Used Car Negotiating Advice

[Bullseye 2620]

Last Thursday morning, as I was pulling into the offices of our local telephone co-op, this horrible crunching, grinding noise erupted from the engine compartment of my beloved 2000 Chrysler LHS, all of the warning lights flashed and flickered, and the car went DRT -- dead right thar. Waited a minute, tried to start it again, same awful noises, no go. Couldn't even pull it into a parking space. Fearing the worst, I got on my cell phone and called my trusted mechanic to get it towed in.

Hoping for the best but fearing the worst, I was stuck at home all weekend, waiting for the diagnosis. That came yesterday just after lunch: blown engine, probably a piston rod, but definitely beyond repair. Cost to replace the motor, oh, about $5,000 for a re-manufactured engine. Hardly worth it for a 10 year old car with 153,000 miles on it, especially since I had an indication a while back that a $1,000 tranny overhaul could be expected soon, and, a new set of $500 Michelins was in the offing as well.

I have located a 2001 LHS in mint condition with just 32,000 miles on it and a clean Carfax report. Last Friday, the asking price was $9,444, which has now dropped to $8,999. I don't think -- based on some careful research -- that the dealer has more than $4,500 in the car, and would like to get it for $6,000. Pressed, I'd go to $6,500, absolute tops.

My question is, "what's the best way to get this really cherry ride for my price?" I've checked the KBB and Edmunds, and I think I've got the pricing worked out -- his and mine. So, I am looking for "tactical" (pardon the expression) advice. Of course, I could get something for less, but this car was priced at $30,000 new, and having owned three of them previously, since 1996, I'd like one (probably) last one -- they haven't been made since 2001, and I doubt if I will ever find another one with so little use.

Ideas? Tactics? Pics of my intended new ride follow:

Bullseye

 

[Skeptic 9c]

Just go to the Car and Driver or Consumer Reports or Autotrader and read the articles on buying used. Also check on line for estimated value. All that being said, are you SURE you want a Cry Co? (Sales creeps laugh, customers cry.)
Geoff
Who bought two Dodges in his life and regretted it almost immediately. (See "wall job.")

 

[godlessgael]

I always use cargurus because dealerships hate the site (which means it is probably really good for the consumer). the average nation wide price for the vehicle you posted was $6164, but the average mileage was 3 times higher.

i think $6k-6500 is a completely fair/acceptable offer.

 

[Ignatz]

Your in the ballbark with your offer, but its up to the seller. I bought my Escort for $ 1,800 with a window sticker of $2,800. He said, make me an offer, and he took the $1,800.
I offered $ 11,300 for a Volvo wagon that the dealer was asking $11,800 and he politely turned me down. I know for a fact that 2 months down the road that that car sold for $10,500.
Its all how the planets align with used car dealers.....and when I make an offer, I'm prepared to close the deal immediately.
Good Luck

 

[gjamison]

i'm in the used car business, cash is king. put 6 grand cash
in his hand. IMHO he has 4 grand in the car and i wouldn't
go over 6. it all depends on how bad you want it, also winter
is coming and cash is nice this time of year...

 

[GatorFarmer]

Don't be afraid to walk away. Ie to actually get up and leave, if your offer wasn't accepted. And don't get emotionally invested in having that particular car.

And yeah, cash is good. But... carrying around a big bag of 20s (the most useful of denominations) can be a problem in and of itself.

 

[Bullseye 2620]

i'm in the used car business, cash is king. put 6 grand cash in his hand. IMHO he has 4 grand in the car and i wouldn't go over 6. it all depends on how bad you want it, also winter is coming and cash is nice this time of year...

Good to hear from someone in the business, G. I think you and I are on the same wavelength. Loan forms, checks. . .not nearly as persuasive as good 'ole American simoleans. Thanks.

Gator, I've walked before, and it works. That's how I got my ex a brand new fully loaded Mazda 626 some years back for $300 over actual invoice. They literally ran out into the street chasing me.


Bullseye

 

[WNC Seabee]

I sold cars for several years back in the 90s.

- don't get emotional, it's just a car after all
- no need to tell the dealer his business...ie, don't go in spouting off about blue book and "knowing" what he has into it. That serves no purpose other than to irritate the dealer
- DO calmly walk in and say, "I'd like to BUY that car. To me, it's worth $X000 plus tax and plates. I have cash in hand if you'd like it."
- if he says no, thank him for his time. Hand him a note with your name and phone number, and tell him, "I'm going to find something today, call me if you change your mind". Then WALK away. He will ether stop you right there or let you walk. You need to be ok either way.


Personally, would decide my top price before going in and just offer that. Then be prepared to walk away from anything else. Vs. Trying to low ball and negotiate.

