sd9ve lifetime

[noro]

Wellarmed,

Didn't want to go off half cocked on a vendor that I know nothing about. I don't have any experience with the vendor or their products. Why go off on a major aftermarket S&W vendor
because one of their techs spouted nonsense in a video?

From what I understand, These people have a large business
supplying aftermarket parts for S&W pistols to improve trigger
function. Now, their products might be great, good or fair but
they are highly regarded with S&W polymer enthusiasts, so why
cause a problem for them, if I don't know what I'm talking about?

JMHO. the SD9VE is a great pistol - period. It's value enhanced
(plastic parts, stiff trigger) for a reason. It's made to provide a
entry level polymer pistol at the lowest possible price by a
great maker who stands behind it.

Its certainly not a 2.0 or even a 1.0, but works well for its
intended purpose - SD. A lot of guys love them and they
seem to hold up well in the few cases that forum owners have responded with high round counts.


A so-called internet expert claimed these pistols have a 4000
round life which I just couldn"t believe. In that case, why buy his aftermarket parts if your pistol will be shot out within a year of average shooting? Shoot a 100 rounds a week, and your new
SD9VE is junk. (5200 rounds) so he claimed. I only wanted to see if any problems existed with SD9VE's beyond 5000+ rounds. All I can say is to go to youtube and check out the SD9VE videos. You'll find it within the top ten. I certainly don't want
to get into in to a war with a vendor that I haven't done business with. I think (JMHO) his tech is full of it. What makes it bad is that he represents a major aftermarket S&W parts supplier.

 

[mrchuck]

I still have my SW40c. That is he model that S&W copied a Glock 100% and S&W just about went out of business as Glock sued them and won.
Still a great pistol to shoot and travel with as a car gun.

 

[BlueArch91]

So someone from Apex or Galloway said it. There is no war. It probably was a poorly worded off hand comment. Still I and others were made curious by your post and just wanted to watch it without having to go on a quest.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Echo40]

I don't own a Sigma series pistol, but the SD40VE is currently under consideration as my next Winter Carry gun, so I've been doing research on it and as near as I can figure, reports of parts breaking are the exception to the rule which only appear deceptively common because few folks actually bother to run their SD/VE pistols that hard, ergo the cases in which someone happened to put a lot of rounds through their pistol then experienced some sort of breakage/mechanical failure tend to stand out more.
Furthermore, it's unfortunate, but folks are always more likely to comment when something goes wrong than give praise when everything goes smoothly, so there are likely many folks out there with thousands of trouble-free rounds through their SD/VE who take it for granted.

Sadly, there are a lot of low-priced pistols out their which have undeserved reputations for being of poor quality for that very reason, because folks place way too much faith in the old adage; "You get what you paid for." and thus consider anything inexpensive to be of inherently poor quality, which just isn't true. In fact, advances in modern technology have rendered the saying increasingly obsolete over the past few decades, as the production costs of firearms manufacturing have decreased substantially on the lower end of the spectrum, but folks fail to recognize this due to the declining state of the economy and subsequent inflation.
The result is that a whole lot of value-priced firearms (with the emphasis on value) are often overlooked or underappreciated, and it most certainly doesn't help matters that there are still a lot of ignorant people out there who honestly continue to cling to the belief that polymer, MIM, and even aluminum alloys simply cannot hold up to a lifetime of use despite all evidence to the contrary, ergo they jump at the chance to point out any instance of a polymer/alloy-framed firearm has a part break on it in order to support their erroneous assertions.

At the end of the day, only two things really need to be considered;
a.) There simply is not enough data to adequately confirm or debunk the probably of breakage on SD/VE pistols because those who actually put tens of thousands of rounds through them are apparently in the minority.
b.) The SD/VE is covered under S&W Lifetime Warranty, ergo even if it does break, they'll either repair or replace it for you, so unless you intend to put thousands of magazines worth of ammo through your SD/VE then continue carrying it without periodically replacing parts or otherwise examining them for signs of wear, then you have very little to worry about.

