To Laser or not to Laser

[Doc Holliday 1950]

We never had lasers way back in the old days of the 60's & 70's.
But now,one can get a laser for almost any make/model.
So, my question is do you use a laser or not. If so or if not please give your thoughts. The only main reason that I can understand having a laser is in a no light or low light condition.
Most of my elder generation use lasers.for what reason, who knows.!!
As usual, all comments and ideas are welcome.

 

[silverstateS&W]

lasers

over 50?
less than perfect eyesight in dim light?
concealable handgun?
Lasers help a lot

 

[Arquebus357]

To me lasers are useless most of the time. However I will add that once you see a green laser, you will not be wanting a red laser. My son has a green laser on his 9mm carbine and it just about lights up a room

 

[ruger 22]

If you have any kind of eye problem you will want a laser. If you wish to keep your 'target' completely in your vision, without having your gun blot out some of it because you have it high up in your line of sight you will want a laser. If you ever have to use your other hand to shoot for any reason you will want a laser. If you wish to shoot a whole lot more accurately you will want a laser. If you want to get on sight in a real hurry you will want a laser. Red versus green is a personal choice. Either works. I think that red is more fearsome. I have lasers on both my 17-1 and 649-2. It is money well spent

 

[Not Getting Any Younger]

Last year I bought my first J-Frame. A Model 638.
I put the smaller LG-105 Crimson Trace laser grip on it (got it on sale for a good price).

For me the laser is more for training - it really helps with my double-action trigger pull as the gun can be challenging to shoot accurately. When dry firing, and at the range, I can see how much my trigger control impacts aim.

... and then there's the 'intimidation factor' of a laser if it happens to be on your chest! (if you're a 'bad guy')

 

[mike campbell]

The only main reason that I can understand having a laser is in a no light or low light condition.

Isn't that reason enuff? To have a sight when irons are useless?If you had to guess when you're most likely to be mugged, would it be in the daytime or after dark? Actually, the most practical reason is that the bullet goes where the red dot goes. All you have to see is the dot ... don't even have to see the gun. Shoot a few targets from the hip with a laser and ask your self "why not?".

I don't understand the comment "useless most of the time." They are useful under FAR MORE conditions than iron sights are.
They can be seen indoors any time of day or night. On a sunny day in the brightest lit fast food restaurant ... they show up just fine. From dusk till dawn they show up anywhere. The only time they don't show up is when you're likely to need them least ... outside on a sunny day. And just because you have one doesn't mean it's your only option ... unless you grind off your "backup" iron sight.

OTOH, using a gun for "intimidation" makes YOU the bad guy. If someone points a laser at someone, the target should never see it or hear what comes next.

 

[Not Getting Any Younger]

...

OTOH, using a gun for "intimidation" makes YOU the bad guy. If someone points a laser at someone, the target should never see it or hear what comes next.

Perhaps I didn't explain my meaning properly. If a 'bad guy' breaks into my house and I don't have to fire the weapon because the laser causes them to flee, I see that as a good thing!

Of course the 638 is not my 1st choice for home defense - I have higher capacity pistols with lights for that.

 

[Rpg]

I've shot some with lasers

No more.

For me, it is much slower and less accurate than plain black sights, even in darkness you'd find in a house interior.

Part of the problem in using a laser is that you focus on the wrong thing. You're not looking at the front sight.

If you've practiced your presentation well, your sights come up aligned so you're looking at the front sight through the rear sight.

The alignment occurs even in almost total darkness. Accuracy is surprisingly good. It's also very quick.

Fiddling with turning on a laser then hunting around to find the light beam then hunting for the target is pretty slow. It's and not as accurate as you'd imagine.

I prefer plain black sights.

 

[STCM(SW)]

KISS always works for me. The more you depend on, the more that can go
wrong...

 

[UncleEd]

My experience with lasers is watching
people chase the light at indoor ranges.

When the light wanders onto the bullseye,
the shooter yanks or mashes the trigger
to get off a shot while the light is there.
And another miss is achieved.

Use the money that a laser will cost for
more ammunition and training in trigger
control, proper grip and "point shooting" skills.

However! If I invest in a company that makes
lasers, then buy one for every gun you own or
expect to own. And buy some for your friends
as well.

 

[PPS1980]

I own two. One is on a training pistol I use with family and friends to help them with muzzle control. The other my wife, thoughtfully, bought for me on a great sale for Christmas. I tried liking it. Really I did. Just hate the thing. Chasing the dot. Fiddling with switches. Worrying about a battery. No thanks. Draw, point, shoot. Practice until fluidly on target.

 

[Breakaway500]

I like the laser setups that allow you to press a button to turn then on and release to turn off. (momentary switched) On demand,so they don't give your position away. They are excellent ways to practice your draw and point skills. Draw..point and activate the laser. You hit..or miss..without firing a shot. In the dark, a laser is king. Activate..place dot on target,pull trigger. You don't even need to sight the weapon. Lasers have a LOT of advantages for those who wish to exploit them. I've been using them for 20 years. Won't go without one for my CC weapon.

I'll take ANY advantage I can get in a gunfight. Alls fair...

 

[mike campbell]

Different strokes for sure.

"Part of the problem in using a laser is that you focus on the wrong thing. You're not looking at the front sight.
If you've practiced your presentation well, your sights come up aligned so you're looking at the front sight through the rear sight."

No, no, no .... THIS is wrong.

It works fine for all kinds of precision shooting or when you're playing games. It's not the best way to handle a threat to your life.