 

[Bullseye 2620]

I sold cars for several years back in the 90s.

- don't get emotional, it's just a car after all
- no need to tell the dealer his business...ie, don't go in spouting off about blue book and "knowing" what he has into it. That serves no purpose other than to irritate the dealer
- DO calmly walk in and say, "I'd like to BUY that car. To me, it's worth $X000 plus tax and plates. I have cash in hand if you'd like it."
- if he says no, thank him for his time. Hand him a note with your name and phone number, and tell him, "I'm going to find something today, call me if you change your mind". Then WALK away. He will ether stop you right there or let you walk. You need to be ok either way.


Personally, would decide my top price before going in and just offer that. Then be prepared to walk away from anything else. Vs. Trying to low ball and negotiate.

Excellent advice, Seabee. I have my top price in mind, but I was unsure as to whether to play "let's make a deal," or simply come at him straight up. I want this car, because I have had three before, I love the way they handle, and it really does have very low miles. But, as you say, it's just a car and I will be happy with something else if I can't get this one. I'll PM you later with a couple of additional questions that you are in a unique position to answer.

Thanks.


Bullseye

 

[truckemup97]

You're getting some great advice. Cash in hand, give him YOUR price, and let him make a decision. If he doesn't go for it, give him your contact info and walk. It's worked for me, even in a high-volume, high-pressure situation. Do it today or tomorrow. Don't wait until Saturday when they have a bunch of potential customers roaming the lot.

 

[cowboy117]

Cash talks,B.S.walks.Make him an offer;if he doesn't take it,give him your phone number and tell him to call you if things change.It's a buyers market[i'm a former car salesman].Get the car checked out,too.

 

[The Big D]

IMHO, the replies suggesting you walk into the office with cash in hand are spot on...and I suspect you will drive that car home.

However, don't go there with a bag of $20's. Sixty (60) fresh $100's will likely seal the deal.

Good luck.

Be safe.

 

[JohnnieB]

Sixty (60) fresh $100's will likely seal the deal.

Be sure to carry a copy of your withdrawal slip from the bank with you just in case you get pulled over for a traffic stop. Having all that cash on you might make our friends in blue suspect the dealer you are enroute to is selling something other than cars and confiscate the money if the field test for cocaine is positive.

Don't laugh - It happens. (Nearly all U.S. currency in circulation will test positive for cocaine)

John

 

[DeathGrip]

Any car over 5 years old is hard for them to finance.They would be foolish not to take your cash offer.We are talking cash here?

 

[shooboy]

Beautiful car, excellent low mileage example. I'd pay up to $7500 for that car all day. If you get it for $6K, you stole it !!!Good luck, great advice here, Shoo

 

[panther]

You're getting some great advice on dealing with the car lot. But, given your experience with the 2000 model, have you had this 2001 model checked out? I would want to be sure that the engine and tranny in it are in good shape before i plunked down $6,000 on it. It would be a shame to spend that kind of money and 1 year down the road have problems.
You could just spend the $6,000 on your 2000 model, have a new engine, tranny work, etc., and have years ahead of trouble free driving.
Is there any kind of warranty on the 2001?
Whatever you decide, they are good looking cars. I wish you the best of luck.

 

[HGWT]

I'm in the car business and the only thing that I could add is, go to the used car mgr to make that offer. If dealing with the salesmen he might not take it to the manger.Be strait up and nice with the sales manger.

 

[Bullseye 2620]

Checking It Out--Pre-Sale Mechanical Inspection

OK, folks. As to having the car inspected before I deal, it is located about 90 miles away from me in North Carolina. Now, if it were here, my local mechanic would do a top-notch inspection. But, he's not an option because no way is the dealer who has it going to let me drive home for an inspection and then return to close the deal (or not).

That being the case, how do I find a mechanic in the area where the car is located who can be relied upon to do a thorough and honest inspection?

Any ideas will be welcome.


Bullseye

 

[BarbC]

Are you a AAA member? Call and ask for a reputable and recommended mechanic.

Even if you're not a member, they may make a recommendation.

 

[BUFF]

After a good inspection and test ride, make a list of anything the car may need soon, like tires, and the cost of them.

Do your research. Have a firm, absolute upper limit price in mind. Say, $7,000 plus tax and license.

Get them to offer a price for the car. Say they want $8,000.

Point out the flaws of the car that need to be dealt with and that cost. Make your first offer a chunk under what you will pay, say, $6,000.

The dealer will likely make a counter offer, lower than what he asked initially but higher than you offered, say, $7,500. Bump your offer up some but not to what he wants. Offer say, $6,500.

You are now $1,000 apart. Point out you are not sticking him with a trade-in. Point out you have CASH in hand, you don't need financing, that you are willing to buy the car today.

