Traffic Stop

[Steve O]

My last traffic stop was for speeding. I did what I was taught in my CCW class; window down, hands at 10&2. Officer asked if I was carrying, I replied yes, and he said it was pretty obvious. He said he didn't need to see my permit or my gun, just drivers license and proof of insurance. He asked what type of gun I was carrying, told me to slow down and to have a nice day.

 

[MaximumLawman]

I'd rather deal with a cop with a bad attitude about non-cops carrying guns than deal with a friendly cop on traffic stop in a state where it's considered to be constitutional to stop and detain people just to check their license, insurance and registration. How the heck is that kosher vis a vis the 4th amendment?

Originally Posted by AirForceShooter View Post
Rule:
Never have your papers where you keep the gun.

Never leave you papers in your car period. They usually have your address on them and not all criminals are morons. Some of them can figure out how to work a garage door opener and also can infer that if your car is in the parking lot, there's a good chance you're not home. Throw in a gun in the glovebox for good measure and you make it more difficult for anyone who IS home to defend themselves when the burglar comes calling.

 

[Super Trucker]

As I stopped an officer approached, introduced himself and said they were checking for license, registration, and insurance.

Is that even legal?

 

[frito1]

As I stopped an officer approached, introduced himself and said they were checking for license, registration, and insurance.

Is that even legal?

I reckon, it happens all the time. I've seen it ever since I've been driving. My guess is that it's legal as long as *everyone* is stopped (no profiling). The intersection near my house is a common location. I see them there all the time, but I typically approach from the opposite direction and turn in my drive before I get to them.

This casts a bad light on my deceased BIL, but goes along with the story. My BIL was country in a way most folks can't even fathom. He grew up on the farm and hardly strayed from it (just for beer and Copenhagen). When he was about 25 y/o he was pulled over in the farm's truck by the local state police captain, a man that had known him all his life. When he asked my BIL for his license his reply was I don't have one. Captain Ward sez, you mean you left it home? BIL sez, No, I don't have one, never needed one til now. And that's when the butt chewing started. My sister was a witness to this and would have crawled under the seat if she'd a fit.

Anyway my BIL had been on a beer run a mile or so past my house. When he came back through the road block was set up. Being the quick thinking country boy that he was he pulled right up to the cops and then turned into the rice field right beside them. He made a big show of putting on his hip boots, grabbed his shovel and made a round through the field checking the levees. The field didn't belong to the guy he worked for. When he came back to the truck he told them "Ya'll have a nice day" got in the truck, went back the way he came without a question asked, and went back to the farm by another route.

 

[frito1]

Never leave you papers in your car period. Throw in a gun in the glovebox for good measure and you make it more difficult for anyone who IS home to defend themselves when the burglar comes calling.

Ahh the benefits of living the the sticks. If you want in a car, many of them in my part of the world aren't locked. Probably more now since most new ones come with remotes. I don't know where you live, but in my neighborhood this time of year a high percentage of trucks have at least on rifle in them, guns in the back windows of trucks are commonplace, unlocked doors are a regular occurrence, and when I walk through the parking lot at work I could show you 15-20 cars/trucks with the keys in them. Registration in the glove box has never been an issue till the traffic stop the other night. The Ruger in the glove box was just one of the three handguns in the truck at the time. Two never come out and if there weren't three of us in in my x-cab yoda there would have been an AR in the back seat.

 

[cshoff]

So they were doing a "show us your papers" stop? Even though there was no probable cause or reasonable suspicion to believe you had done anything wrong?

 

[Rastoff]

Right make, right color, of a car that had been used in a commission of a crime. That's probable cause.

 

[Capt Steve]

I keep my registration and proof of insurance clipped behind the garage door opener on my visor. It is convenient and out of the way. No need to reach across to the glove box or open the center console. My truck gun is usually holstered under my seat where my right hand can easily reach. In my state they know you have a permit as soon as they run you but I would always disclose up front as it's nothing I'm ashamed of. YMMV

 

[cshoff]

Right make, right color, of a car that had been used in a commission of a crime. That's probable cause.

The way it was described in the OP led me to believe that this was a check-point where they were doing a "show me your papers" check on every car that came through. That is NOT probable cause.

 

[Rastoff]

Oops, I just re-read the OP. You're right, I must be confusing this thread with a different story.

One day I will learn to think before I type.

 

[markush]

I only read the first page and am so amazed at what I didn't see that I will not waste anymore time on this thread...what I didn't see was that no one sees a problem with road blocks set up to "check your papers"!?!? REALLY???!!!

 

[jhde69]

"check your papers" sheriff is back door of me will have to talk to him. Thay will do safety checks at road blocks once or twice a year memorial day and labor day but not just a check your paper stop.

 

[StanNm19]

They do "safety checks" in my neck of the woods, 2 or 3 times a year. You would be amazed at the amount of drunk drivers, drug arrests and fugitives are taken into custody during these checks. Those are the major things being looked for here. A lot of warnings are issued for insurance verification or expired license, so not much hassle there. I feel like if they stay true to that mission, power to 'em. There are a lot of folks taken off of the road that have no business being there and therefore possibly untold numbers of lives saved. I have nothing to hide so why should i be troubled by these making the roads safer? Just my opinion.

