UPDATED***Over Reacted last Night, Probably Over Thinking It Today.

[Smoke]

I was out walking my dog last night. I was actually cleaning up after her when I heard what I am absolutely convinced was a gun shot from the parking lot at the end of the building, maybe 75 feet away. I actually remember thinking “Oh **** my wife is going to hear that and think it’s me.”

I’m not sure how to explain it but there was a second where I just kept cleaning up the dog mess before reality set in.

First thing I did was drop the poop bag (believe it or not my mind actually processed the decision to do so) and start moving out of the light and toward the building and away from the sound of the shot.

As I got to the side of building I heard two more shots in rapid succession. At that point I drew my gun and started scanning for threats.

I don’t know if my training kicked in or my mind was just working overtime but I remember actually reminding myself that I had no idea what was going on and that whatever it was I wasn’t getting involved unless someone pointed a gun at me. Then it occurred to me that the last thing I wanted was for someone to look out their window after hearing the shots and see me sitting there with a gun, so I put the gun in my pocket (which was a mistake if only because I could have lost it in the dark if it fell out of my pocket I should have put it back in the holster or kept it in my hand.)

Now I’m thinking the smartest thing for me to do is get the Hell out of Dodge, so I start backing down the building to the other end. As I came around the corner I ducked into the stairwell of the building and I remember taking time to look at the building address because I knew I was going to call the police as soon as I was under cover.

So I got into the building, dialed 911 and waited while the phone rang and rang and rang and rang and rang. The fact that it took so long for anyone to pick up had me a little freaked out and I was pretty shrill when I finally got someone on the phone but I gave her my location, the nearest cross street and told her what I had heard. I aslo told her where I thought the shots came from in relation to the known location (intersection)

She told me the police were on the way and to stay where I was. I told her that I thought the shots came from the building I was in and had no intention of staying there. I then told her exactly what I was wearing (making no mention of the fact that I was armed) in case the cops showed while I was getting back to my apartment and left the building.

On my way back to my building I could see where I thought the shots came from and I called 911 back told them who I was and that it didn’t appear that there was anyone where I thought I heard the shots from and that no more shots had been fired. They actually seemed upset at me for calling with the update.

And that’s the last I heard I don’t even know if the police ever showed up.

So, I think I over reacted by drawing my firearm and I think I panicked a little on the phone.

What do you guys think I did wrong?

 

[ralph7]

Well, they are selling fireworks since New Years is less than a week away.

 

[Smoke]

Well, they are selling fireworks since New Years is less than a week away.

Fireworks only sound like gun fire on TV

 

[arjay]

I don't think you did anything wrong at all.I am surprised they never contacted you though.Was this in the springs?

 

[BrianE]

Better to be safe, than sorry... I dont see any wrong doing on your part.

Did you ever finish picking up after the dog?

 

[oneill45]

I personally cant say you overreacted at all. We have all had different experiences in life which make everyone react differently no matter how much training we have.

Last year on my day off of work I just got back form getting lunch when a truck took a corner fast, then made a hard right into a driveway and slammed into a parked car in that driveway. The two occupants bailed in different directions. I was always trained "If it doesn't involve your wife of your life, stay out of it if youre not on duty." My neighbor comes out and yells "hey youre law enforcement right!? these guys just slammed into a car and ran off." So at that point I was screwed when people were asking for my help. I called the local police and let them know what happened and then started walking to the scene

Im in plain clothes and have to pull out my cc piece and go into a backyard of a house to clear that area. Other than my neighbor no one knows who I am and Im running around with a gun in broad daylight.
After I cleared that area I start walking back out and holster my gun and pull my shirt down to cover it again. Right when I do that a deputy pulls up gets out of his unmarked car and starts suiting up. He sees me and asks for ID. Due to the fact that one of they guys they were looking for was a medium build hispanic male. And he was said to be armed. If he saw me holstering my weapon walking out of that backyard he would have thought that guy was me. I could have had a shotgun barrel in my face.

Long and short I think there is always going to be instances where we think we could have done something different or better, once we see the outcome. You had no idea that there was going to be nobody in the area you heard shots. What if there was? You would have needed that gun.

If there was actually one of the guys that bailed in that backyard and he was armed like I was told afterward, I would have need my firearm as well. The hardest thing to ever do is stay calm, dont get tunnel vision and remember your surroundings. Where you are. Whats around you. Remember your training.