He will hemm and hahh, probably discuss your offer with others, likely higher-ups. When he comes back, if his counter offer is still too high, offer to SPLIT THE DIFFERENCE between each of your last offers, his $7,500, your $6,500... Tell him you will pay $7,000. Cash. Right now.

Stick with it. Don't go higher than you first decided. Point out that you have come up in your offer as far down as he has. If he rejects that, leave your name and numbers and go. Avoid being lured in by his offer of aftermarket extended warrantees or other freebies to boost the percieved value of his price.

Go in with several days or weeks worth of your newspaper car classifieds folded up but in hand. if he won't take your final offer, thank him for his time and tell him you are off to look at some other cars. Then go do it.

There's a lot of nice cars for sale right now. Lots of inventory costing business owners money to just sit. And lots of places to find them.

I like buying new cars. It's fun for me. It just takes research, patience, timing and firmness. Politeness and civility always help.

 

[venomballistics]

First thing ... stay away from Chrysler friend ... the engines could be better executed with ducktape, tinkertoys and erector set parts.
And God have mercy on you if it develops an electrical glitch.

Now ... as a matter of accounting, car lots keep the invoices of the cars on the lot.
Ask to see the invoice, that states what they got it for. add a fair amount to the invoice so the shop can pay the minions and stand firm on that price.
if they will not show you the invoice ... walk off the lot.

 

[CAJUNLAWYER]

Go in there with $6k (and $500 in another pocket) and don't be afraid to walk if he says no. I like Seabee's answer.
MOST IMPORTANT-do NOT take Shooboy with you.

Beautiful car, excellent low mileage example. I'd pay up to $7500 for that car all day. If you get it for $6K, you stole it !!!Good luck, great advice here, Shoo

 

[P&R Fan]

Go in on the last day of the month. They usually have monthly sales quotas and if they're close they'll really want to make those last few elusive sales. Be nice but firm. YOU'RE in control and fully prepared to walk away. If they know they can't intimidate you, they'll deal.

 

[Bullseye 2620]

First thing ... stay away from Chrysler friend ... the engines could be better executed with ducktape, tinkertoys and erector set parts. And God have mercy on you if it develops an electrical glitch.

VB,

I've owned five Chryslers since 1990 (2 Daytona Shelby's and 3 LHSs) and haven't had any complaints. I'm a high mileage kind of guy.


Bullseye

 

[WNC Seabee]

Point out the flaws of the car that need to be dealt with and that cost. Make your first offer a chunk under what you will pay, say, $6,000.

The dealer will likely make a counter offer, lower than what he asked initially but higher than you offered, say, $7,500. Bump your offer up some but not to what he wants. Offer say, $6,500.

This is just horrible advice. As soon as you start "negotiating" you've lost. Now the dealer/salesman knows you want it and will hold firm. Now you're in the "you've decided to buy it, now we're just haggling over details" and it's much harder a) to walk away and b) to avoid rationalizing in YOUR mind, "well, it's just another $1,000 and I REALLY want it..."

If there are repairs needed (tires, glass, obvious stuff) make that part of your predetermined top-end price. The dealer knows what's what and what the car needs, you don't need to educate him. And, unless you are in this type of sales for a living, you won't out negotiate the pro.

Best bet is to know what you're willing to pay, offer it and either drive home or walk away.

 

[venomballistics]

VB,

I've owned five Chryslers since 1990 (2 Daytona Shelby's and 3 LHSs) and haven't had any complaints. I'm a high mileage kind of guy.


Bullseye

Dont want to spar with ya TOO much but since 90 I had two dodges one Ford and one Buick.
I dont have either dodge, but I DO have the Ford and the Buick ... both odometers have counted higher than your current specimen.
87 stang is at 175K, 2000 century is closing the quarter mil mark.
My parents had a 98 stratus fresh off the lot and admittedly, an impressive performer .... it became a mild little suck muffin after only 15k ... pathetic at 25k my trust in the brand is DONE.

 

[Bullseye 2620]

A Question for WNC Seabee

This is just horrible advice. As soon as you start "negotiating" you've lost. Now the dealer/salesman knows you want it and will hold firm. Now you're in the "you've decided to buy it, now we're just haggling over details" and it's much harder a) to walk away and b) to avoid rationalizing in YOUR mind, "well, it's just another $1,000 and I REALLY want it..."

If there are repairs needed (tires, glass, obvious stuff) make that part of your predetermined top-end price. The dealer knows what's what and what the car needs, you don't need to educate him. And, unless you are in this type of sales for a living, you won't out negotiate the pro.

Best bet is to know what you're willing to pay, offer it and either drive home or walk away.

