MichiganScott
Member
Venomballistics was not the OP, but the hat still works regardless of who's posting.
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What do you think?
- Thread starter Boox
- Start date
Venomballistics was not the OP, but the hat still works regardless of who's posting.
chaparrito
Member
You still have not answered my original question. If you chose not to believe Duane and the other people in the industry, why do you think there is a shortage and where do you think the powder is going?
I have my tinfoil hat on..................
Good. My Alcoa stock keeps going up.
venomballistics
Member
now now ... there are two theories presented, both having plausibility. one, more than the other.
The powder plants are still raining powder, while we see dust where powder should be.
Either theory presented would fit better than official explanations
joeintexas
US Veteran
I have to think Duane is trying to be straight with you for more reasons than just hoarders. Look at how many new people are getting into not only the shooting sport but also reloading. A couple of years ago you could go into nearly any gun club and start shooting, today it's not uncommon to have to wait for an extended time to get a lane. Add to that the fact that some folks shoot a lot. I dropped in to the local gunshop this afternoon and he had one can of Autocomp left on the shelf, from a shipment he just got in yesterday. And yes, I did buy it.
SW_shooter
Member
First, JBnTX, I'm just a few minutes away, whatcha want to trade for that powder? 
Second, I'm not an expert nor do I know where all the powder is going. But I can tell you this. I have talked at length with an owner of a reloading supply store. (mom and pop if you want) He tells me he has several hundred pounds of powder on order. When he does receive a shipment he never knows until he opens the boxes what he got. He says that the bs law that limits powder to 100lbs on a truck at a time is one of the problems. It's not 100lbs per customer, it's 100lbs TOTAL no matter how many individual customers have orders. So if there is another powder order on the truck his may not get on or it may be limited. This gentleman limits how much he puts on the shelf at a time, not to limit it to "regulars" but to limit guys from trying to clean him out all at once.
As to the OPs problem of finding one particular type of powder, well... sorry man. I wish you better luck in the weeks to come. But being rude to a guy via email when he's being kind enough to respond is just not polite.
Third, I saw some Bullseye for sale on a website and the guy wanted $75/lb.....
no way am I buying powder for that price!
Second, I'm not an expert nor do I know where all the powder is going. But I can tell you this. I have talked at length with an owner of a reloading supply store. (mom and pop if you want) He tells me he has several hundred pounds of powder on order. When he does receive a shipment he never knows until he opens the boxes what he got. He says that the bs law that limits powder to 100lbs on a truck at a time is one of the problems. It's not 100lbs per customer, it's 100lbs TOTAL no matter how many individual customers have orders. So if there is another powder order on the truck his may not get on or it may be limited. This gentleman limits how much he puts on the shelf at a time, not to limit it to "regulars" but to limit guys from trying to clean him out all at once.
As to the OPs problem of finding one particular type of powder, well... sorry man. I wish you better luck in the weeks to come. But being rude to a guy via email when he's being kind enough to respond is just not polite.
Third, I saw some Bullseye for sale on a website and the guy wanted $75/lb.....
no way am I buying powder for that price!Ok, evidently I need to clarify a couple of things. I will selectively respond to some of you, to all of you, I say thanx for your comments.
First off, I don't need no "tinfoil hat" thank you very much, but what I wrote, originally and follow-up are MY experiences. As to michiganscotts query, 'where do I think the powder is going', I don't know, that was the reason for my first letter to them. Am I skeptical about his answer, YES. Was I discourteous, that's a matter of opinion, I have mine, you have yours, that's the beauty of a forum like this.
No, I don't think Duane was lying, I personally think his answer is much like other answers when products get scarce in a free market. I do think his answer was a rerun of the answers we got when it was primers, and along the lines of the current 22 rimfire and the component shortage. I think that.
