SW / Python Hybrid?

[bountyhunter]

I just saw a gun for sale that was a model 66 SW with a 6" Colt Python barrel installed.

I have to admit, it did look very cool. Does anybody know:

1) Is it possible to fit an actual Python barrel or is it an aftermarket copy?

2) Who builds these?

3) Any inherent problems doing this (aside from voiding the warranty on your SW)?

 

[bountyhunter]

I just saw a gun for sale that was a model 66 SW with a 6" Colt Python barrel installed.

I have to admit, it did look very cool. Does anybody know:

1) Is it possible to fit an actual Python barrel or is it an aftermarket copy?

2) Who builds these?

3) Any inherent problems doing this (aside from voiding the warranty on your SW)?

 

[Grayfox]

It was known as a Smolt or a Smython and it was an actual Python barrel fitted to a K-frame S&W. IIRC they saw some popularity during the 60s. The feeling was that Colt had a better barrel, but Smith had the better action.
Again IIRC there was some concern regarding the S&W frame which had to be bored out some to accommodate the larger Colt barrel. I don't know if this actually lead to any problems.

There was also a similar creation that mated a Python barrel to a Ruger Security Six. It was known as a Couger.

 

[catdad]

A friend of mine just recently had one made from a S&W 19 frame and a 4 inch Pyton barrel, very nice looking gun.
A gunsmith does have to do a re-thread to fit the barrel.
These were more common in the 70's

 

[Frank237]

One of THE most accurate revolvers I ever shot was a Model 14 with a 6" Python barrel installed. IIRC the work was done by Austin Behlert in NJ, sometimes in 1972 or 73.

Liked it so much I later bought a 4" twin. Wanted a 6" so bought a 6" tube a few years ago,but never did install it. Still sitting in my parts bin.

FN in MT

 

[bountyhunter]

So nobody builds them and sells them?

 

[dfariswheel]

No. These were strictly custom gunsmith creations.

They started off as custom guns made fro the Practical Police Course (PPC) match shot by police.
They liked the S&W trigger, but liked the heavy Python barrel with it's superior accuracy.

After other shooters saw these "Smython" or "Smolt" revolvers, they had Python barrels installed on standard revolvers just as something "different".

When S&W came out with the 686, which copied the Python barrel, cylinder, and frame as closely as they could get away with the custom gunsmiths pretty well stopped building them.

When all other revolver makers started building guns with Python-like barrels, and Python barrels got hard to get, the idea more or less died.

I'd imagine some of the custom gunsmiths would still build you a gun on request.

 

[Newsguy]

Bill Davis was doing these in the 70's. Mine is actually an Armaloy-coated Model 19. The guns were set up as "rule beaters" when PPC shooting was in vogue. Some of the stock classes mandated a "factory" bbl (rather than the heavy bull bbls and ribbed sights used on modified class PPC guns.) So, combine the highly accurate Python bbl with the easy-to-slick S&W action and you've got a fine shooter. Davis also did an action job and added a ball detent on the yoke for extra lockup. I don't know of anyone marketing "Smolt" conversions as such, but I'm sure there are a lot of good 'smiths who could put one together.

 

[BubbaBlades]

It took me more than 30 years to find (and buy) my first Smython (the 6" one). The 3" showed up a few months later. Mark

 

[okie john]

Do a search for "Smolt" and"Smython." There's plenty of information here.


Okie John

 

[bluetopper]

Very nice looking Pyths.

 

[Poohgyrr]

I might know the gun you're asking about. The gunsmith who built it used to work at the old Bill Davis Service Center here in Sacramento. (Before that , Davis was in West Sacramento if I remember right.) Over 20 years ago, from time to time, Smythons and Cougars (Colt & Ruger) would be seen for sale on Davis' shelf. The shop also did real nice street work and I have a couple of examples of that if you want to see.

Besides here (at the S&W Forum), we also have a few folks on the CalGuns forum who live in Sacramento and own Smythons; you might be able to look at theirs.

FWIW....

 

[bountyhunter]

Since I know nothing about them and would like to avoid being skinned:

can you suggest a reasonable dollar value for one say a stainless 66 with a 6" barrel?

 

[LoboGunLeather]

Originally posted by bountyhunter:
Since I know nothing about them and would like to avoid being skinned:

can you suggest a reasonable dollar value for one say a stainless 66 with a 6" barrel?

Like any other customized piece, the beauty (and the value) is in the eye of the beholder. With a current market value on any decent Model 66 running upwards of $400, and a good Python barrel (when you can find one) commanding well over $100, I can't imagine anyone selling you a complete piece for much less than $600 or so.

Shoot a few well-controlled groups with the 66 before and after conversion. I'd be interested to see if there are any significant differences in performance.

I remember seeing a few of these at PPC matches back in the mid 1970's. Also, blued revolvers with nickled cylinders and barrels (a la "ElectraGlide in Blue").

 

[bountyhunter]

Originally posted by LoboGunLeather:

Originally posted by bountyhunter:
Since I know nothing about them and would like to avoid being skinned:

can you suggest a reasonable dollar value for one say a stainless 66 with a 6" barrel?

Like any other customized piece, the beauty (and the value) is in the eye of the beholder. With a current market value on any decent Model 66 running upwards of $400, and a good Python barrel (when you can find one) commanding well over $100, I can't imagine anyone selling you a complete piece for much less than $600 or so.

Thanks for the input, it's almost exactly what I thought. I will pay $450 for a nice (pre lock) 66 and I will give an added $200 premium for the pythonization, so I thought about $650 would be right. I made that offer on one up for sale but was told it was much too low. Since this is california, people selling unique guns believe they can charge a lot more. It is cute, but I don't really want to spend more than $650.