 

[KJM]

I have nothing to hide so why should i be troubled by these making the roads safer? Just my opinion.

First they came for the Jews and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for the Communists and I did not speak out because I was not a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak out for me.

Todays Version:

First they came for the hackers.
But I never did anything illegal with my computer,
so I didn't speak up.

Then they came for the pornographers.
But I thought there was too much smut on the Internet anyway,
so I didn't speak up

Then they came for the anonymous remailers.
But a lot of nasty stuff gets sent from anon.penet.fi,
so I didn't speak up.

Then they came for the encryption users.
But I could never figure out how to work PGP anyway,
so I didn't speak up.

Then they came for me.

And by that time there was no one left to speak up.

 

[StanNm19]

Wow......it must be a terrible thing to live in fear all the time.

 

[Lost Lake]

I can assure you I speak up when they attempt this ploy into disturbing my life.... Arrest me, I'd rather stand up for what I believe than let them get away with it.

Once I was waiting on a MAJOR highway at a traffic jam... I crested a hill and suddenly traffic was stopped and cars were swerving around stopped cars, I had to slow FAST and watch out for the traffic behind me to be sure I wasn't crushed. Semi's were locking up their trailers, and the smell of brakes hung in the air. I thought there must be a heck of a wreck up ahead. I finally made my way to the front and saw traffic cones and traffic being routed into two lanes around a center point. This was a 4 lane highway and it was nearing nightfall. The traffic came to a stop abruptly and there were many near collisions as people realized they had to go from 70mph to a dead stop....

Finally I could see the carnage I knew would be there, only to find a couple of officers 'taking a survey of how citizens use the road' for development purposes.

I was shocked and so mad I couldn't see straight! I said, "You mean to tell me you are stopping traffic on a freeway almost causing accidents and creating a traffic jam for over a mile for a survey? Are you out of your MIND?!?!?!

"Yes sir, please pull into one of the stations up ahead and an officer will take your responses."

I replied, "Your actions will end up killing someone and it amazes me you could be so careless! You can shove your survey up your you know what!" And with that I did the best possible burn-out a mini-van could do and tore off down the road. I was actually hoping one would follow me and stop me because I'd gladly have my day in court.

I came back down that road only a half hour later and the 'survey crew' was gone. Maybe they realized they were going to kill someone. Maybe enough people complained.

I don't know what the answer is, and stopping to check for alcohol is a great idea, but I hope the officers running the show realize stopping traffic on a highway or busy street will cause traffic jams and accidents. They need to make allowances for that.

 

[Bratastic007]

I have nothing to hide so why should i be troubled by these making the roads safer? Just my opinion.

At the risk of hijacking this thread, the "I have nothing to hide, so why should I care" mentality can create a slippery slope and be taken to scary extremes rather quickly.

I usually drive the speed limit (or a reasonable amount over) but I'm still opposed to enforcement by speeding cameras. I don't beat my wife either, but that doesn't mean I'm OK with the police putting a camera in my living room.

As a gun owner, would you be opposed to providing a DNA sample every time you want to purchase a firearm? You know, just to be sure you haven't raped anyone recently?

You prevent big oversteps by the government by protesting the small ones.

 

[Rastoff]

StanNm19,
You should be concerned because it is a clear violation of the 4th Amendment. Just stopping people to check for registrations is an unreasonable search. It is a ploy used by cities to generate revenue. Having the correct paper doesn't make the streets any safer.

Now, had they been looking for a real bad guy, like I incorrectly stated earlier, it would be different.

 

[StanNm19]

You're right, that was pretty poor planning on a "check point" location. No since in getting people hurt by trying to keep people safe. I still don't know if your act of careless driving was the best way to make your point though. It would have been a shame to injure someone in the process.

I would argue that a public roadway is a little different than my living room.

In my case they didn't search for my documents. They asked to see them. I have given them no reason to search for anything. And if you will go back and re read my posting, I think that I portrayed this particular situation as a situation where they were looking for the "major" infractions. As I stated a lot of warnings were being issued for the less serious stuff.

I am sure that not all of these check points are used the same way as the ones that I have had the opportunity to be witness to. This has just been my experience, and I am not advocating an irresponsible approach to law enforcement at all. I am sure that others have horror stories to tell.

 

[frito1]

They do "safety checks" in my neck of the woods, 2 or 3 times a year. You would be amazed at the amount of drunk drivers, drug arrests and fugitives are taken into custody during these checks. Those are the major things being looked for here.

That's pretty much how it goes here. They pick up a lot of n'erdowells and get 'em off the street. Call it a safety check or whatever, lil sis works for the state police, she says they call them saturation's. I live in a wet county that's surrounded by dry counties, so there's lots of potential to get DUI's caught up in their dragnet. It's usually the county sheriffs, state police, and local PD, the arrest/violation stats are posted in the local newspaper the next day or two. Normally the stops are in non congested areas, if traffic gets to backing up they'll wave enough through to prevent any accidents.

The only time I've seen anything close to profiling/questionably illegal stops is when I attended the state MC rally one year. Every MC leaving the rally was stopped, cars were flagged through. Upside of it was, if you were sober enough to stop your bike and pull out your license, you were sent on your way.

As long as the LEO's are professional, I don't get heartburn about it.