As to smutt's comment, an oversimplification to say the least, but after 68 years here, most of my family here, property, beautiful country, nice summers, great hunting,excellent fishing, and even the lousy winters, I ain't moving, least of all to the left coast, nuff said.
peterthe fish, I thank you for your lesson in economics and how business works, I would never have known that. But let me add that in 50 years of working for a living, owning my own business, selling wholesale and retail, buying all kinds of things, raising a family, I never knew that, thank you again. BTW, I never was a rain dancer though, missed that experience. So, go be condescending elsewhere.
NUFF SAID
me again
First off, I don't need no "tinfoil hat" thank you very much, but what I wrote, originally and follow-up are MY experiences. As to michiganscotts query, 'where do I think the powder is going', I don't know, that was the reason for my first letter to them. Am I skeptical about his answer, YES. Was I discourteous, that's a matter of opinion, I have mine, you have yours, that's the beauty of a forum like this.
No, I don't think Duane was lying, I personally think his answer is much like other answers when products get scarce in a free market. I do think his answer was a rerun of the answers we got when it was primers, and along the lines of the current 22 rimfire and the component shortage. I think that.
As to smutt's comment, an oversimplification to say the least, but after 68 years here, most of my family here, property, beautiful country, nice summers, great hunting,excellent fishing, and even the lousy winters, I ain't moving, least of all to the left coast, nuff said.
peterthe fish, I thank you for your lesson in economics and how business works, I would never have known that. But let me add that in 50 years of working for a living, owning my own business, selling wholesale and retail, buying all kinds of things, raising a family, I never knew that, thank you again. BTW, I never was a rain dancer though, missed that experience. So, go be condescending elsewhere.
NUFF SAID
me again
LoboGunLeather
US Veteran
Developing new products takes time. I suspect that a new gunpowder product requires many months, perhaps a couple of years, of testing and ballistic laboratory work to determine satisfactory applications, charge weights for various calibers and projectiles, etc, before it can be offered to the public. Such projects are undertaken with a marketing plan, timeline, and budget, so when the R&D work is completed the company has a considerable amount invested in the new product and needs to get it into production to start recovering that investment.
I suspect that is why Alliance has continued to add new products; as the research and development work is completed it is time to go to market with the product.
By the way, I agree with others who have pointed out the negative, accusatory, and argumentative nature of your correspondence with the Alliant rep. The gentleman was polite and helpful in responding to your first inquiry, and I don't blame him a bit for not replying to your second.
novalty
Member
I believe your first post and your most recent post don't coincide with each other. Then again maybe I'm a liar too.
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(1) It is interesting how these "shortages" seem to be localized. Ohio, Kentucky, Michigan, parts of Indiana and eastern Pennsylvania, in short, APPALACHIA, seems to be relatively well-stocked in both ammunition and reloading supplies. We have had some slow times and can't get too picky when it comes to brands, but it's nothing like the drought some people keep bringing up, over and over again. Maybe it's because we have always had a lot of guns and bought a lot of ammo?
(2) Let's see - people everywhere are buying firearms and ammunition at rates unseen in American history. There are only so many factories to produce the stuff. Companies are in the business of making money. When they make money, people complain. Now people are claiming that they are deliberately dogging it and NOT making money??? Everyone who has the wherewithal is producing as much as they can, as quickly as they can, and making a lot of money, you bet!
(3) And everybody, from top to bottom, is stashing away "a little extra." If I'm saving an extra 5 pounds, how many TONS is Hornady, Remington and Winchester warehousing??? And I'm not blaming them. They are producing 24/7 and they need to maintain their supply chain.
(4) It took my little LGS a bit of time to get any pistol powder in quantity. We always had rifle powder but somehow, no one is much interested. And even now, customers are finicky no matter what anyone says.
Typical conversation:
"GET ME SOME PISTOL POWDER - ANY PISTOL POWDER!!!"
"Okay, Mr. Jones, we are on the phone literally daily with our distributers. When we get some, you will be first to know."
Later, in the same scenario, we get a package deal on 20 pounds of powder....
"Hello, Mr. Jones - yes, you were in three times last week asking for pistol powder? It took a lot of wheeling and dealing, but we got in 10 pounds of Power Pistol and 10 pounds of 4227 and will save back a couple bottles if you want."
