NJM15
Member
Cracks after 7 reloads no way to see that its going to happen, lucky no catastrophic results. 40 calibers one a Federal the other Winchester
What happens when you load too many times
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Rpg
Member
I've never had such short life from 45 acp, 38 special, 357 magnum, 45 Colt, 44 special or 44 mag.
For that matter, I've never had such short life from rifle brass including .308, 30-06, 270 Winchester, 350 Remington mag or even .375 H&H
Seeing your photos makes me think your loads are on the stout side, your brass is getting worked pretty heavily, your chamber is oversized, your chamber is unsupported and/or the cartridge is under engineered for the pressure involved.
Nothing your photos reveal make me likely to buy a 40.
Just my opinion, of course.
For that matter, I've never had such short life from rifle brass including .308, 30-06, 270 Winchester, 350 Remington mag or even .375 H&H
Seeing your photos makes me think your loads are on the stout side, your brass is getting worked pretty heavily, your chamber is oversized, your chamber is unsupported and/or the cartridge is under engineered for the pressure involved.
Nothing your photos reveal make me likely to buy a 40.
Just my opinion, of course.
scooter123
Member
I'll add to the question by asking how you are cleaning your cases. If you are using an Ultrasonic with a White Vinegar based solution that is the reason for your short case life. These cleaning solutions are mildly acidic and WILL leach the zinc out of the brass. When that happens you get VERY BRITTLE brass that doesn't last long at all.
Splits happen, I put mine in a box to go to the recycler when they crack.
Only cracks I ever had were in some 357 Mag Nickel and it was from some old ammo I broke down. Could have been ancient or loaded to hot.
As some have asked. More info is needed to determine why yours spit after 7 reloads??
What load? Suppose the gun could be a factor but doubt it.
How do you clean your brass? Using chemicals is safe but if left to long or mixed to strong it can weaken the brass,
As some have asked. More info is needed to determine why yours spit after 7 reloads??
What load? Suppose the gun could be a factor but doubt it.
How do you clean your brass? Using chemicals is safe but if left to long or mixed to strong it can weaken the brass,
The result of a split case is always unremarkable, and certainly not catastrophic. No luck involved.
That's not many........
Seven reloads is nothing. There is something amiss, hopefully bad brass or something that can be rectified easily. Some guns are especially hard on brass, something I wouldn't want in a gun.
Seven reloads is nothing. There is something amiss, hopefully bad brass or something that can be rectified easily. Some guns are especially hard on brass, something I wouldn't want in a gun.
Mcwsky09
Member
The result of a split case is always unremarkable, and certainly not catastrophic. No luck involved.
I would think a case head separation would be a more serious concern with greater possibility of injury.
Vulcan Bob
Member
When they split in the middle like that that's an oversize chamber working the brass too much. Could be a service type pistol that may have a chamber a bit large for reliability, cruddy ammo and such with no thought to case longevity. I have two Colt SAA's and with their over size chambers they will do that to .45 Colt case's after six or seven loadings. I keep case's for the Colts separate for just that reason.
fredj338
Member
Maybe, maybe not. Brass work hardens & splits like that, it happens. I agree, 7x seems too short, even for 40, but run max loads in a glock, it will happen sooner than later. How you clean your brass matters. Ammonia is bad, so is prolong citric acid cleaning.
I wouldn't worry about it. 40 brass is everywhere and even if you pay for it, the price is around three and a half cents per piece. So it cost you a half a penny each time you load it. How long is this stuff supposed to last?
Only 7 loadings? Sloppy chamber is my guess as well.
Do a Cerrosafe chamber cast and measure it.
Do a Cerrosafe chamber cast and measure it.
Without ANY information might as well say its due to Global Warming Or Polar Vortex.
fredj338
Member
Or blame it on George bush.
Scooter, please post a link to the information above. I would like to see where this information came from. At one time the Frankford Arsenal was using vinegar and salt to clean brass, as I understand it. I find it very hard to believe that their research would not have uncovered this if it were a fact, and I find it incredibly hard to believe that a mild acid like acetic would be capable of de-amalgamating a bimetallic case that is amalgamated on the molecular level.
Thanks in advance...
Yorkie Man
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I have had more 40 brass split like your picture than any other pistol caliber. Caused most likely by work hardening by firing and resizing. This caliber is very sensitive to the seating depth of the bullet. I wouldn't worry about it like the others have said 40 brass is plentiful.
scooter123
Member
Selective leaching - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I've used the white vinegar solutions suggested in various places on the net and after observing a "red dusting" in the cleaned brass I stopped using these solutions. Because that reddish tinge is a clear indication that zinc is being leached out of the brass.
I'll also point out that a table spoon of salt is commonly suggested as an addition to make the solution more effective and a product of the chemical reaction of sodium chloride and acetic acid is a much stronger acid, that being Hydrochloric Acid.
What I use for cleaning my brass today is a Thumlers Tumbler with stainless steel pins. As for the solution used, in about 2 gallons of water it's 2 tablespoons of dish washing soap and 1/4 teaspoon of Lemishine. After 3 1/2 hours of tumbling I get brass that looks nearly brand spanking new and handgun cases that can be reloaded for darned near forever with 45 ACP or 38 special. I am also getting very good life out of my 40 caliber cases but don't actually track the number of cycles, at a guess I have some that have 15-20 loads on them.
