Traffic Stop

[MaximumLawman]

I reckon, it happens all the time. I've seen it ever since I've been driving. My guess is that it's legal as long as *everyone* is stopped (no profiling). The intersection near my house is a common location. I see them there all the time, but I typically approach from the opposite direction and turn in my drive before I get to them.

Sitz v Michigan was the landmark case that said sobriety checkpoints were legal as long as the stops weren't arbitrary (ie. everyone was stopped, or every third car, etc.) The rationale was not probable cause or reasonable suspicion but rather that the stops were not unreasonable seizures because the right of the motoring public to be free from drunk drivers was more significant than the right of the drivers stopped to be free from the minor and momentary intrusion. I can ALMOST go along with this, but not really......As for roadblocks to check driver license, registration and insurance, I'd say that was unconstitutional if the motorists involved didn't have the opportunity to avoid the the checkpoint or refuse to participate. Incidentally, the US Supreme Court Case notwithstanding, sobriety checkpoints are not considered reasonable seizures in MI.....

 

[oldman45]

I do not have a problem with checkpoints. They sometimes work well and sometimes they are a total waste of manpower.

Our checkpoints around here are advertised beforehand. Some people will avoid the area if they know about it in advance but they are also often the ones that lack current license, insurance or such.

Checkpoints are not meant to be used on an interstate highway due to the danger and high traffic volume.

As to people having to get on their brakes hard for a traffic stop, they are not driving safely. It means they are not paying attention to what is going on in front of them. If one is approaching a hill, they should see people hitting their brakes at the top of the hill and know something is going on. I see people hitting the rear of traffic on interstates simply because they did not see congestion a quarter mile away.

A checkpoint takes a couple minutes of a person's time and is only a minor inconvenience to one with nothing to worry about. That couple of minutes may also serve to take the drunk driver off the road that may be the one that would have hit your family member. It may catch a person with a homicide warrant out on them.

 

[BW64]

It's a good thing you weren't in downtown Atlanta. The cop would probably have had you and your daughter face down at gun point in the dirt or on concrete while he ran a check on you and your gun permit. I haven't experienced that kind of harassment myself because I avoid that area like the 7 year itch, but quite a few GFL (GA Firearms License) holders allegedly have. Our GFL allows open or concealed carry and any law abiding civilian can legally have a gun anywhere in his/her vehicle without a GFL. However, the Metro Atlanta LE departments and the entire city government is adamantly opposed to any kind of carry whether with or without a GFL. According to what I have read online at Georgia Packing Org by GFL holders who live or work in that metro area, you will be hassled by LE personnel if they see a gun or even suspect that you may be carrying one. OTOH, up here in the north GA mountains where I live the local LE agencies either support civilian carry with a GFL or at least don't oppose it to the extent that they would hassle GFL holders for carrying a gun or just for spite.

Notice: Some of what I wrote in re Atlanta metro area LE is based primarily on hearsay and unverified allegations, not my own personal experience. So take it for what it's worth as such.

Same for here in Vegas!! The cops think they're the only ones that should own a firearm!!

 

[Chuck1217]

I only read the first page and am so amazed at what I didn't see that I will not waste anymore time on this thread...what I didn't see was that no one sees a problem with road blocks set up to "check your papers"!?!? REALLY???!!!

I don't think anybody LIKES it, the question is what are we gonna DO about it? There are so, so many things the govt. does that are simply unConstitutional, unfair, stoooopid. But before I made a ruckus about stopping cars without cause, I would want the govt to stop borrowing money, stop taking it from us working people and giving it to others...even putting God back into our schools (which even teach socialism.) So no, I don't like being stopped like that but.....Sorry, stepped up on to my soapbox.

 

[KJM]

Your a good sheeple Stanley.

You're right, that was pretty poor planning on a "check point" location. No since in getting people hurt by trying to keep people safe. I still don't know if your act of careless driving was the best way to make your point though. It would have been a shame to injure someone in the process.

I would argue that a public roadway is a little different than my living room.

In my case they didn't search for my documents. They asked to see them. I have given them no reason to search for anything. And if you will go back and re read my posting, I think that I portrayed this particular situation as a situation where they were looking for the "major" infractions. As I stated a lot of warnings were being issued for the less serious stuff.

I am sure that not all of these check points are used the same way as the ones that I have had the opportunity to be witness to. This has just been my experience, and I am not advocating an irresponsible approach to law enforcement at all. I am sure that others have horror stories to tell.

 

[frito1]

Just got home and the blue light brigade is set up at the intersection about 3/4 of a mile away on other side of my place tonight. Didn't have to pass through them this week.

 

[Super Trucker]

I do not have a problem with checkpoints. They sometimes work well and sometimes they are a total waste of manpower.

Our checkpoints around here are advertised beforehand. Some people will avoid the area if they know about it in advance but they are also often the ones that lack current license, insurance or such.

Checkpoints are not meant to be used on an interstate highway due to the danger and high traffic volume.

