This is the second post you've made designed to provoke me, and the second I've ignored.
Which one of us is the troll?
Was I out of line?
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This is the second post you've made designed to provoke me, and the second I've ignored.
Which one of us is the troll?
theur,
You responded, right? That being the case, you did not ignore my post so your response does not make sense. Neither of my posts were designed to provoke anything except logical thought. Instead of reponding to my statemnts, you make an unfounded accusation. You have presented your opinions and myself as well as others have tried to logically explain why we don't think you are correct. You evidently did not come here to learn or gather information from the well experienced participants of this forum.
You will not accept the opinions of others, so why should your statements be taken as knowledgeable information? You are not open to discussion, only to argue. That is why I have come to the conclusion that you are a troll. Dean
You responded, right? That being the case, you did not ignore my post so your response does not make sense. Neither of my posts were designed to provoke anything except logical thought. Instead of reponding to my statemnts, you make an unfounded accusation. You have presented your opinions and myself as well as others have tried to logically explain why we don't think you are correct. You evidently did not come here to learn or gather information from the well experienced participants of this forum.
You will not accept the opinions of others, so why should your statements be taken as knowledgeable information? You are not open to discussion, only to argue. That is why I have come to the conclusion that you are a troll. Dean
BuckeyeChuck
Member
You are *technically* correct, but unfortunately, the world doesn't work on technicalities. It works on human relationships, and nowhere is this more important than the small business world.
I have a small IT consulting business. I have many, many friends who also have their own independent consultancies or small consulting businesses. We all operate by the following set of rules.
(1) If you have a client and we're in the same line of work, I will not approach that client for any work unless you refer me.
(2) If you refer a client to me, I will ask you what you want for the referral. It's simply bad form not to ask. Most of my friends say the same thing I say when asked this question: "I want nothing. I know you'd do the same. Don't ask me this question again."
(3) If I am subbing for you, that is your client and all additional requests for work will be given to you.
None of these are law, of course. But they are the policies of people of character who prize the humanity of their compatriots and competitors. They are the natural relations between people who believe that helping you be successful is something that will help me be successful. There are many ways in which this is realized, just beyond client referrals:
(1) You have a network of people to whom you can turn when you cannot help a client. Clients don't forget that you knew somebody who could help them.
(2) You build a network of people who vouch for you personally and professionally. This is critical when clients ask "Do you know this guy?" and the answer is "You're talking to Chuck? You should get him RIGHT NOW because I've seen him help others in your situation."
(3) You have a built-in Angie's List to rate clients and (even worse) recruiters. Nobody knows clients and dirtbag recruiters better than the consultants who've gotten screwed by them.
(4) Last, and certainly not least, you have fellow experts to whom you can turn when technical solutions elude you. I have *never* refused to advise a competitor when they call for help, and I often seek their counsel when I need an answer in their area of expertise.
So, the guy who takes a fellow guy's client (especially on a sub job) has technically done nothing wrong. But he's a dirtbag, and if the network knows the dirtbag clients and recruiters, it also learns quickly who are the dirtbag consultants. You do NOT want to be on that list. You will never get off of it.
One last thing: this attitude and behavior of which I write is based on two simple realizations. First, there will never be a shortage of paying clients for people of integrity who do quality work. This is true in IT, building trades, medical services, legal services, whatever. Thus, we aren't fighting over a tiny pie; rather, the pie is bigger than we could ever eat, and we help each other find larger slices of it. Second, character is more important than money. Ultimately, it is NOT about a lost sale. It is about helping your fellow man better himself by comporting yourself in a manner befitting a man of good character.
RIDE-RED 350r
Member
IMHO, the comment made by the OP while maybe not the best ettiquette, seems innocent. Big difference between what he said and flat out offering to buy the gun from the seller in front of the dealer. Which apparently he did not. I completely understand why a dealer would not tolerate transactions between customers on his premises, I get it. But this was nothing like that. Dealer over reacted, period.
geodimeter
Member
You're forgetting that that there are two sides to every argument (or deal). A third person giving their opinion is not welcome. This was the wrong place to be voicing an opinion.
feralmerril
Absent Comrade
Aint we wore this one out yet?
keith44spl
Member
Who's runnin' Your Show?
Feralmerril,
This ol hoss may have jest twitched an ear!
We's better lite in on him again...
Or Not !!!
Under my roof, I like to be the one doing the buyin' & sellin'
Su Amigo,
Dave
Feralmerril,
This ol hoss may have jest twitched an ear!
We's better lite in on him again...
Or Not !!!
Under my roof, I like to be the one doing the buyin' & sellin'
Su Amigo,
Dave
The OP made a mistake. He learned something.
I'll tell you one thing, if I made the same mistake, an honest mistake because I didn't know any better, and a gunshop employee or owner was rude to me, maybe it would be MY boot in thier behind.
I work customer service everyday and have worked at two different gunshops part time. No the customer isn't always right. But there's a right way and a wrong way to confront them about it.