I think you did good.

 

[Smoke]

I don't think you did anything wrong at all.I am surprised they never contacted you though.Was this in the springs?

Yes, Academy and Austin Bluffs area

 

[Doug M.]

This is why I have use the bluetooth earpiece for my cell (mandated in the car) just about all the time. I want to be as handsfree as possible in a situation like that. Drooping the poop bag and getting out of there, then calling 911 ASAP seems like the right idea.

 

[vigil617]

Smoke, the only thing I can see that you possibly did "wrong" -- and understanding that you were reacting to what you thought was gunfire, though you did not see what was going on -- was that you drew your weapon in the absence of a threat to you.

It is one thing for LE to draw while investigating a scene where shots have been fired. It is quite another for us, as civilian CCW licensees, to do so. I might take some heat for saying this, but I believe that we should avoid drawing or showing or brandishing our weapons unless there is a clear and present danger to us or to others of death or serious bodily injury.

As you correctly pointed out, you didn't want anyone to see you standing outside with a gun drawn under those circumstances, and holstering would have been the best choice, but putting your pistol in your pocket was a good one too.

Having said all this, I can't say I wouldn't have drawn, too, in a situation where I was startled by gunfire or perceived gunfire close by. I just know I shouldn't, and that the only time I should draw my weapon is if I am prepared to use it then and there -- which requires the aforementioned threat of bodily harm.

 

[sunnyd]

Unless you are wearing a badge, retreat when possible.

 

[Clovishound]

Smoke, the only thing I can see that you possibly did "wrong" -- and understanding that you were reacting to what you thought was gunfire, though you did not see what was going on -- was that you drew your weapon in the absence of a threat to you.

It is one thing for LE to draw while investigating a scene where shots have been fired. It is quite another for us, as civilian CCW licensees, to do so. I might take some heat for saying this, but I believe that we should avoid drawing or showing or brandishing our weapons unless there is a clear and present danger to us or to others of death or serious bodily injury.

As you correctly pointed out, you didn't want anyone to see you standing outside with a gun drawn under those circumstances, and holstering would have been the best choice, but putting your pistol in your pocket was a good one too.

Having said all this, I can't say I wouldn't have drawn, too, in a situation where I was startled by gunfire or perceived gunfire close by. I just know I shouldn't, and that the only time I should draw my weapon is if I am prepared to use it then and there -- which requires the aforementioned threat of bodily harm.

One potential problem with having drawn your weapon is this scenario: You have drawn your weapon, and a cop shows up. He assumes you are an armed criminal. At best, you end up handcuffed, and having to explain yourself. At worst, the cop feels threatened and fires at you.

 

[Smoke]

My biggest issue with this incident is that I feel like I panicked last night and ultimately that’s something that only I can judge.

A couple of posters have said they thought I heard fire works. I won’t argue the point but I will tell you that when it happened I was (and still am) 100% convinced that I heard gunfire and I reacted based on that assumption.

By the time I heard the second set of shots I was scared to death. I think I held it together pretty well until I couldn’t get 911 on the line, that freaked me out pretty bad.

I won’t say that I was in a blind panic because I was consciously assessing the situation. I was thinking about things like “What if someone sees me with my gun and thinks I’m the one that fired the shots?” “Exactly what do I need to do if the cops show up while I’m unassing the area?”

I was also worried about my dog and what would happen to her if the cops showed up and took me into custody and I had the presence of mind that to decide that the first cop (if any) I saw my hands were going up and I was going to scream at the top of my lungs “I’m the one who called the police”. I also made sure I gave an accurate description of myself to the dispatcher and I decided to keep my mouth shut about being armed.

But I also know how I felt on the inside while all this was going on. I almost messed my pants at the thought of leaving that stair well and trying to get home. I did it but doing it scared the piss out of me.

I don’t remember paying too much attention to my dog while I was retreating down the side of the building. I normally put the leash on my wrist instead of holding it anyway so I wasn’t going to drop the leash and run in any event.

And yes I did look for the bag this morning but it was gone.

 

[Rastoff]

I think you did OK, but drawing the gun was premature without being sure of the situation. I think your realizing this and reholstering was wise.