As to people having to get on their brakes hard for a traffic stop, they are not driving safely. It means they are not paying attention to what is going on in front of them. If one is approaching a hill, they should see people hitting their brakes at the top of the hill and know something is going on. I see people hitting the rear of traffic on interstates simply because they did not see congestion a quarter mile away.

A checkpoint takes a couple minutes of a person's time and is only a minor inconvenience to one with nothing to worry about. That couple of minutes may also serve to take the drunk driver off the road that may be the one that would have hit your family member. It may catch a person with a homicide warrant out on them.

I say this with no disrespect in mind, but who in the hell are you to decide what my time is worth?
I drive for a living and "only a few minutes" a few times a day cost me a bunch of money by the end of the year.

On the "it may also list", you COMPLETLY missed that it may also make me late for a delivery, a doctor appointment, picking a child up a school etc. Sorry you FAILED to remember that.

I would like to know how much brainwashing it takes to make a person honestly believe that they can determine what others time is worth?

Fortunatly this doesn't happen much if ever in MI because I would go through the state capital like my *** was on fire to have whoever dreamed up that garbage recalled, fired or whatever needs to happen.

Again I mean no disrespect but your comments really hit a nerve.

 

[dwever]

I say this with no disrespect in mind, but who in the hell are you to decide what my time is worth?

Oldman45 didn't make that decision about your time, Sitz v Michigan did.

Peace

 

[Faulkner]

As a LEO I've worked a number of sabriety checkpoints. We always utilize at least eight officers and courtesy and professionalism is key. Our goal is to delay a vehicle no more than 30 to 60 seconds unless there is probably cause to detain a vehicle further. Based on the number of drug and DUI arrests I have made which have made the roadways safer for law abiding citizens (i.e., saved lives) I don't apologize for the slight inconveniance it may cause.

 

[J. W.]

As a LEO I've worked a number of sabriety checkpoints. We always utilize at least eight officers and courtesy and professionalism is key. Our goal is to delay a vehicle no more than 30 to 60 seconds unless there is probably cause to detain a vehicle further. Based on the number of drug and DUI arrests I have made which have made the roadways safer for law abiding citizens (i.e., saved lives) I don't apologize for the slight inconveniance it may cause.

Agreed!


I'll be quite frank and state that I don't like working checkpoints anymore than some members posting here like going through them. In my experience, they're relatively unproductive for the time and manpower they consume. However, it is my opinion that every drunk we get off the highway is a small victory that might just save the life of an innocent traveler.

I ask this of my fellow citizens; are you too important and busy to donate a few minutes of your time to save a life?

I'm going to climb upon my soapbox and say this while I'm at it. I don't set out to be an inconvenience or to trample peoples' rights when I go to work. Before every shift I say a quick prayer and ask the good Lord to protect me, to guide and direct me. To have me go forth and do his work. My intentions are to make my little corner of America a little better for having been there. So a child can sleep in peace tonight without having to worry about his mother's abusive boyfriend terrorizing them. To keep a drunk behind the wheel from destroying a family. To keep evil at bay for those sleeping peacefully under my watch. It might sound corny and perhaps I'm a fool, but its the truth and there are many more like me. As Toby Keth says, "hate me if you want to, but love me if you can."

 

[oldman45]

I say this with no disrespect in mind, but who in the hell are you to decide what my time is worth?
I drive for a living and "only a few minutes" a few times a day cost me a bunch of money by the end of the year.

On the "it may also list", you COMPLETLY missed that it may also make me late for a delivery, a doctor appointment, picking a child up a school etc. Sorry you FAILED to remember that.

I would like to know how much brainwashing it takes to make a person honestly believe that they can determine what others time is worth?

Fortunatly this doesn't happen much if ever in MI because I would go through the state capital like my *** was on fire to have whoever dreamed up that garbage recalled, fired or whatever needs to happen.

Again I mean no disrespect but your comments really hit a nerve.

First off, I doubt you are stopped each day. So any time you are at a checkpoint is going to be minor in the grand scheme of things.

Then will you be one to complain when your vehicle is struck by an uninsured or drunken motorist? Checkpoints get rid of both of these.

I have been through three checkpoints as a motorist. My registration, insurance and license were checked and it took all of three minutes. I am in my late 60's and been driving for over 55 yrs as a licensed driver. For the last 35 yrs, I have been driving over 80,000 miles per yr so the time I have spent at a checkpoint is so small that is is not even a factor. I have spent more time waiting for accidents to be cleared on interstates.

Late for an appointment??? Please, you can do better than that. There are several reasons this will not take place. You are more likely to have a flat tire, a dead battery or an accident than be stopped at a checkpoint. Also, if you are running that late for an appointment, you are likely a procrastinator that puts off doing things until it is making you speed to get where you are going.

