Trigger Pull for a Duty/Carry Weapon

[Halc]

Many of you probably saw my earlier thread trying to understand which way to go with Apex Kits and Trigger Work. Everyone seems to recommend trigger work so I'm a NooB trying to do his homework

Anyway, what I have learned so far is that the
- M&P 45 (mid-sized)(My Gun) supposedly ships with about 6.5lbs Trigger Pull.
- The DCAEK would bring result in about 5.0-5.5lbs Trigger Pull
- The FSS would result in about 4.0-5.0lbs Trigger Pull
- The Competition Kit would result in about 2.5lb Trigger Pull

So, today's question(s)
- What is the "recommended" trigger pull for a Carry Gun? If there even is such a thing, realizing there are lot's of factors.
- What Guns might I find on my LGS rental shelf with 4.0-5.0 lb trigger pulls to actually try.

THANKS,

 

[Carnage_7]

Best weight for my carry gun: 5-6 lbs. Others will chime in with different responses. It's a subjective debate and depends on the shooter.

 

[g_conway]

I think it depends on your level of training, and what you do for a living. LEO's and others who use guns for a living can probably be safe with a lower trigger pull than someone like myself. In a fight or flight situation I feel comfortable with no less than 4 Lb. (mine is right at 4.5 Lb)

 

[1blindref]

All of my CCW's are double action only. Most are Sigs with the DAK trigger. The trigger pull on them is 6.5 - 7lbs.

 

[OKFC05]

Everyone seems to recommend trigger work

I don't. Most other instructors I know also recomend caution with modifying a carry gun.
I even shoot a stock M&P Pro 5" in IDPA/SSP and USPSA Production, and feel no need for a lighter trigger. You see, I am a long-time revolver shooter and find the stock M&P trigger just fine.

There are two categories of shooters who AWAYS want to modify the M&P trigger: those who want it to be as like their 1911/2011 as possible, and those who want to modify every gun they get.
For the rest of the shooters, some do, some don't.

My recommendation to is take a gun class or two with a stock M&P and learn to shoot it. Then you can make a rational decision based on your training and experience.

 

[stainless1911]

How do I get a FSS to pull at 3 pounds?

 

[growr]

okfc05 is absolutely right with his advice! Get some training first before you modify anything.Then shoot the heck out of it.

Randy

 

[StatesRightist]

It depends on the gun in a general sense, J frame revolvers can be smoothed for example, but lessening it much is asking for FTF's. Ideal trigger pull depends on the shooter and the type of gun. I like 3.5 for 1911's and 4-5 on other guns.


To answer your specific M&P example, 2.5 is too light, a case of the nerves and you could easily get an unwanted discharge. Any of the rest ought to be fine.

OKF makes a good point. You need to realize anything you do to alter the gun is subject to scrutiny in the aftermath of a shooting. Doing anything that changes the way the manufacturer sets the gun up can and probably will be questioned. As a general rule of thumb, there are industry norms for the various aspects of a gun. My understanding from expert witnesses is that 3.5 is considered the bottom of the normal band of trigger pulls, anything under that can be argued as abnormal. You will have to decide what you can and can't live with in the area.

I will say this though, I answered you from a Carry Standpoint only. If you are LEO etc you should check with your Dept Policy, I'm sure they have set requirements/standards. My opinion is I would find a stock gun I liked and not alter a thing. The scrutiny level police shootings get and the deep pockets of Government are not conducive to giving a Plaintiff anything to question, in my opinion.

 

[stainless1911]

A clean shoot is a clean shoot. I wouldnt even answer questions of that nature.

 

[StatesRightist]

Questions in court are not asked on an optional basis....

 

[Dragon88]

- What is the "recommended" trigger pull for a Carry Gun? If there even is such a thing, realizing there are lot's of factors.

The stock trigger that comes with the gun. People who recommend trigger work for average people are usually those who only use their guns at the range for punching paper. Carrying a gun is a very serious matter, and the last thing you want is a super light modified trigger when the adrenaline is pumping and six pounds feels like three, or three pounds feels like one.

If you can't place accurate shots with a 6-7 lbs trigger, you need more training and practice, not trigger work. Take the $100 or whatever you are planning to spend on trigger parts, and spend it on a basic pistol course. That will do much more for you in the end.

 

[stainless1911]

Amendment 5 says they are.

 

[Rangel]

With the exception of when the govt. interferes, gun makers usually have a good reason for setting their triggers up the way they do and I'm not a big proponent of changing them. Especially for C&C, I leave my triggers right where the manufacturer set them.


For some people, who are involved in serious, organized competitions, I can see why they'd do it--it begins to make sense. A similar case can be made for a police officers, provided they train with that gun/s (too many train too little) they really might require a very light trigger. There are some very rough neighborhoods officers patrol, where getting off a very quick shot is important in a bad situation.

Most of the guys with I see with 2.5 pound trigger pulls have no real reason to require such. The really, really good shots--the aces in competitions, don't talk about how light their trigger is, informally on or off the range, unless you ask them and they want to divulge. Their performance does the talking.

Honestly, some of the folks with really light triggers tend to brag about their 'hairpin triggers' and along with bragging, they often have other bad habits. I don't feel comfortable safety wise at the range with that sort, to the point where I don't go out to the free, open air range with my family, because of the 'loose screws' out there, some of them boozed up, shooting modified weapons.

 

[stainless1911]

The only reason to modify a weapon or its ammunition is to increase its accuracy. That increase in accuracy is an increase in safety. With a safer, more accurate firearm, there is less chance of an innocent being shot.

 

[StatesRightist]

Stainless, Have you actually been on the stand in court, ever, outside of traffic court?

Taking the 5th can be used against you in civil matters and it does not win you any friends in a criminal trial. Second of all, they take your gun and test it, take it apart, check for alterations etc. So when I said raise questions I did mean things you will always be the one to answer. Also, if you are LEO and involved in a shooting, hopefully your Dept will stand behind you, in that case you absolutely will be testifying or you are done.

 

[StatesRightist]

did not mean you will always--typo

 

[1fly2ty]

OKFC
You made excellent points but one of them is slightly misguided! You said you have a stock M&P Pro and the trigger is just fine and your right but, a stock M&P does not have the same trigger as your pro version! I worked in a LGS and ordered and own M&P's 5 of them and the Pro trigger is excellent and the regular M&P's are basically garbage but with a small amount of work which almost all IDPA and USPSA shooters do,can be as smooth and clean breaking as the PRO version! JMHO.

 

[Rangel]

Courtroom lawyers will typically ask for a gun involved in a shooting to be examined for modifications. If you're in a shooting, your gun will typically be taken into state custody, pending legal hearings. It will be a while before you get it back. That's one reason why I never C&C a trophy gun in public.

If they see that any modifications have been done to the gun, especially the trigger, they very often will make the shooter out to be, to put it nicely, 'over zealous' - 'out to get people' or worse. Sometimes the jury and even a judge will buy that B.S. hook, line and sinker and an otherwise 'justifiable shooting' maybe deemed a liable offense.

Fair?--no, not usually, but that's justice in America today.

 

[stainless1911]

I got a Pro, and I hate the trigger, can't wait until I can get the FSS, RAM and Comp Spring.

I don't feel comfortable carrying it until after I get it modified.

OK, so if asked why the gun was modded, I would just tell them the truth. I didnt feel that carrying a gun with a trigger like it was, would be a safe thing to do.

 

[stainless1911]

Cant hit c r a p with the M&P, and its a 5", I can out shoot myself with the 3" XD any day of the week. Its a nice gun, with great potential, but it needs work. S&W just didn't finish the gun before it went into production.