"Uh, you got no 231? What I really, really want is some 231! Call me when you get it, thanks."
And so it goes...
(2) Let's see - people everywhere are buying firearms and ammunition at rates unseen in American history. There are only so many factories to produce the stuff. Companies are in the business of making money. When they make money, people complain. Now people are claiming that they are deliberately dogging it and NOT making money??? Everyone who has the wherewithal is producing as much as they can, as quickly as they can, and making a lot of money, you bet!
(3) And everybody, from top to bottom, is stashing away "a little extra." If I'm saving an extra 5 pounds, how many TONS is Hornady, Remington and Winchester warehousing??? And I'm not blaming them. They are producing 24/7 and they need to maintain their supply chain.
(4) It took my little LGS a bit of time to get any pistol powder in quantity. We always had rifle powder but somehow, no one is much interested. And even now, customers are finicky no matter what anyone says.
Typical conversation:
"GET ME SOME PISTOL POWDER - ANY PISTOL POWDER!!!"
"Okay, Mr. Jones, we are on the phone literally daily with our distributers. When we get some, you will be first to know."
Later, in the same scenario, we get a package deal on 20 pounds of powder....
"Hello, Mr. Jones - yes, you were in three times last week asking for pistol powder? It took a lot of wheeling and dealing, but we got in 10 pounds of Power Pistol and 10 pounds of 4227 and will save back a couple bottles if you want."
"Uh, you got no 231? What I really, really want is some 231! Call me when you get it, thanks."
And so it goes...
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venomballistics
Member
(1) It is interesting how these "shortages" seem to be localized. Ohio, Kentucky, Michigan, parts of Indiana and eastern Pennsylvania, in short, APPALACHIA, seems to be relatively well-stocked in both ammunition and reloading supplies. We have had some slow times and can't get too picky when it comes to brands, but it's nothing like the drought some people keep bringing up, over and over again. Maybe it's because we have always had a lot of guns and bought a lot of ammo?
(2) Let's see - people everywhere are buying firearms and ammunition at rates unseen in American history. There are only so many factories to produce the stuff. Companies are in the business of making money. When they make money, people complain. Now people are claiming that they are deliberately dogging it and NOT making money??? Everyone who has the wherewithal is producing as much as they can, as quickly as they can, and making a lot of money, you bet!
(3) And everybody, from top to bottom, is stashing away "a little extra." If I'm saving an extra 5 pounds, how many TONS is Hornady, Remington and Winchester warehousing??? And I'm not blaming them. They are producing 24/7 and they need to maintain their supply chain.
(4) It took my little LGS a bit of time to get any pistol powder in quantity. We always had rifle powder but somehow, no one is much interested. And even now, customers are finicky no matter what anyone says.
Typical conversation:
"GET ME SOME PISTOL POWDER - ANY PISTOL POWDER!!!"
"Okay, Mr. Jones, we are on the phone literally daily with our distributers. When we get some, you will be first to know."
Later, in the same scenario, we get a package deal on 20 pounds of powder....
"Hello, Mr. Jones - yes, you were in three times last week asking for pistol powder? It took a lot of wheeling and dealing, but we got in 10 pounds of Power Pistol and 10 pounds of 4227 and will save back a couple bottles if you want."
"Uh, you got no 231? What I really, really want is some 231! Call me when you get it, thanks."
And so it goes...
Thats the long and short of it.
also, at least at the customer side of things. the new breed of reloader seems to get married to A single load, rather than embrace the full scope of the discipline.
if that load was a 230 grain FMJ over 231 in a 45 ACP .. thats all he's in the market for.
Us old school press drivers can, and do, load pretty much every bullet we have time to try, over virtually every flavor of powder that can work.
In 45 alone, I use Unique, Universal, power pistol, AA #2, AA#5, AA#7 and others behind a range of bullets.
when things get lean .. who do you think would have better odds?
EugeneNine
Member
Its not just .22 and powder, I've had to spend hours running around the city to get medicine for my son ever since the .gov started meddling in it.