What is your time worth? Same as mine. Not much. I make a good living but my time is not worth anything unless it is being measured in hours. You possibly will stand and shoot the breeze with someone for longer in a day than you would be at a checkpoint. It is not the time you spend, it is the way you perceive the time you spent.

Now all this having been addressed, I find people with your viewpoint is usually putting up a smoke screen for something else. The last time I had someone complain about the time (less than 3 minutes) at a check point had a boat loat of drugs in their car that was found after their complaining. The time factor was not an issue, it was what may be uncovered during the stop.

Checkpoints are not running background checks. They simply accomplish what they were set up to do. You should see those that turn around after seeing a checkpoint to avoid some charge.

Always remember, a guilty person complains more than the innocent. At a checkpoint, complain about the time they take and see how long you will be detained for in depth checks which may include a check for warrants.

 

[Packard]

In my wallet stacked in this order. Drivers license, Concealed permit, vehicle registration, & insurance card. Everything in one stack.

In addition I keep (in case of an accident) all information I have to provide to the other driver neatly typed on a piece of paper. That would include my contact address (office), phone number, insurance company name and policy number, driver's license number and plate number for the car, and the registration number.

I have a form I made out for the other driver to provide that same information.

But my insurance company requires a police report with each accident so this becomes redundant.

 

[Super Trucker]

First off, I doubt you are stopped each day. So any time you are at a checkpoint is going to be minor in the grand scheme of things. Your doubt might be wrong, look at my screen name and think really really hard what I do for a living.

Then will you be one to complain when your vehicle is struck by an uninsured or drunken motorist? Checkpoints get rid of both of these. Thats what they said in Germany

I have been through three checkpoints as a motorist. My registration, insurance and license were checked and it took all of three minutes. I am in my late 60's and been driving for over 55 yrs as a licensed driver. For the last 35 yrs, I have been driving over 80,000 miles per yr so the time I have spent at a checkpoint is so small that is is not even a factor. I have spent more time waiting for accidents to be cleared on interstates.


Late for an appointment??? Please, you can do better than that. There are several reasons this will not take place. You are more likely to have a flat tire, a dead battery or an accident than be stopped at a checkpoint. Also, if you are running that late for an appointment, you are likely a procrastinator that puts off doing things until it is making you speed to get where you are going. Would you like to guess again, because you are very mistaken. Again remember what I do for a living before making ASSumptions.

What is your time worth? Same as mine. Not much. I make a good living but my time is not worth anything unless it is being measured in hours. You possibly will stand and shoot the breeze with someone for longer in a day than you would be at a checkpoint. It is not the time you spend, it is the way you perceive the time you spent. As an owner operator my time is not cheap, if I have to waste time because somebody forgot to read the constitution it sort of cuts into my bank account.

Now all this having been addressed, I find people with your viewpoint is usually putting up a smoke screen for something else. The last time I had someone complain about the time (less than 3 minutes) at a check point had a boat loat of drugs in their car that was found after their complaining. The time factor was not an issue, it was what may be uncovered during the stop. Yawn, do you really believe this? Again I ask do you really believe this?

Checkpoints are not running background checks. They simply accomplish what they were set up to do. You should see those that turn around after seeing a checkpoint to avoid some charge. And those that don't just have there time wasted. Yeah that makes me feel better.

Always remember, a guilty person complains more than the innocent. At a checkpoint, complain about the time they take and see how long you will be detained for in depth checks which may include a check for warrants. So you are saying if I complain they will get even and waste as much time as they have to to "FIND" a problem. Now the truth comes out. You should remember those of us that have had enough complain very loudly as well. If that is a crime I am very guilty then.

Wow just Wow.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

All the more reason for the RFID Bio-chip. The authorities can read the data as you pass by. If you have any drugs in your blood that can inhibit driving then you'll be taken off the road. Think of the lives it will save.

ps. Keep an ear out for anyone who complains about the idea of having a RFID Bio-chip implanted. They're likely to be guilty of something.

 

[ladder13]

Those airport checkpoints really bother me, they really waste my time.

 

[cmort666]

I pretty much stopped getting tickets when I learned to check my attitude and to project an air of affability and calm. I can't say for sure, but I think having a CCW permit may also have helped in my encounters with the police. It comes up when they run my name. I can think of a couple of occasions where I might easily have come away with a big ugly citation, but instead concluded the encounter quickly and with a cordial tone.

I pretty much stopped getting tickets when I stopped speeding.

I'm "Japanese" polite toward strangers. I'm NOT friendly, and I make no exceptions for cops or anyone else.

The last time I was stopped by the cops was for driving with my headlights off. My car has "automatic" headlights. Apparently, the streetlights on my street were so bright that the car decided that it was daylight.

During the stop, I acted in accordance with relevant Ohio law. I was polite, but not fawning. I wasn't carrying, so I said nothing about my CHL. I've had more than one person insist that people inform when NOT carrying. If it isn't required by the ORC, I'm not doing it.

If he'd wanted to give me a ticket for having my lights off, so be it. They were out, even if I didn't know it.