 

[bountyhunter]

Originally posted by LoboGunLeather:

Shoot a few well-controlled groups with the 66 before and after conversion. I'd be interested to see if there are any significant differences in performance.

There certainly would not be for me because I don't shoot match grade ammo and any decent 66 can shoot sub 2" groups at 25 yards stock. I just want it for the cool factor.

 

[swamp creature]

Hamilton Bowen shows an example of a Colt barrel on a Smith frame on his website. He offers this service to prospective buyers.
C

 

[westcoast362]

Mine was built by Davis back in the eighties. It is an N frame (M-28) with an eight inch python barrel. Hard chromed, magna-ported with a ball detent for extra tightness and an adjustable trigger stop.

 

[Mickey D]

I believe the gun in question is posted on Calguns for sale, correct? It's in or around Sacramento, CA. Looks real nice with a mat finish.

 

[bountyhunter]

Originally posted by swamp creature:
Hamilton Bowen shows an example of a Colt barrel on a Smith frame on his website. He offers this service to prospective buyers.
C

No, he doesn't. Here is his reply to my inquiry:

Dear Sir:

Thanks for your inquiry.

You may have us mixed up with some other shop as we do not offer Python barrel installations on S&Ws. What we do offer are Anaconda barrel installations on Ruger Redhawks.

 

[Landpimp]

picked up this one last year...nickel 19-3 with 6" nickle Python barrel.......its really pretty cool

not sure who did the work, but was told these were fairly common around WA in the 70's

 

[bountyhunter]

Would anybody mind if I asked the price? There is no PM ability on the board (I asked) and I still can't find a single case where somebody will tell me what one of these actually sells for. I'd like to know in case I see one.

 

[Landpimp]

I paid either $300 or $400 for mine, it was a evidence gun(bought from my buddy who buys them from the PD) so I cant say thats a realistic price or not, seemed fair to me.....but I am a sucker for nickle

 

[bountyhunter]

Originally posted by Landpimp:
I paid either $300 or $400 for mine, it was a evidence gun(bought from my buddy who buys them from the PD) so I cant say thats a realistic price or not, seemed fair to me.....but I am a sucker for nickle

I would have trampled a nun to get that gun for $400.

It's a really beautiful piece and just what I am looking for, I just don't think $900 is a realistic price is why I asked to get other people's price points. I can't find them offered for sale in the usual places like Gunsamerica.

 

[Dale53]

I was shooting PPC when these were all the vogue. I cannot speak for the "Coolness factor" as that is a personal thing. However, as I remember it, having to use a factory barrel was rather limiting. The Python barrel added needed "front end weight" for that particular course of fire. I was on a rather limited income (trying to raise three kids on a modest salary) so my PPC gun was a Model 14 S&W that I added a Bomar Rib to. It would shoot considerably under an inch at 25 yards off the Ransom rest. In fact, factory Remington WC's regularly shot 5/8" groups. My best reloads with my solid base
wad cutters would do about 3/4" but the factory ammo was JUST a tad bit better on average. That Remington Factory Wadcutter stuff at that time (late sixties and seventies) was some pretty wonderful stuff.

So, even tho' my Smith was not a custom gun it would shoot right along with the best of the customs (having a "weight forward" pistol WAS an advantage). When Smith introduced the 686, I considered the issue closed but continued to shoot my Model 14 and still have it. When they put me in the ground it will pass to my sons and son-in-law along with the rest of my guns.

Make no mistake, however, the Smython was a good concept and I would be a happy owner of a good one put together well. In the meantime, I'll just keep on "making do" with my Model 14 and my 686 (6").

Dale53

 

[Steve638]

Smolt

Check out SMOLT thread in 61 to 80 revover forum lots of posts and pics. of some real pretty hybrid handguns

 

[waltey]

I just had a "smolt / smython" built for my wife . It was done by 10 ring in Texas by Alex Hamelton . He does these farly often (about 2 or so a year . ) Had a action / tune done at that time also . Realy smooth action, This was built on a round butt model 19-4 snubby , now it has a 6" python barrel, wide target hammer & trigger. National debt ($1500) but it is something I always wanted & wife said why don't ya just do it ?

 

[cal50]

Another nice variation was the "Cougar" or the Ruger revolver frame with a Colt python barrel. Darn nice combo and my friend had one and sorry I did not buy it when he decided to sell it.

 

[captainjohnsofd]

worked for Austin Behlert many years ago in Union, NJ- he did a number of these conversions, the usual candidate was a blue square butt Model 19 and a blue 6" Python barrel- usually ended up as PPC guns...Python barrels were known to stabilize 148 grain wadcutters better than bull barrels- and the result was a really good looking revolver without the price of a Python

 

[Green Frog]

worked for Austin Behlert many years ago in Union, NJ- he did a number of these conversions, the usual candidate was a blue square butt Model 19 and a blue 6" Python barrel- usually ended up as PPC guns...Python barrels were known to stabilize 148 grain wadcutters better than bull barrels- and the result was a really good looking revolver without the price of a Python

Of course nowadays with the price of parts and the price and wait time for top shelf gunsmithing (and Austin Behlert was definitely top shelf!) this kind of project isn't nearly as attractive and practical. Add to that the availability of the 580 and 680 series of S&W revolvers and a lot of the luster is gone from this conversion, cool though it was/is.

Also, there was a run of Model 14s done using full under lug 6" barrels, rumored to be leftovers from the 16-4 project, that Smith did back in the late '80s or early '90s... sort of a factory version of a "Smython." Then again, is anybody shooting any revolver games these days (PPC, Steel Challenge, etc) where a heavy barrel, light recoiling revolver is the dominant gun of choice?

Froggie