Selection of "Best Gun"

[forrestinmathews]

Why do you think that? In most "mass shootings" there is only one assailant.

For a second he had me wondering which team he was on. I believe he's looking for a higher round count because he feels as though he's going to trade shots with this evil SOG. I feel like trading shots is a disadvantageous position. You're giving an evildoer a chance to prevail. I believe you should just ambush the shooter and hit him a couple of times in the body and a couple of times in the head. If his hand is within three feet of a weapon and he still has a face, he's a threat. I would give no quarter here. It would be a killing not a shooting and darned if I care what anyone says about that.

All that said, I don't believe it would take 10 rounds or more. This is not a statement diminutizing the need for or usefulness of full capacity magazines. I believe it would take four to knock him down and two to make sure he never got back up or smiled for any cameras. A .357 magnum or larger should take care of the problem. Revolver or pistol no matter. Being able to hit the head or heart on demand at 25 yards....highly useful skill.

 

[moosedog]

I love to see these "studies."
When I came on the job, we could carry basically what we wanted within certain limits. Then the "one size fits all" studies came out.
Everyone is different, has different size hands, fingers, hand eye coordination, body size and weight, etc.
I always prescribed to using the gun that you can most constitantly hit the target with accurately. But hey, what do I know?

 

[forrestinmathews]

[*]Springfield 1911 A1 Mil-Spec no upgrades for Range and Home
defense w/2 ea Wilson 8rd mags. Planning on buying Chip Mc Corminck 10 rd mags.
[/LIST]
Thought about buying a .45 M&P (very nice gun), but got spoil when I shot the 1911

Upgrade: Sights to Trijicon night sights or better yet sell the gun off and get the M&P.
Why?
You're not going to like those milspec sights on the move, in low light or in quick shooting. They worked so poorly for me in a hunting situation where it was called upon to backup the rifle, that I ended up changing out the sights and eventually getting rid of the gun.
Compared to the Milspec you are money ahead in the M&P 45. It is easier to maintain and the magazines are more reliable. As an added bonus you can get a 14 round magazine into the M&P. that's essentially two magazines in 1911 without a reload. You also only have one platform essentially to develop muscle memory on. Load up and three and put them on the table in the dark. Grab and go with no manual safeties and no problems.

 

[jade2000_ent]

Upgrade: Sights to Trijicon night sights or better yet sell the gun off and get the M&P.
Why?
You're not going to like those milspec sights on the move, in low light or in quick shooting. They worked so poorly for me in a hunting situation where it was called upon to backup the rifle, that I ended up changing out the sights and eventually getting rid of the gun.
Compared to the Milspec you are money ahead in the M&P 45. It is easier to maintain and the magazines are more reliable. As an added bonus you can get a 14 round magazine into the M&P. that's essentially two magazines in 1911 without a reload. You also only have one platform essentially to develop muscle memory on. Load up and three and put them on the table in the dark. Grab and go with no manual safeties and no problems.

I am not gonna sell off the 1911 A1 Mil-Spec that's just not right, everyone should have one. Its a great gun and a part of American History.
Although I have been thinking of buying a M&P .45 for H/D and when I go bow hunting for protection from the Bears,wolves.etc. Don't want to take the 1911 out in the woods. I like it with no scratches.


P.S. 14 rds of .45 does sounds nice

thanks

 

[amazingflapjack]

Like Feral-I know myself, so around the house, I carry a Charter Arms "On Duty" (38 spl +P 2 inch) and a Charter Arms Bulldog 44 (44 Spl 2 1/2 inch) when I am dressed in more than very light clothing (Fla.) The first weighs 12 OZ's and the second 21 OZ's unloaded. stainless and aluminum with rubber grips. Will take a lickn' and keep on tickin."

 

[Sharks06lly]

I am not gonna sell off the 1911 A1 Mil-Spec that's just not right, everyone should have one. Its a great gun and a part of American History.
Although I have been thinking of buying a M&P .45 for H/D and when I go bow hunting for protection from the Bears,wolves.etc. Don't want to take the 1911 out in the woods. I like it with no scratches.


P.S. 14 rds of .45 does sounds nice

thanks

I know I love mine for HD,

This is always gonna he a hot subject cause its subjective for every person whether they are tall or short or skinny or fat. Those all play a role just like weather conditions and cash available to the person. What I like for conceal carry others may hate.

Either way I don't think there ever will be a definitive answer

 

[sac-gunslinger]

My advice will always be carry what you shoot the best.

Great contribution Ray! I appreciate all the thought and work you did preparing that for the forum.

Moondawg is right on the monry. And Chief38 is right, too. Don't overthink this. Pick what is most comfortable and most manageable for you.

Over 35+ years of carrying I have carried everything from a Model 29 6 1/2" (I hear that snickering in the back row) to a 1911 to a Chief Special and a whole lot in between. I have settled on the 642 because it strikes the best balance between competing needs.

Do not worry too much about needing a high round count. When I was instructing I used to ask my students what they expected to be happening that would justify their use of deadly force. "Well, I would be being attacked" they would answer "and I want to have enough rounds to deal with all the attackers!" So your attackers are going to wait in line for you to engage them in turn? What? The attackers would all be shooting at you at the same time. That is a problem whose solution is retreat and cover not magazine capacity. More of "them" than "you" is not a recipe for success.