When on the phone with 911, I would have given them my physical description and told them I was armed. This avoids them thinking you're the bad guy when they arrive. Also, this info almost guarantees a more rapid response.

Staying put or leaving is impossible for us to evaluate. We don't know the area. If you can see the bad guys, and they haven't seen you yet, staying out of sight is preferred. Because you didn't know where they were, it was probably better to get out. My preference would have been to get to a well lit place and call the cops from there and wait for them to arrive.

 

[Wingmaster]

I think you did good.
It is a lot easier to say now, but I would have drawn my weapon. I would assume you weren't holding it out in front of yourself waving it back and forth. I would have had it down at my side and ready.
You heard shots fired. That is reason enough to draw your weapon. I would have had it ready and tried to safely get the heck out of there.
I think I would have called 911 from home. My home.

Just my thoughts
Wingmaster

 

[kyf]

It's always easier to evaluate a situation from the outside looking in rather than being in the middle of it. That said, none of us were there, in the same place, same time and same circumstances as you were. We can all tell you what we "think" you did right or wrong but the fact is you were unharmed and you have the opportunity to "overthnk" it instead of lying in a hospital bed, jail cell or worse. The past is gone. Live, evaluate and learn from the experience. Good for you for thinking your way through it instead of panicking. I hope I am never put in that type of situation but if I am my hope is I can return to my family like you did.

 

[Martya]

The only thing I wouldn't have done is walk near or towards where I thought the 'fireworks' were. After initially getting under or behind some sort of protection, I would then prudently retreat from the problem area, calling 911.

I think drawing with a perceived threat only 25 yds away is not improper; at the very least have your hand discretely on the weapon, ready, and be sure to cover again as soon as appropriate. And everything else you did was what I envision I would do considering your description of what happened.

 

[pawncop]

Smoke,

I give you a B+. As you correctly determined, since there was not a direct threat drawing your sidearm was premature. It is understandable being startled, especially if you have not had many situations like this.

Reading about situations, talking them through, discussing them on boards like this truly does not prepare you for the real deal.

Should this happen again or something similar you will be much better prepared.

Do not over think or be overly self critical of your actions. No one was hurt and your learning curve was up several notches.

 

[Protected One]

Smoke;

Seems like you responded as well as any reasonable person could be expected to. Don't see anything that could be called "wrong", given the circumstance.

The only thing I believe I would have done differently was not calling 911 back. I would have let the police come and search the area, even though I didn't see anyone in the area I belived the shots originated. Who knows - there could have been a threat hidding nearby.

 

[vito]

Situations like the one you experienced add to my belief that a pocket holster is the way to go most of the time. It can be reassuring to keep one's hand in your pocket, holding your gun, ready to draw if necessary but not taking the gun out prematurely. I recall in Ayoob's book he described an incident where he saw what appeared to be a suspicious character in a parking lot, and so he placed his hand on his weapon and continued walking toward his car. I think being ready and able to draw a gun if needed is preferable to drawing and carrying the gun which might be easily misconstrued by witnesses. And getting a gun drawn from an IWB holster, in the middle of the winter when wearing a heavy overcoat, is not the easiest task.

 

[shouldazagged]

Situations like the one you experienced add to my belief that a pocket holster is the way to go most of the time. It can be reassuring to keep one's hand in your pocket, holding your gun, ready to draw if necessary but not taking the gun out prematurely. I recall in Ayoob's book he described an incident where he saw what appeared to be a suspicious character in a parking lot, and so he placed his hand on his weapon and continued walking toward his car. I think being ready and able to draw a gun if needed is preferable to drawing and carrying the gun which might be easily misconstrued by witnesses. And getting a gun drawn from an IWB holster, in the middle of the winter when wearing a heavy overcoat, is not the easiest task.

Precisely the reasons I've pocket-carried for fifteen years.

Smoke, I can't critique your actions because I'm an insatiably curious old fool. I think you were certainly wise to get the hell out of Dodge, where I'm afraid I might have stuck around to see what would happen after I called 911. From the eyebrows north I know getting away is the smart thing; but in all honesty I can't predict with any certainty what I might do if I were sure the fire wasn't directed at me.

It's sort of hard to do realistic training for that kind of event. You do the best you can with the information you have. I hope I would have acted as you did, possibly without drawing my gun.