I've used the white vinegar solutions suggested in various places on the net and after observing a "red dusting" in the cleaned brass I stopped using these solutions. Because that reddish tinge is a clear indication that zinc is being leached out of the brass.
I'll also point out that a table spoon of salt is commonly suggested as an addition to make the solution more effective and a product of the chemical reaction of sodium chloride and acetic acid is a much stronger acid, that being Hydrochloric Acid.
What I use for cleaning my brass today is a Thumlers Tumbler with stainless steel pins. As for the solution used, in about 2 gallons of water it's 2 tablespoons of dish washing soap and 1/4 teaspoon of Lemishine. After 3 1/2 hours of tumbling I get brass that looks nearly brand spanking new and handgun cases that can be reloaded for darned near forever with 45 ACP or 38 special. I am also getting very good life out of my 40 caliber cases but don't actually track the number of cycles, at a guess I have some that have 15-20 loads on them.
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"I find it incredibly hard to believe that a mild acid like acetic would be capable of de-amalgamating a bimetallic case that is amalgamated on the molecular level."
My high school diploma just self-ignited after reading that.
My high school diploma just self-ignited after reading that.
11e40
Member
why worry about brass that only goes 7 loads. just go six loads & get some more brass. I usually load 4-5 times & discard, just to be sure. in my m1a only three loads. brass is cheaper than blown up firearms & eyes & trips to the E R.
Where in the link to Wiki states anything about vinegar and brass.?
A 5% acetic acid diluted in water (even with salt) is not going to change the composition of brass. It is so diluted.
1-2 cup of vinegar and a tablespoon of salt diluted in water to make on 1 gal will safely clean brass
If you leave it in there more the 15-20 minutes then the brass may discolor.
"Salt, or sodium chloride, combines with acetic acid from the vinegar to produce sodium acetate and hydrogen chloride."
Vinegar or Lem Shine (Citric ACID) whats the major difference? If you use Lem Shine perhaps just buy pure citric acid.
A 5% acetic acid diluted in water (even with salt) is not going to change the composition of brass. It is so diluted.
1-2 cup of vinegar and a tablespoon of salt diluted in water to make on 1 gal will safely clean brass
If you leave it in there more the 15-20 minutes then the brass may discolor.
"Salt, or sodium chloride, combines with acetic acid from the vinegar to produce sodium acetate and hydrogen chloride."
Vinegar or Lem Shine (Citric ACID) whats the major difference? If you use Lem Shine perhaps just buy pure citric acid.
chaparrito
Member
I use a tsp of citric acid and a big squirt of Dawn and usually wash 500 rounds or so in a 3 gallon pickle bucket. Figuring conservatively that's probably at least 2 gallons of water. It does a great job. The brass is only in the solution about ten minutes before being rinsed and laid out to dry. My water is so hard that that amount of citric acid barely sweetens it back to neutral Ph. No way it's leaching anything.
Only time I saw cracks like those were with a batch of once fired TZZ headstamp I bought some years ago. The whole batch was brittle brass and most split like that within the first few re-loadings.
fredj338
Member
Just google zinc leaching of brass. Exposing brass to acids or ammonia over time will weaken the brass &/or make it brittle. It will depend on how long you expse the brass to the acid or ammonia. A 10m wash now & then, probably not an issue. If the brass turns pinkish, you have removed zinc from the alloy, probably weakening the case.
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Maybe I do it all wrong but I continue to reload until a case splits. That, to me, is the only way you can tell that the case has seen it's last reload. I inspect them when I pick them up and again when I reload and pitch out the split cases. I don't think there would be any chance of having anything catastrophic occur.
Another thought; not all brass starts out the same. Some may already be harder from the git-go and 7 firings is the life of that alloy case. Since I believe case failure is mostly from "work hardening", if an alloy used for cases begins harder/brittler, it'll "work harden" sooner and fail sooner. Also the thickness of the case walls prolly helps determine the case life. Thin walled, brittle brass cases won't last as long as thick, malleable alloy cases...
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Bkreutz
US Veteran
I load between 50K and 60K 9mm rounds per year, when I find a split case I throw them in a cup next to my press. The first picture shows how many "splits" I've had in the past year. The next picture is obviously a closeup of the split. The last picture is what happens when a .38 Super Comp gets mixed in with the 9mm cases and goes through the sizing die 
. I have no idea how many times my cases get loaded. When I pick up brass at the range, I lose some of mine (too far forward of the firing line) but I make up by picking up brass that other shooters leave. I haven't bought brass in years, in fact I have a few 8# powder jugs full of 9mm brass squirreled away if I ever need to replenish the supply.
. I have no idea how many times my cases get loaded. When I pick up brass at the range, I lose some of mine (too far forward of the firing line) but I make up by picking up brass that other shooters leave. I haven't bought brass in years, in fact I have a few 8# powder jugs full of 9mm brass squirreled away if I ever need to replenish the supply.