As previously stated, the SD40VE is currently in the running alongside other value-priced pistols including the even cheaper, less robust Ruger EC9s for my next Winter Carry pistol, and I honestly see no compelling evidence to suggest that either should fail after thousands of rounds, much less the more realistic amount of shooting the average person would do with a value-priced carry pistol to determine reliability/PoI.

 

[BlueArch91]

Love my SD9VE. That being said we are seeing 4" M&P 2.0 Compacts on line for $349. If you are getting your SD on sale for $269 then I might see value. Anything over $300 get the M&P. Once I added my Talon grip and Apex Trigger I am right around the sale price 2.0.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[noro]

Blue Arch,

These are my thoughts also. The SD/VE is a great weapon at a
price point. Its not a M&P 2.0 or a 1.0. If you want it to perform
at that level, you have to modify it (more than likely with Apex)

If you take it for what it is in stock form, and get used to the stock
factory trigger, its more than adequate for self-defense. Should you start to modify it, the mods will take it into 2.0 territory as
you pointed out costwise.

My personal opinion (and that's all it is) is that if the S&W triggers are so bad, why didn't the factory fix it, instead of letting aftermarket sellers get involved? Sure, Apex and Galloway will improve the triggers but at what cost to you?

Mine is approaching 2500 rounds with no problems at all.
Want to see what happens at the "magical" 4000 rounds
that Galloway claims major failures will occur. Have to point out
that I also have the M&P 2.0 and 1.0 so no stranger to the modern
S&W auto lineup.

 

[Steve912]

Want to see what happens at the "magical" 4000 rounds
that Galloway claims major failures will occur. Have to point out
that I also have the M&P 2.0 and 1.0 so no stranger to the modern
S&W auto lineup.

Wait--the gallstones who cranked out the "upgrade" recoil
spring assembly (that was so poorly designed, that it
broke parts of the SD frame) are the bozos saying the
pistol has a 4K round-life?

Maybe they mean "pistol may last up to four thousand rounds,
when using our replacement parts."

 

[BlueArch91]

Finally saw the video. Galloway Precision Spring Kit Installation if anyone cares to watch. The 4000 round comment comes at the end of the video if anyone cares to watch.

It is interesting that in the comments a viewer gets very defensive which puts the guy in the video on the defense, "what do I know I only do this for a living." He claims that the information comes from S&W. Interesting it does seem to relate to the issues that the pistol was having with the Galloway guide rod.

I know mechanical things need maintenance and do break. I also know if this pistol had a 4000 round service life and a lifetime warranty S&W could expect to rebuild quite a few pistols.

I am not terribly concerned given their reputation for honoring their warranty. I would have thought if they really had stated a service life on this firearm it would be common knowledge. Let's face it that is a frequent topic in these forums and videos especially when comparing to more expensive duty pistols.

I might just drop their customer service a line and see what they have to say so I can figure out when I need to send mine in for a complete rebuild.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MRSpivey]

Finally saw the video. Galloway Precision Spring Kit Installation if anyone cares to watch. The 4000 round comment comes at the end of the video if anyone cares to watch.

It is interesting that in the comments a viewer gets very defensive which puts the guy in the video on the defense, "what do I know I only do this for a living." He claims that the information comes from S&W. Interesting it does seem to relate to the issues that the pistol was having with the Galloway guide rod.

I know mechanical things need maintenance and do break. I also know if this pistol had a 4000 round service life and a lifetime warranty S&W could expect to rebuild quite a few pistols.

I am not terribly concerned given their reputation for honoring their warranty. I would have thought if they really had stated a service life on this firearm it would be common knowledge. Let's face it that is a frequent topic in these forums and videos especially when comparing to more expensive duty pistols.

I might just drop their customer service a line and see what they have to say so I can figure out when I need to send mine in for a complete rebuild.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would be interested in what S&W customer service has to say! Please let us know.

 

[BlueArch91]

I would be interested in what S&W customer service has to say! Please let us know.

I will! The question has been asked. If it is 4000, my next question is what is the M&P?

More than anything else, what bothers me about the Galloway statement is that since this is a self defense pistol it is not meant to be shot much. That flies in the face of training. Also, "It's not a range gun," that flies in the face of V for value.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Echo40]

I always love it when the best comeback someone can muster when someone calls something they've said into question or poses a convincing argument against a statement they've made is; "I only do this for a living." or something to that effect.

