Victory data base

[Absalom]

Btw, I can’t figure out how to post photos. Any help on that would be appreciated.

Click on Go Advanced below the Quick reply window, scroll below the text window to Manage Attachments, and follow the prompts to attach up to five photos from your device’s photo library. Works with smartphones and larger computers.

A four-inch barrel sounds unusual. Verify the caliber. Usually, those were the .38 Special guns and did not end up in Pakistan.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass! You have to be in advanced mode (Click Go Advanced) to upload up to 5 images per post as attachments. Your pictures should be no larger than 1920x1280 pixels and in a folder you can find on your desktop. If you are using a phone or tablet, get the app Tapatalk and use that. On a desktop, click Go Advanced and then click the paper clip icon (attachment), navigate to , select and upload a picture and repeat for more than one until you are finished. Add your text and submit.

There was a British repair facility during WWII called the Rifle Factory Ishapore. These guns should be stamped R.F.I. on the frame along with other info. They finished the guns after refurbishment with a black paint called Suncorite. The gun you are interested in sounds like one of those refurbished ones. I have heard they rarely put them back together without mixing up the parts. So, check carefully that all the serial numbers match...under barrel, face of cylinder, behind ejector star, inside of yoke arm (look through a chamber to see it) and on the butt of the gun. A mix-and-match gun will lose a lot of value. IMO you are already at the upper end of what I would pay for it, especially if you recoat it. I would bead blast and Parkerize it. That would come closest to a restoration. You can buy an AGI kit from MidwayUSA that will Park a bunch of guns for around $60. And, here's what it'll look like afterward.

 

[WaterDR]

Lots of great info.

Serial numbers all seem to match.

Here are some photos.

 

[Absalom]

Lots of great info.

Serial numbers all seem to match.

Here are some photos.

That is a five-inch, not a four-inch barrel, and definitely a Pakistani job.

Guy:
Ishapore, in India, did refinishes on these that we know of only in the 1960s, and those were year-stamped (see attached). RFI was only used once it was an Indian government facility. Exactly what the Pakistanis used is still a matter of debate, but it appears not to have been Suncorite. They did a lot of Enfield revolvers like that; most of my info comes from British militaria forums

PS: I must be getting old. Forgot about this discussion last year. This is an Ishapore-refinished example. Different type of black paint finish and year-stamped:

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...pore-victory-model.html?535226=#post139751329

 

[WaterDR]

Ok...so let’s set the stage. And yes...I think you are right...it’s a 5” but the tag at the LGS reads 4”

Anyway, gun was made in the US middle of 1944. It was sent likely to I India which was a British colony as part of Lend Lease. It ended up being refinished by Pakistan in the 1960s.

That about right?

So....if I can buy cheap enough and turn it into a nice shooter I am probably doing it justice because I suspect as a collectible it ranks very low.

 

[Absalom]

....
Anyway, gun was made in the US middle of 1944. It was sent likely to I India which was a British colony as part of Lend Lease. It ended up being refinished by Pakistan in the 1960s.

That about right?
.....

I’d modify that a little bit:
It was sent to Britain under Lend-lease and (since it’s late-war, likely as a resupply item) shipped and issued either to a British or Indian (at that time not independent) army unit in the India-Burma-China theater. After the war, the British left it there as armament of local forces or police, and after independence and the Hindu-Muslim war of 1948, it ended up on the Pakistani side of the new border. Sometime time before 1968 (in the absence of an importer stamp) a surplus dealer picked it up on the international “war junk” market, and it landed back here.

 

[WaterDR]

I’d modify that a little bit:
It was sent to Britain under Lend-lease and (since it’s late-war, likely as a resupply item) shipped and issued either to a British or Indian (at that time not independet) army unit in the India-Burma-China theater. After the war, the British left it there as armament of local forces or police, and after independence and the Hindu-Muslim war of 1948, it ended up on the Pakistani side of the new border. Sometime time before 1968 (in the absence of an importer stamp) a surplus dealer picked it up on the international “war junk” market, and it landed back here.

And I think that’s the story!

