Strange Gun Shop Experience

[Ben_hutcherson]

I visited a Louisville-area gun shop the other day that I had never visited before.

After browsing, I spied one gun of possible interest to me(a prewar Colt Officer's Model 38) as well as some reloading components for decent prices.

After looking at the Colt, I stated that I'd like to buy some brass, and requested 500 pieces of 38 special. I also spotted some bullets on the shelf(component bullets, not loaded ammunition) and requested 200 of them.

We went over to the register to pay, and I pulled out debit card. The clerk requested my ID-I assumed to confirm the identity on my card. I didn't think much more of it, as I was chatting with a friend who came into the store with me.

After getting home and looking at my receipt, however, I realized that the clerk had copied my full driver's license number, expiration date, and date of birth down on the sales receipt!

As mentioned, I was buying(unprimed) brass and component bullets, both of which(as I understand it) are totally unregulated and have no restrictions at least here on Kentucky on who may purchase, possess, or use. On reflection, I'm actually rather bothered that they recorded this information for just such a purchase. Had I caught it at the time, I likely would have asked(although I tend to be fairly non-confrontational). Needless to say, I don't think I'll be shopping at that particular store anymore, despite their decent prices on components.

 

[Jack Flash]

Ben, you might want to go back and ask them about it. Maybe it would be best to talk to the manager or owner, as the clerk may be new, lack knowledge, be error-prone, etc.

I would not write the place off just yet...

 

[ibewbull]

I would contact management.
Concerns of ID theft come to mind.l
Also contact local PD and who ever else you think of.

 

[Ben_hutcherson]

Thanks guys.

I should add it's a small "family" shop. There were three people there working that day-the owner, and I think his wife and daughter. The wife was the one who checked me out. I may call and ask to talk to the owner tomorrow to voice my concerns.

And, yes, ID theft did definitely come to mind. I understand that this information is needed on a 4473, and also that they might have wanted to check my DOB(I am in my mid-20s) but don't appreciate or understand recording this information for a purchase such as this.

 

[H Richard]

Quite often any out of town buyers of anything, not necessarily gun or ammo parts, a store will have a policy of getting enough identifying information that if the card comes back declined after the customer has left the store they know how to contact. Unfortunately, faked cards do happen.

 

[moe smith]

Then there's the opposite end of the spectrum which I find more frequently. A cashier or clerk won't even bother to ask or look at my ID when using a debit or credit card. Heck, half of them don't even look at you, they're gabbing with a fellow employee about how sick their cat is while ringing you out. I always walk out of places like that thinking to myself, "Man, I sure hope I never drop this thing".

 

[shouldazagged]

I live in Louisville, Ben. What store was that? If you'd rather, you can PM me with it. It doesn't sound like one of the two I've always used, but I've been retired and broke for several years now.

 

[Ben_hutcherson]

I called and talked to the store and was told that their bank "required" this information on CC transactions.

Whatever the case, I will not shop at a store that sees this as necessary, and told them as much over the phone. I'll cross that store off my list-there are plenty of others around!

 

[Mcwsky09]

Could be that they had too many bad checks so their bank requires they get additional identifying information on transactions that can be used to tack down the responsible party in such cases.

 

[NYlakesider]

I called and talked to the store and was told that their bank "required" this information on CC transactions.

Whatever the case, I will not shop at a store that sees this as necessary, and told them as much over the phone. I'll cross that store off my list-there are plenty of others around!

You said Debit Card in your op. A DC is basically a check type transaction. As I have never had or want a DC (CCs are much safer) they wanted info on you in case it went bad just like a normal check transaction.

With that said I'm confrontational and would not have allowed that kind of info on a receipt. Show them my license with picture and let them compare OK. Many stores ask for phone number, cell number or zip code when I use CCs. My reply at that point is the authorization from the CC company is all you need. That ends the discussion

 

[JJEH]

We were victims of ID theft and had over $2,400 stolen out of our bank account. USAA returned the money but it was piece by piece and it took quite some time.

And b/c of that I would contact them ASAP. Also a phone call to the local PD won't hurt.

Edit:

Just saw that you have talked to them already. Contact their bank and ask if this is true and why.

There's just too much BS out there and we all have to be careful.

 

[cussedemgun]

Any flimsy excuse is better than none

I called and talked to the store and was told that their bank "required" this information on CC transactions.

Sounds to me like they are collecting personal information for their own "junk mail list".

