is pointless.

 

[tomcatt51]

one suggestion I have is to use a Jewelry rouge like Bam. it will smooth and polish without removing much material because of the fine particulates. It will also not alter the shape as will files and stones used aggressively.

I don't dis-agree but if you get into this you'll see there is a need for "more aggressive" things first. Run a rebound slide across a flat stone and you'll see why. The trigger/cylinder stop engagement surfaces come to mind also. Some CAREFULL use of a stone to round and shape square corners is necessary. Same applies to the rebound slide/hammer "nubs" that move the hammer back as the trigger resets.

Once that's done rouge will certainly nicely speed up the finer "wearing in" process.