In our society of guns, we should be helping and teaching those less experienced. If someone makes a mistake, pull them aside and explain what they did. Tell them never to do it again. See what happens and what their reaction is and take it from there. You may gain a customer for life. That's the TRUE goal of any business. Your customer base grows, so do sales. Which means more money.
The badass "I'm the owner" routine doesn't work. This ain't the old west.
I'll tell you one thing, if I made the same mistake, an honest mistake because I didn't know any better, and a gunshop employee or owner was rude to me, maybe it would be MY boot in thier behind.
I work customer service everyday and have worked at two different gunshops part time. No the customer isn't always right. But there's a right way and a wrong way to confront them about it.
In our society of guns, we should be helping and teaching those less experienced. If someone makes a mistake, pull them aside and explain what they did. Tell them never to do it again. See what happens and what their reaction is and take it from there. You may gain a customer for life. That's the TRUE goal of any business. Your customer base grows, so do sales. Which means more money.
The badass "I'm the owner" routine doesn't work. This ain't the old west.
I don't even disagree with you on that. If you and others in your field want to agree on a set of ground rules amongst yourself - that's fine.
But that's not really what the OP is about. It's about imposing these rules on customers. You can't demand customers to play by rules they aren't even aware of, then bust their balls when they don't. Nor should you complain if there are competitiors of yours who decide they don't want to play by the rules of the group. Ultimately, competition benefits the customer.
In fact, in my line of work, it's unlawful for us to take money for referrals because it's bad for the client.
But this is all a long way from yelling at a customer for talking to another customer.
feralmerril
Absent Comrade
Thirty years ago my ex wife pulled one that I coulda choked her out on. I guess I/we had been shopping for life insurance. I was newly married at almost mid age to a young squaw and I guess I was trying to get serious.
Unbeknown to me, she invited two competeing insurance salesmen over to the house to SHOW UP AT THE SAME TIME! Her idea was to make each "prove" his insurance was better. A pair of guys from A.L. Williams showed up and a guy from I forget what other company. The straight life insurance guy blew his stack (I think rightfully so) and said he was reporting the A.L. Williams salesmen to the state commission.
Unbeknown to me, she invited two competeing insurance salesmen over to the house to SHOW UP AT THE SAME TIME! Her idea was to make each "prove" his insurance was better. A pair of guys from A.L. Williams showed up and a guy from I forget what other company. The straight life insurance guy blew his stack (I think rightfully so) and said he was reporting the A.L. Williams salesmen to the state commission.
The customer is NOT always right, whoever thinks that is a fool.
Sebago Son
Member
... and very inexperienced in sales.
Yes but, experience alone doesn't neccessarily mean that you know how to talk to customers.
Even stupid, hard to deal with customers deserve to be treated with dignity and respect until such time they no longer deserve it. Then it's time to calmly ask them to leave.
A pissing match between salesperson and customer is detrimental to business. Even if your in the right.
Agreed. The minute you show SOME customers that you believe they are "always right" they will take advantage of it.
Customers that pull the "customer is always right" card are the worst to deal with. Because no matter what you tell them, your wrong.
feralmerril
Absent Comrade
I belive attitude and demeaner is almost everything on a job. I recall three guys out of 300 that I worked with that were nit pickers and went by the book to the letter. They knew every obscure order we had that probley was out of date by years! They seemed to PO everyone they handeled. Every shift they had contention and trouble. They were always technicaly right in every case, yet they were in habitual trouble on the job. Your demeaner can cover a lot of mistakes. I hated to work with those three guys.
Just this past winter we had some flooding in my area, nothing like the mighty Missisippi overflowing, just some basement flooding. As expected, there was a run on sump pumps, my local hardware and HD were all sold out. 3 days after the rains subsided, dozens of "defective" sump pumps reappeared at Home depot. All the customers said they were "defective" and wanted refunds. HD has the policy, more or less, the customer is always right so they took em' back. Does anyone seriously think all the pumps were defective? Who pays for this "customer is always right" nonsense.....yep, YOU and ME. The store passes along the costs to the rest of us. Shame on those who gamed the system.
AND???? That excuses bad behavior from customers? theurbaniatch or whomever you'll be tomorrow
bubbiesdad
Member
Just got back from our LGS, guy came in and wondered if he could get a refund for a deposit on a gun which was on order. Seems his son is in the Air National Guard and he found a place where he could get a military discount. He got the refund.
ladder13,
I think you are probably wasting your time with theur/blackflag/ whomever. You can only reason with a reasonable man. Whomever has more excuses than a burgler on his way to jail. Part of that 3 billion HD make was from the higher prices we all pay because of low life bums that purchase items and then return them under false pretenses. I agree with your PM 100%. Dean
I think you are probably wasting your time with theur/blackflag/ whomever. You can only reason with a reasonable man. Whomever has more excuses than a burgler on his way to jail. Part of that 3 billion HD make was from the higher prices we all pay because of low life bums that purchase items and then return them under false pretenses. I agree with your PM 100%. Dean
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