I am totally with you on this Seabee. I know what my max price is. I like this car, but don't have to have this car. I see no point in playing "let's make a deal" and trying to out negotiate a guy who makes his living doing this. I will carefully look the car over before we talk, check the tires for wear, check for panel damage, sprung doors, busted mirrors, etc., drive it, and if possible, have an independent mechanic put it up on a rack to look for leaks (oil, tranny fluid, brake fluid) and adjust my offer accordingly if I find something not too major that I don't like. For me, any leaks is a no-no. I want to see the undercarriage if at all possible.

I was going to PM you, but I may as well ask you here: can you recommend an honest, competent independent mechanic in the Ashe County area? I want to get permission from the dealer, take it for a test drive, and have the mechanic put it up on the rack and check it before I go back to make my offer.

Thanks.


Bullseye

 

[HEAD0001]

If you have good credit then CASH is absolutely NOT KING in either the used or new car market.

The dealers are making alot of money from the banks on kickbacks from the loan.

The best way to get a deal on any car-new or used it to have 10-$100 bills and a pen in your pocket.

Explain to the salesman that you have impeccable credit and you are not concerned about the loan for the rest of the money.

The problem with the car you are looking at is that it has low mileage, but it is still an older car. The banks do not look at mileage, they look at the year of the car. So in your case you might need $2,000 cash to show the dealer.

When you walk in with cash for a deposit in your hand that shows the dealer you are dead serious about buying. An by knowing you are going to do a loan through him it also lets him think he is going to make some additional money from you on the loan. So he can go lower on his price and then make up that profit on his back end(loan).

Tell them you have limited your decision down to three different cars at three different places. And you are going to buy a car that day. So where I get my best deal is where I will buy a car!! It is that simple. Do not be afraid to getup and walk out the door. And do so if you do not think you are getting the deal you want. You can always walk back in ther door an hour later. Tell them you are going to go have some lunch-think about their deal, and take one last look at the other car on the other lot. If they think you are going to another lot(really think that) then they will normally lower their price right there.

Just remember the dealer also has some leverage here. You can get a new car anywhere you want. But a used car is a different entity. And the one you found is also a very different entity. You are not going to find alot of them like you found. And the dealer knows that.

It really all comes down to how savvy you are. But remember the squeaky wheel does not always get the grease. Don't be hard to deal with or talk to, but be very very firm in what you say. And again, do not be afraid to stand up and walk out.

I retired from sales(all my life), and was a car salesman and used and new car Manager for many years. I always gave my best deals to nice people who had patience. Never the loud mouth. But I will also leave you with one last piece of advice. If you really like the car then buy it if you think it is an exceptional car. I can tell you this. I never let a new car buyer leave without my best deal because he can get a new car anywhere. But I let a lot of used car buyers leave when I KNEW I HAD a product that they could not find anywhere else. Tom.

 

[Bullseye 2620]

IBut I let a lot of used car buyers leave when I KNEW I HAD a product that they could not find anywhere else. Tom.

Thanks, Tom. My problem is that when I show up and give the guy my DL he will know that I drove 90 miles to come and see this particular car. No hiding that. But I am a nice guy and will be so with the dealer. I don't want payments, even if I can talk the bank into giving me a loan on a 10 year old car, which is a stretch. I will have the cash in hand. I'll drive the car, have it checked by an independent mechanic while I am out, and if everything is good, make the man an honest best offer. If he takes it, great. If not, I will give him my phone number and ask him to give me a call on my cell if he changes his mind, and head home. Like I say, I like this car, but I do not have to own this car.

Thanks again.


Bullseye

 

[HEAD0001]

Two flaws in your thinking.

First: You DO NOT have to finance the car. You just have to make the salesman think you are financing the car. After you buy the car they will take you to their finance manager to do the paper work. All you have to do is tell the finance manager you changed your mind. And you decided to pay cash. He will not like it, but the price is already on the buyer's order. I have done it many times. I buy one to three cars a month for old customers who call me all the time for advice.

Not sure why you are showing your drivers license until after you buy the car??

But even so, who cares. They still have no idea you are or are not looking at another car at the next lot down the street!!

You have the right attitude about walking!! You must have that attitude.

When they decide to sell their car it comes down to dollars and cents to them. Just exactly how much can they make from you. It is that simple.

So if they think they are going to make back end money then they will lower the front end price. It really is that simple. If you take away their back end by telling them you are paying cash for 100% of the car, then you are taking away part of their profit. It is just common sense.

You have to show some flexibility or they will let you walk on a car that they know no one else has. Keep that in mind. But as you said, be reasonable-and patient. And stand up and walk out and go have lunch. Then go back, who cares. Just doing that will get you another $500 or more off--I guarantee it. Tom.