Also, as a civilian, your justification for use of deadly force drops dramatically when the attacker is not attacking you.

 

[forrestinmathews]

I am not gonna sell off the 1911 A1 Mil-Spec that's just not right, everyone should have one. Its a great gun and a part of American History.

Aren't they made in brazil??
Mine was.

 

[Morgan88]

I like the "carry what you shoot the best" Clear and simple.

Yeh, probably want to lose the blue.

 

[steelslaver]

There is no perfect gun because there are no perfect situations. Plus, as pointed out people can't agree. That's no news flash. Isn't it better that they use what they believe in than what they are forced to carry. At least half the battle is mental. Another thing is location and job description. A FBI agent investigating white collar crime might have different needs than a deputy sheriff in Montana. If you are hot on the trail of a gang of armored car robbers known to wear body armor you might want something different than some one who works a bunch of apartment buildings in the city.

If you are just joe citizen in a rural community, like me the likely hood that you will actually need your piece is small, the change I'll need more than 5 rds and a speed loader is really tiny. I just picked up my second 5 shot 44 special. MY CHOICE.

 

[flintsghost]

A "best gun" choice has more to do with the person's experience, ability and the environment he spends the majority of his time in. People come in all sizes and shapes and where they live in this country varies so much that the hazards of daily life are vastly different. Professionals usually have several weapons and make a daily choice based on what they are doing, where they are going, and what they can expect to be faced with. Not everyone has the resources to own more than one. But many do. Since the Miami-Dade shootout the FBI has changed how they do business. Their ideas show it. Since the south LA bank robbery and accompanying shootout, most larger law enforcement agencys have adopted the 3 gun approach, so that a handgun is now not a critical "best choice" item for all around use like it was, once upon a time. The reactive sidearm of a LEO is now usually a department choice that does not reflect all needs but works well for most in their respective area. One needs to realize that when making their own choice for "best gun for them."

 

[jimmyj]

K.I.S.S. (keep it simple)
EDC- Glock Model 17 9mm plus S&W .38spl 2" (at home/neighborhood)
Going away from home/neighborhood: extra Glock magazine (or two) and a speedloader for S&W .38.

 

[shouldazagged]

I feel like trading shots is a disadvantageous position. You're giving an evildoer a chance to prevail. I believe you should just ambush the shooter and hit him a couple of times in the body and a couple of times in the head. If his hand is within three feet of a weapon and he still has a face, he's a threat. I would give no quarter here. It would be a killing not a shooting and darned if I care what anyone says about that...I believe it would take four to knock him down and two to make sure he never got back up or smiled for any cameras. A .357 magnum or larger should take care of the problem. Revolver or pistol no matter. Being able to hit the head or heart on demand at 25 yards....highly useful skill.

I devoutly hope that if you're ever in a full-red-alert SD situation (a) nobody representing the guy(s) you shoot reads that post, and (b) you have a damn good lawyer if you "ambush the shooter" at a range anywhere near 25 yards.

I say this out of concern for you. You would likely have one hell of a time establishing that the shooting was justified in those circumstances unless you have twelve witnesses, three of them LEO's and five of them clergymen, swearing you were being shot at and had absolutely no chance of retreating or taking cover. Especially if the prosecution/counsel for the plaintiff found what you posted here.

As far as I'm concerned, Rule One of gunfighting is not to "have a gun", but to avoid gunfights at all reasonable cost. Old and crippled-up and slow as I am, I suspect if a bad guy is 25 yards away with his hand "within three feet of a weapon" (I don't even want to know what you meant by "if he still has a face") I would have some chance of avoiding being shot without "ambushing" him.

 

[Fastbolt]

The FBI study did a lot to analyze the best gun for the law enforcement community. They did that by ...

First of all, welcome to the forum.

Next ... use paragraphs. Seriously. One long run-on paragraph becomes a blur and the message becomes as lost as Waldo.

Over-thinking this topic may be an enjoyable way to spend your free time ... feel free, BTW ... but don't over-think it. Really. It's just equipment.

You can buy equipment (guns, holsters, ammunition, etc), but the knowledge, skillset & mindset necessary to safely, properly & effectively use the equipment is dependent on the shooter.

Develop the user/shooter ... and then use one or another combination of known good quality equipment.

 

[forrestinmathews]

I devoutly hope that if you're ever in a full-red-alert SD situation...snip...
I say this out of concern for you.

Shouldazagged,
Thanks for the advice. I was talking about the active shooter scenario portion only. The accompanying quote from the OP makes that fairly clear. I hope the world could forgive me for not offering quarter to a deranged gunman that was killing innocent people. This is a very specific situation with specific circumstances. Please read more carefully in the future or ask for clarification. Soap boxes are hazardous platforms upon which to stand. It appears to me that you either took my post out of context or selectively edited it to set yourself up to make some grand social responsibility speech. Kindly zag or just read more carefully in the future.

So for final clarification, my statement was in response to the active shooter portion of the OP's criteria. I'm not advocating the bush whacking of n'erdowells on the street at 25 yards, but rather offering that there might be a time where longer distance engagement of an actively firing threat might equate to less bullet holes in innocent people; including yourself.

 

[shouldazagged]

I'm a very careful reader. Extremely so.

I won't pursue this further because there is no point doing so.