Shooting with an adrenaline rush at close range is far more successful if you've learned to FOCUS on the THREAT. Boxers don't stare at their gloves. Never take your eyes off the threat and practice to shoot with eye/hand coordination. If you can turn your head, spot a target and quickly point your finger at it ...without "looking" at your fingertip ...you can be deadly with a laser.

This business of searching for the light, chasing the dot, fiddling with switches, etc. That's just bad shooter habits, like not taking the safety off, limp- wristing, target freeze, etc....like a boxer who looks at his glove and thinks. "I'm going to plant this on his nose." Silly, isn't it? All that can (MUST) be overcome with practice. See the threat, see the dot, don NOT see the gun, squeeze the trigger...faster than I can type it. The problem is all about the Indian making the wrong moves with a good arrow. The equipment is not at fault.

In one range session I've had people emptying an entire magazine into a pie plate @ 30 feet ... with the gun held 2-handed at belly-button level where they can't even see it. There are other ways and situations to shoot a laser with much more speed and proficiency than any iron-sighted gun...........in the meantime, no need to grind off the iron/fiber/tritium sight ...they make an OK backup.

 

[H Richard]

I have no use for laser's. I did have one on a carry gun for a bit, and confirmed my opinion of them. You cannot see the laser in daylight, and in low light it is a perfect aiming point for your opponent, (and you standing right behind it).

 

[Chipperxd]

I have never been a fan of any lasers or weapon mounted lights.

Also, people saying that lasers are great in no light situations, isn't that breaking one of the main safety rules? Know what's behind the target?

Do you really just cook off rounds in to the darkness because you see your laser dot?

 

[Dvan34]

I had a LaserMax Centerfire (red) on my Shield for the last 3 years. I use a Laser cartridge to practice dry firing. The only time I used the Centerfire was to sometimes coordinate with the Laser Cartridge when dry firing. It provided a pretty good indication of where the bullets would go. I believe, as you say, the green is preferable. I removed it last week finally. It became a problem when shopping for holsters, as some models are not adaptable. Plus I do not want to depend upon a Laser in a SD situation.

 

[snubbyfan]

I put a Laserlyte side mounted laser on my carry snubby.


It's mostly for dry fire practice. I'll look through the sights, put the red dot on the belly of my wife's favorite stuffed Pooh bear and keep it there all the way through the trigger pull.
My intention was to not use it as a sight but rather as a training tool.
Snubbies can be tricky to shoot accurately, dao snubbies even more so. For me, having a gimpy hand makes it even trickier.

 

[gen3guy]

I will get plenty of disagreement on this, but here goes.

I suggest a good flashlight instead of a laser. You need the entire target illuminated, not just a dot on his chest. I personally believe that once you deploy the laser, you're paying more attention to the dot than you are the person. If all you see is the dot, how are you to know if he's retreating or surrendering, or for that matter becoming more of a threat? This would make you more likely to shoot when you don't need to or not shoot when you do need to. A bright flashlight is also startling, which could give you even more of an advantage.

If you DO get a laser, practice....a lot. You will find that the bullet rarely hits the target exactly where the dot is (was). You will see what I mean. Become a good shot without the laser because you won't be any better with it.

 

[ContinentalOp]

It's a personal preference thing. The only way to really find out if it's for you is to get one and do some training with it.

Personally, I'm in the no-laser camp. Like Rpg, I prefer plain black sights, even in low light situations. Unlike him, however, I don't believe that front-sight-focus is necessary. I use a target-focused approach, but I still bring my gun up into my line of sight so I can get a rough visual index or see "through" the sights (target's in focus, sights are blurry). I can still get good hits with that method, even at longer distances. For defensive shooting, I want the chain from "this person is an immediately lethal threat to me" to firing to be as short and as simple as possible.

While there will certainly be some exceptions, I believe that if there is enough light for you to clearly identify a threat, there is enough light to get at least a rough visual alignment on target. If it's too dark to identify the threat, then you either need to illuminate the possible target to confirm it's a threat or you shouldn't be shooting.

At extremely close quarters, when one is most likely to use "true" point shooting (i.e., the gun is not in your field of vision), one can still get good hits on target without a laser, presuming you've got a decent level of "muscle memory" ingrained through training.

Having said all that, I will add that there are two areas where I think laser sights are useful. One, is dry fire training. Seeing the dot bob and weave as you pull the trigger can help with improving trigger control. Two, shooting at odd angles. There may be some situations where you need to fire, but, for whatever reason, getting some kind of visual or physical index on target isn't possible. A laser can be handy in situations like that.

Just my opinion.

 

[richardw]

I have tried lasers, but I do not use them after trial. I tried both Viridian Green and Crimson Trace Red on my Lc9s when I had it. This is what I learned. The red laser is good in dim light like indoors or outside at night. It is marginal to worthless in daylight. The green laser is much better in daylight than the red, but it offers little advantage over iron sights in daylight.

What I found in both daylight and dim light was that I kept looking at the red or green dot on the target as it jumped around due to the inevitable motion we all have. I was focused on trying to stabilize the gun for a perfect hit rather than getting on target and shooting, which is the real key to survival.

So for me the laser slowed me down in any situation where it was an asset like dim light. To compensate for that I keep a powerful LED flashlight with my gun so I can illuminate the target in poor light

I know some will suggest it would be better to have a rail mounted light on a gun. I disagree because in PA, my State, brandishing is a crime. So if you are alarmed and looking for an intruder on your property you might end up pointing a gun while illuminating a person with the attached light. That can get you jail time in PA at worst and at best reaultmin having. Your license to carry revoked.

The technique for using a flashlight while prepared with a gun is easy to master, but I do not wan to induce thread drift here.