UPDATE with letter--Rairity and Value - PreWar 2" M&P

Round Butt vs Square Butt - Follow the Catalogs

Insofar as what was available, and what was being sold, I'm a big believer in following
the catalogs. There are arguments that marketing was slow in updating these documents,
but these are what the dealers were ordering from. Except, of course, special orders.

As far as I can tell, the 2" square butt was never cataloged before 1939 or 1940. The 2"
barrel was only offered, in the catalogs, in round butt, at least as of 1938 . Here is a
clipping from the 1937 - 1938 catalog:

mikepriwer-albums-mlp5-picture7389-1937-1938-dealers-prices.jpg


We know there are 2" square butts made prior to this date, but, generally, the market
was not officially aware of it, judging by the catalogs. Clearly, some knew about it,
but not the general marketplace. So, prior to 1937 - 1938, square butt 2" guns ought
to be very scarce, on this basis alone.

These next two clippings are from the 1940 All Model Circular:

mikepriwer-albums-mlp5-picture7388-1940-amc-rb.jpg


mikepriwer-albums-mlp5-picture7387-1940-amc-sb.jpg


You'll notice that 2" barrel lengths are now offered in both round butt, and square butt.
Of course, this is leading into WW2, so I don't know how many 2" K-frames were
actually made.

I now skip ahead to the 1950 All Model Circular:

mikepriwer-albums-mlp5-picture7386-1950-amc-rb.jpg


mikepriwer-albums-mlp5-picture7385-1950-amc-sb.jpg


Here again we see that the 2" barrel is being offered in both butt configurations. Also
noteable is the very large price increase over the 1940 prices - almost a 70% increase.
We also notice that the AMC is reasonably in sync with engineering. The guns are
referred to as " The New .38 Military & Police", and the pictures show the redesigned
fish-hook hammer.

Regards, Mike Priwer
 
The 1934 price list stapled to the back inside cover shows the M&P round butt available for $32.00 in 2,4,5,6" with rubber stocks. The square butt only shows 4,5 and 6" barrels.

They must have printed more than one version of the 1934 price list. I finally found my Retail Prices 1934 list and there is no mention of a 2" offering in any of the M&Ps, just 4,5, and 6 inch tubes.
Ed
 
What a great and informative thread this is.
I'm very curious on one picture in this thread and find the need to hijack.
Regarding the "clipping from the 1937 – 1938" the round butt M&P listed at $26 and the square butt at $26.40. These priced don't appear to be right for 1937/38? In the 1925 price list they are $32.00 (round) & $32.50 (square). The "magna stocks" listed makes the catalog date about right.

Maybe I cannot see the forest for the trees and missing something here, why are the prices lower?

I have noticed on earlier price lists the round butt and square butt being referred to as round handle and square handle. Just thought I'd add that useless tidbit.
 
I'm glad this thread came back. I had lost track of it, and it's nice to be reminded of the excellent information here.

On the question of value, the last two prewar 2" M&Ps that I saw sold at auction (one recently, the other about six or eight months ago) went for about $1300 each with low to moderate bidding activity. Both were RB blues.

Those prices in the '37-'38 listing look like dealer prices rather than the factory's proposed retail prices.
 
Hi
Here is a picture of one of my carry guns. It is a frame from a round butt 32/20
from 1903 the frame is 1902 ist change, the cly is from a 1905 38 special 1938
and the barrel and ejector rod are from a post war pre model 10 from 1952.
The grips are 1920 - 1929 k frame round butt.
It shoots good target shot from 20 feet 6 O Clock hold with 148 Gr rem wad cutters. The good thing about this is it can not be taken as a real pre war 2 inch because the frame is a 4 screw frame and the serial numbers.
Jim Fisher.

bmg60-albums-pre-war-terrier-picture10257-dscn0636.jpg
 
Regarding the "clipping from the 1937 – 1938" the round butt M&P listed at $26 and the square butt at $26.40. These priced don't appear to be right for 1937/38? In the 1925 price list they are $32.00 (round) & $32.50 (square). The "magna stocks" listed makes the catalog date about right.

Maybe I cannot see the forest for the trees and missing something here, why are the prices lower?

Because of intense deflation during the Great Depression.
 
Hi
Here is a picture of one of my carry guns. It is a frame from a round butt 32/20
from 1903 the frame is 1902 ist change, the cly is from a 1905 38 special 1938
and the barrel and ejector rod are from a post war pre model 10 from 1952.
The grips are 1920 - 1929 k frame round butt.
It shoots good target shot from 20 feet 6 O Clock hold with 148 Gr rem wad cutters. The good thing about this is it can not be taken as a real pre war 2 inch because the frame is a 4 screw frame and the serial numbers.
Jim Fisher.

Jim, that is exactly the type of "adaptive reuse" that intrigues me. Guns that show some thought and care in the rebuilding process rise out of the category of "Frankengun" and become something new and interesting in their own right.
 
Prices of many items and commodities, as well as wages, dropped significantly during the Great Depression. The problem being that as the Depression progressed, most consumers had even less money to spend, if they had any at all. That didn't change until the USA became involved in WWII, and became "The Arsenal of Democracy."

I remember my childhood family home, which my father bought in 1938 for about $2000 (he was one of the fortunate ones who had a reasonably good job). It would probably be at least a $150,000 house today.
 
I just wanted to add that my sole example of a prewar 2" M&P (pictured below) is serial numbered within 20 of the one that Big Fred started this thread off with. However, my notes indicate that this one has been verified as shipping a bit later (June, 1934). Nevertheless, I wonder if it'd also letter as being furnished to a law enforcement agency. I might just have to finally get around to doing that and report back.

jhemaq.jpg
 
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Looks like 67699X will be for sale patent on hammer and trigger, very nice think its 1937 FBI or SS officer not sure he was working in Washington DC pre war.
 

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