 

[walkcubs]

New Addition

Just picked up this Victory. Wanted to see when made. No refinish on this one. Action is perfect. I figure sometime in 1943. US Property and GHD stamp clean. Serial number is V4168**

 

[Victory Nick]

A Victory that has had it rough

I am new to this forum and will try to provide sufficient information on this revolver of mine. I have a Victory model serial number V610107. It is marked on the right side of the barrel 38 S.&W. CTG. I think it has been reblued at some point since most of its dull black finish is gone and most of the markings are faint. It has stars marked all around the cylinder and next to the barrel pin. As well as on top of the barrel. It has a broad arrow next to grip also. As well as one the back strap. It also has a P marked near the hammer.The lanyard ring was ground off. And had aftermarket grips on it that had x’s carved into them as well it looked like someone tried to redo the checkering. It was extremely dirty when I got it. If anyone can help me with the meaning of the markings that would be great.

 

[gordonrick]

Welcome to the forum, Nick. It just needs a little love...

 

[Absalom]

Just picked up this Victory. Wanted to see when made. No refinish on this one. Action is perfect. I figure sometime in 1943. US Property and GHD stamp clean. Serial number is V4168**

A nice standard military-shipped US Victory, likely shipped August/September 1943.

..... I have a Victory model serial number V610107. It is marked on the right side of the barrel 38 S.&W. CTG. I think it has been reblued at some point since most of its dull black finish is gone and most of the markings are faint. It has stars marked all around the cylinder and next to the barrel pin. As well as on top of the barrel. It has a broad arrow next to grip also. As well as one the back strap. It also has a P marked near the hammer.....

You have a British Service version of the Victory chambered in .38 S&W, not Special. It’s originally from mid-1944. The “dull black finish being mostly gone” makes me think of a possible post-war arsenal paint job; the many star marks also point in that direction as they are neither factory nor standard post-war British marks. A picture or two in natural light would be really helpful, also close-ups of any markings.

 

[Victory Nick]

A nice standard military-shipped US Victory, likely shipped August/September 1943.



You have a British Service version of the Victory chambered in .38 S&W, not Special. It’s originally from mid-1944. The “dull black finish being mostly gone” makes me think of a possible post-war arsenal paint job; the many star marks also point in that direction as they are neither factory nor standard post-war British marks. A picture or two in natural light would be really helpful, also close-ups of any markings.

I will try to get some pictures tomorrow.

 

[DWalt]

Just picked up this Victory. Wanted to see when made. No refinish on this one. Action is perfect. I figure sometime in 1943. US Property and GHD stamp clean. Serial number is V4168**

V4189xx shipped in 9/43

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass, Nick! If it has black paint on it, it was likely worked on at one of the UK's arsenals in India or Pakistan. They put a stove paint on them called Suncorite. No telling what the stars are for. The P is an acceptance stamp when the military received the gun. The broad arrow is a sold out of service stamp when the gun was transferred into private hands. Take pictures with the grips off so we can see anything that may be stamped on the sides of the grip frame.

 

[Absalom]

....If it has black paint on it, it was likely worked on at one of the UK's arsenals in India or Pakistan. They put a stove paint on them called Suncorite. No telling what the stars are for. ...

Guy is exactly correct. I had to jolt my memory and check with Charlie Flick, one of our database keepers, who reminded me that I actually knew this once, but the stars are more like asterisks and are re-work marks most likely from Ishapore in India. Most revolvers worked on there have an RFI and year stamp on the barrel (see my post #1804 above), but the asterisk stamping has been attributed to them too. Most were imported by Century Arms. Is there a CAI stamp somewhere? It might not be there because the gun somehow made it here before 1968.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

the stars are more like asterisks

When the Brits nitro proof tested the cylinder chambers and barrel, they stamped a crown. I don't know what they might have used in India/Pak but it could be a bare crown that looks like a star.

 

[Victory Nick]

The black paint is over 90% gone (little spots here and there). And a dull matte finish is left over. I do not remember seeing any CAI markings and will take pictures when I get home. Thank you all for the feedback so far.

 

[Victory Nick]

More pictures to follow


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[Victory Nick]

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[Victory Nick]

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