Honestly, what does that even mean? Everyone does something for a living! Is everyone who works suddenly a master of their craft? I mean, yeah, I've heard that it was more difficult to get hired these days, but last time I checked you didn't need a Master's Degree in the Culinary Arts to work at McDonald's, and something tells me that you don't have to be a Gunsmith with years of experience or past employment with Smith & Wesson, ergo the fact that he works for a company that makes aftermarket replacement parts of questionable necessity doesn't make him an authority on the SD/VE series.

It's also especially hilarious when someone is so blatantly full of beans that instead of simply citing the supposedly official statement by S&W that the SD/VE series has a service life of 4000 rounds, they resort to a flimsy attempt at using their position as an excuse for their lack of evidence.
Ah, but to be fair, maybe he's referring to the service life of an SD/VE with Galloway parts installed?

That being said, I can't wait to hear what Smith & Wesson has to say on the matter, especially if they have their own estimated service life for the SD/VE.

 

[sgtsandman]

Hi All,

Recently I picked up a new sd9ve and have no problems with it.
Started watching you tube videos on it. One video I've seen, shows the installation of parts by an aftermarket vendor to improve the trigger function.

Now, in the video, the tech mentions that the sd9ve only has a lifetime of 4000 rounds. I find this very hard to believe. Now,
if you shoot a 100 rounds a week, your sd9ve will be shot in a year. I certainly feel that the pistol will go way beyond this 4000 limit.

What do you guys think with high round counts?

I would say that round limit might be more for the recoil spring than anything else in the pistol. Around that round count, most guns need their recoil springs replaced.

 

[Mahalo_.32]

4K rounds is far too easy to accomplish. I know a few guys with the sd9 and .40 that have at least 15k+ on them.

 

[noro]

update from factory

Hi All,

Just got off the phone with the factory. There is NO stated lifetime regarding any of the polymer pistols manufactured
currently. They maintain that while some parts could possibly
fail from defects or use, all S&W pistols currently manufactured
have the lifetime warranty that will be honored, should defects
occur. This includes the SD9VE, M&P 1.0, and 2.0

S&W strongly discourages aftermarket parts or modifications done to their pistols. This is the current factory stance as of today. Probably should have contacted them directly when I first heard of the
Galloway tech's opinion. the rep I spoke to was very familiar with the SD9VE, and maintained that
some pistols have exceeded 50,000 rounds with no problems at all, other than a recoil spring assembly
replacement.

BUT the tech maintained the SD9VE is an entry level weapon. Its not meant to compete with higher
priced pistols. Its made to fill a niche - entry level, low initial cost, reliability, self defense. Its not
a match pistol or performance center model. If you take it for what it is, it will last a lifetime with
proper maintenance, and factory ammo.

 

[BlueArch91]

S&W replied to my email. They recommend changing the recoil spring every 5000 rounds. They do not have any other recommendations and it is covered by their lifetime warranty.

Somehow I trust the direct communication over a YouTube expert who might be more motivated by money than any of our well being. Obviously, S&W is motivated by money, but they are also who is standing behind the product.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[sgtsandman]

That sounds like a reasonable recommendation that just about all handgun manufacturers make.

 

[HOUSTON RICK]

10,000 Afghan policemen and the insurgents that they sold their SD9VE's (and equivalent models) to can't be wrong. They are still killing each other with these 15 years later. I would look to the warranty not youtube.

 

[RedFalconBill]

Early Sigma's did have problems with the frame halves coming apart, that was fixed. G and S&W did settle out of court, but it did not almost drive Smith out of business. So much "Gun Shop Lore" that person needs waders.

FWIW. Apex Tactical does like the SD series. I like their replacement trigger, as I have never been a fan of the two part pivoting trigger Smith uses. I have found the Apex "kit" to produce a trigger that is lighter, but has a mushy reset. YMMV.

If you buy/use/carry an SD, rest assured it will work far beyond the 4,000 round mark Brandon of Galloway Precision states.