Safety Hammerless revolver model of 91

[russwm]

I inherited a large collection of firearms from my father. I would greatly appreciate help identifying this cool little Smith and Wesson handgun. This is what I believe I’ve learned from research:

Safety Hammerless 5 shot revolver
Model of 91 (top of barrel)
Double action
3.25 inch barrel
.38 caliber
Top break
Serial number 118xxx ( bottom of handle and cylinder)
Finish: nickel with gold cylinder, trigger, and safety bar)

I would appreciate any information you can provide. I’m particularly interested in the exact model and manufacture date.

Thanks!

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


What you have is S&W .38 New Departure 4th Model. The barrel
is from another model. The Fourth Model started at serial number
116000 and the change over to the Fifth Model was somewhere
around 220000 (exact serial number is not known).

The barrel is from a S&W .38 Single Action 3rd Model (a.k.a. Model
of 91). The barrel latch is from the fourth or possibly fifth model
New Departure.

Now the question is: did S&W put that barrel on it? Look behind
the barrel latch into the cutouts for the frame posts and look for
the serial number. If the serial number matches, then it is a Factory
installed barrel. There is also a serial number stamped on the
underside of the barrel latch and on the back of the cylinder.
These should all match the serial number on the frame to be
all original.

Also, does the serial number have a star stamped after it? If so,
it means it went back ti the Factory for repair and/or refinishing.
Depending on when it was sent back, there could be a number
stamped under the grip panel that would be the date it was re-
ceived by the Factory for said repair/refinishing.


Cheers!
Webb

 

[russwm]

Thanks wlw-19958 for the very helpful reply! I’ve found the serial number at 3 locations. They are identical, and no star after them.

I’ve uploaded 3 new photos to show the serial number locations.

Am I correct that this model would have been manufactured sometime around 1900? Any guesstimate of possible value? I’m not interested in selling it, but it’s interesting to know.

Thanks again!

 

[Boulder350]

There is a serial number on the barrel. It resides on the flat or flats where the latch rotates. Its hard to see, you need to lift the latch to see it better.

I have a 38 double action with a model of 91 barrel marking on the barrel. The serial number on the barrel matches the double action frame. I have seen 3 or 4 like that, but only on double actions.

 

[iby]

unusual.............

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


I don't own a .38 New Departure 4th Model but I have a .38 SA
2nd Model (which has a similar barrel). Here are some pics for
you to see where to look for the serial number on the barrel.
you have to lift the barrel latch to see it clearly.



Cheers!
Webb

 

[russwm]

Boulder350, thanks for that information. It looks like the number on the barrel is different. I'm uploading another photo showing the numbers on the cylinder and latch, which match, and the different number on the barrel. Assuming I understand correctly. Hahaha!

 

[russwm]

New photo added. Serial number on the latch and cylinder 118,008.

The other number on the barrel is difficult to read but is 5013.

What would have been the advantage of using the barrel from a Model of 91 in place of the normal barrel? Is it possible that it came with a different length barrel and a previous owner simply switched them because he wanted a shorter barrel?

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


Make sure you check Both right and left barrel flats for numbers.
Normally, the barrel serial number is stamped on the right-hand
barrel flat (like my pic). There is a slight possibility that your barrel
was a Factory take-off that was re-used on another revolver. If this
is the case, S&W will stamp another serial number on the left-hand
barrel flat.


Cheers!
Webb


Edit: You posted you pic while I was typing this reply.
Unfortunately, it appears that the barrel is an non-
Factory barrel swap.

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


To answer a couple of your questions, I would say your revolver
was probably made in 1898. The value is subjective. The New
Departure generally is not a high value collectable (unless it
has unusual markings or a rare barrel length).


The barrel was change for a couple of possible reasons. It could
have been to change from one length to another or to replace a
barrel with a badly corroded bore.


Cheers!
Webb

 

[russwm]

Thanks! I really appreciate everyone’s time in responding to my questions.

 

[Modelof1891]

5013 BARREL ASSY. 1891

New photo added. Serial number on the latch and cylinder 118,008.

The other number on the barrel is difficult to read but is 5013.

What would have been the advantage of using the barrel from a Model of 91 in place of the normal barrel? Is it possible that it came with a different length barrel and a previous owner simply switched them because he wanted a shorter barrel?

Your barrel being 5013 is interesting ... the number 5001 was shipped Dec 8 1893 as a combo set and the number 5023 was also shipped as a combo set.

 

[Boulder350]

Terry,

Have you seen a Model of 91 barrel on a safety hammerless that has a serial number that matches the frame?

I have records of 4 DA revolvers and 1 barrel only that are marked model of 91 with the frame and barrel serial numbers that match. The serial numbers range from 320,xxx to 345,xxx.

 

[Modelof1891]

Safety Hammerless revolver model of 1891

I have not seen the 1891 revolver barrel or the single shot on the hammerless frame before. I do have some on the DA frame, seems like around the serial number 299, to 319,000. But I have not seen any with matching numbers.
One that I own has no shipping records from the factory.

 

[BMur]

Miss-matched

Mark,
I’m not sure if I gave you my info.
Anyway, I have a 38 New Departure with a model of 91 barrel. It is miss-matched in my notes.
Serial number 123924,60%N, action works well, HR grips, 3 1/4” bbl.
I don’t list the serial number on the barrel but I did note that it’s a low number. Might be some odd pattern here.


**** Barrel is 1023
Murph

 

[Boulder350]

Murph,

Thanks for Sharing. Your barrel number and Model of 91 marking is interesting. There was a transition on the early Model of 91 revolver barrels from just having patents only to the Model of 91 markings. Your barrel serial number is on the front end of the transition. Single shot barrels don't count in these numbers, just revolver barrels. Here is what I have:

42 patents only 3.25" barrel
487 patents only 3.25"
888 patents only 3.25"
1363 patents only 3.25"
1463 Model of 91 4" - I own this one and the barrel matches frame
1839 patents only 4"
1972 patents only 6"
2611 Model of 91 4"
2747 Model of 91 4"
2790 patents only 3.25" - I own this one and the barrel matches frame
2882 patents only 6"
All the rest wear Model of 91 until...
22530 patents only and 6" barrel
22970 patents only and 6" barrel
26606 patents only and 6" barrel

 

[BMur]

Photos

I’ll post photos next week. Busy week for me and through the weekend. Still trying to set up a day at the range.

Murph