BUT, you never know, I have been victim of identity theft in the past & I'm here to tell YOU, can really be frustrating. Never hurts to be careful with all forms of I.D.

& that said, I DETEST the waste of junk mail, knowing my taxes subsidize it.

 

[Eugene 9mm]

You said Debit Card in your op.

I was thinking that. A DC and CC may look the same, but are totally different. There's a food store round here, Winco, that won't take credit cards, so you have to use debit, cash or check.

I'm happy to show my driver's license so they anyone see my picture, but have never seen the info on the receipt. One thing I won't give is my SS number, except to my bank, employer, and the government (after all, they gave it to me first).

A stolen DC is a bad thing if they manage to use it. A stolen credit card is a nuisance, but if you notify the bank immediately you should get any unauthorised transactions cancelled.

 

[Alpo]

When debit cards first came out, they called 'em "check cards". They said, in the commercials, that when the card is swiped, it immediately checks with the bank to make sure the money is there. If it IS there, the money is immediately taken out. If it is NOT there, the card is declined.

That way if you have 100 in the bank you could not use the card for 50 here and another 50 here and a third 50 here. That third 50 would be declined.

That's the way they said it worked.

They lied.

If X-company has the number of the card, and they put through a charge against it, the bank will pay it. If you don't have enough in the bank to cover it, the bank pays it anyway and hits you with a non-sufficient-funds charge. They call it "Courtesy Pay", but it's NSF.

And if you go to the bank and say, "I did not authorize that", they say, "The numbers match, we paid,you owe us THIS MUCH".

I would never have a debit card. I've seen the problems with other people's.

As for the "I won't shop where they don't check IDs". If I drop five 100-dollar bills, I have lost 500 dollars. But if I drop my Discover Card, and someone finds it and buys something with it, I just call Discover and say, "I didn't buy that." They refuse the charge, cancel that card and send me a new card with a different number. MUCH safer than cash, and so much safer that a debit card it ain't funny.

 

[Ben_hutcherson]

Just to follow up a little bit more, the owner of the shop actually called me back after I made the above post.

He assured me he keeps his receipts as secure as his 4473s, and that he incinerates all his receipts at the end of the year. I was also told that the "ATF says his paperwork is kept the best of anywhere in town" and that I was "welcome to come to his house and see the incinerator where he burned his receipts." I was told repeatedly that it was for my protection that he did this, and that I was the "first customer to complain about it in the two years they had been doing this."

I ended the conversation by saying that I respect his right to operate his business in any(legal) way he pleases, but that I still did not agree with his policy and therefore will still not be shopping there.

 

[Xfuzz]

In 80%+ of the identity thefts debit cards are the target.

 

[oldcoot]

Cash is king

Cash is king

 

[Onomea]

Guys, I don't have a debit card and never have. But my youngest son, away at college, uses one. He likes it better than a credit card because he pays for what he buys immediately.

I have explained to him that I have always, ever since I first got a credit card, paid off my cards in full at the end of the month. I have also explained the importance of building a credit history. So far he still prefers his debit card to his credit card.

But I am concerned, reading this thread, that it sounds like not only could a thief empty his bank account, but also rack up debt that he would have to pay the bank. Don't debit cards use punch in codes or some other form of security? Is losing one or having one stolen really worse than losing a wad of cash?

 

[TucsonMTB]

Yes, at least in my case, my debit card is another way to distribute funds from my bank account. It has a PIN (Personal Identity Number?) that must be entered to extract cash. That is very weak security since it is usually only a four digit number.

The same card can be processed as a credit card without the PIN, in my case (Bank of America).

Additionally, unlike credit cards, when a debit card is used for things like hotel and rental car transactions, the amounts the hotel or rental agency post when you begin your stay or rental period are frozen in your bank account and can significantly reduce your available balance. This is not a good thing since those can be large numbers. Can you say, "bounced checks"? In those applications, a credit card is a much better choice.

I too mostly use credit cards or American Express and pay full balance each billing cycle. The last time we bought a house, the resulting high credit rating was very helpful.

Continue to offer your original advice to your son. It probably won't help, but you are providing good guidance, sir.

 

[rwsmith]

The good customer list

We frequent a business and have been writing checks for 35+ years and never bounced one (thanks to a smart old lady). They stopped taking checks because too many people were ripping them off. Understandable. We were on the 'good customer list' for several years after but the last time I went I was told that they could accept NO checks. Now I have to make sure that I have the right cash. PITA, yes. It is the extraordinary proportion of crumbs that mess it up for everybody.