Why a 1911....

[MrJT]

For a dedicated home defense pistol?

I am in the market for a 45 ACP home defense gun. You know, a go to for when you have to get to the shotgun.

Talking to some fellow gun friends, I keep getting the recommendation of a 1911. All right. But why?

They are heavy, don't carry many rounds, and from my experience with them, not the most reliable thing in the world.

I've gone shooting with both of my friends who recommend a 1911. They both own one. One a Colt and one a Kimber.

On the same outing, both guns experienced a failure to feed when using hollow points. They shrugged it off and said well, this might not be the best brand ammo / right brand for my gun so I'll have to keep trying. Or I can just use ball ammo.

The owner of the colt said it's still a work in progress.

Well, we went out again a few weeks after that. Guess what.... The Kimber failed to feed hollow points even after some more work. This time, my nephew came with us. He brought his brand-new out of the box and M&P 45. He bought it that morning and this was his first outing. It ran 100% flawless.

Why is this acceptable? A new gun that doesn't feed hollow points and might need some work done to get it up and running? Why waste my time when I can go with an M&P 45 with more capacity and more reliability straight from the box, JHP or FMJ.

I seriously just don't get it.

And I hear people say oh I've shot thousands out of mine without a single hiccup. Sure OK. However, my first hand experience with two different models, two brand new models show me otherwise.

So again, why a 1911? It seems like a safer bet to go with a modern design that functions better.

Convince me I am wrong. Despite my negativity, I love the idea. I love the looks of the gun. I love its history. It's performance however.....

 

[Big Cholla]

John Browning designed the feed ramp and chamber of the M 1911 to feed .45ACP Ball ammo. No thought was given to any other design of projectile. We now are faced with twenty some odd different designs for the bullet that we expect J.M.B.'s 100 plus year old design to accommodate. The stock M 1911 needs to be 'tuned' for reliable feeding of your choice of ammo. That is the long and the short of the situation. Not every "Pistolsmith" today knows how to do that. The magazines usually benefit from slight alterations when leaving the Ball ammo bullets and going to another design. IMHO, when the M 1911 is mated with the right ammo and the right magazines and the right 'tuning' there is no better fighting handgun made. The ergonomics are right for most. The ability to recharge with a magazine change is about the best and quickest there is. The weight is conducive to getting many very accurate shots off in a minimum of time. The flat sided frame both holsters well and conceals with the best of them. The trigger pull can be tuned to be the best of all single action handguns. The safety systems are redundant making this handgun the safest to carry cocked and locked. For holster carry there are magazines available that carry 8 rounds giving one a 9 round gun. For home defense there are magazines that carry many more rounds with just a lot of magazine sticking out the bottom of the grip. IMHO, there has never been a better fighting handgun to have when starting a gunfight from a holstered position.

Yes, tuning needs to be done to optimize this handgun. When completed to your satisfaction you and your choice of defensive handgun will be "Good to Go". .....

 

[MrJT]

Thanks for your input.

It seems like you need to want a "project gun" when going 1911.

For those who don't though, I guess it's not the best option.

 

[Otreb]

You'll find anecdotal stories of just about any make or model pistol that 'sucked' at the range. I had instances when a Ruger revolver jammed, a Glock 21 slam fired, even an AK stuck a case.
Get a good 1911 of your own, enjoy it. It doesn't need to be a project if you get a decent gun.
The 1911 is a design, and there's a gazillion variations and makers of that design, meaning a ton of variations in functionality and quality.
Part of that is because it's an excellent design, it's well liked.
Probably the very best of triggers and delivery of .45acp ammo, fine accuracy low bore axis and insanely fast on target ergonomics.
Or, you'll hate it and get something else...but there's a reason the gun is still relevant and typically one of the most visible in the money sports.

 

[gregintenn]

Any 1911 I've had shot when you pulled the trigger. This spans everything from a Rock Island to a Colt Gold Cup. I shoot ball ammo in them. That is what they were designed to shoot.

If it isn't what you want, buy a Glock. I like the style and simplicity of the 1911.

Heck, We're on a Smith and Wesson forum. If you want 45acp, a revolver is always an option.

 

[samwood]

I purchased a then brand-new Colt 1911 (series 70) about 30 years ago. Unreliable with anything but ball ammo until I handed it over to a gunsmith; I've never had a problem with it again.

I currently own a Springfield Armory 1911, purchased within the last year, that has been completely reliable since the first shot.

I'd feel comfortable relying on either. That said, I have a Ruger P345R, with light attached, stashed nearby when I snooze at night. It is also useful for discouraging porcupines gnawing the bark off the trees in the yard.

 

[sellersm]

Just because the design is 100+ years old, doesn't mean the manufacturers are making them 100 years old! New 1911 models can and do perform excellently with modern ammo.

As stated, the 1911 is a design, just as the striker fired pistols are a design, as are the polymer framed pistols, etc. etc.

Most anything can be made to function to perform effectively in the home defense role. It all comes down to ergonomics: what do YOU shoot the best? What features work or don't work for YOU? Etc. etc. etc.

If it's a home defense firearm, what about a shotgun?

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

You are correct to look very critically at reliability. As far as weight, the 1911 is about right for the cartridge, but you can get aluminum-frame versions if you prefer. The 1911 fits most hands better than most other guns. YMMV.

Don't know much about bottom-feeding M&P pistols. I do know that the original M&P, a revolver, was pretty reliable. For home defense, arguments could be made either way for one of those or a 1911. Or a couple of each.

Of course, gregintenn had an even better suggestion.

 

[M29since14]

1911s aren't for everyone. Some guys can't make one work and others have no problem with the same gun. And the better grade of modern guns are usually superior to the older Colts for reliability in my experience. If you like the M&P45, get one. I have shot 1911s all my life and trust my guns completely but I have no qualms at all about having the M&P45 where I can get to it quickly.

 

[FortyFiveAuto]

I bought my FNX-45 for my home defense .45, despite already having a 1911.

A reliable, softer shooting .45 ACP pistol with 15+1 capacity?

Yes please!

 

[Wyo]

The best single thing about the 1911 is its trigger. There is a lot to like about a good one, but you can tune the trigger on a 1911 to be far better than anything you can get on a Glock or Smith or anything else. That said, there was a time back in the '70's when the only show in town was Colt. If you bought one, the odds were about 50/50 that it would actually work and you had to assume you would need to send it out for work before you could count on it. Colt didn't care 'cause they were the only builder out there. Shooters just kind of shrugged their shoulders and accepted that attitude from Colt - what else were they gonna do? 1911's are much better now, including Colts, and I've had several that were 100% reliable with everything I fed them right out of the box. I've had a few others that were less so. Frankly, if you want reliability without any need to tune the gun, one of the striker fired guns is probably the way to go. They usually work flawlessly. 1911's work most of the time, more often than they used to, but not always. Buy what feels best to you. Just understand that with the 1911 there is a somewhat higher likelihood that you might have to have it worked on a bit before you get the reliability you want. I like the 1911's enough that I don't mind that small risk. Whether you feel the same way, only you can decide.

 

[Murdock]

A properly tuned, adjusted, fitted, maintained and gripped 1911 is unsurpassed. But it is not for everybody. It is a gun for the enthusiast who wants peak performance, and who is willing to work with the gun to get any wrinkles worked out, if it has any. Remember, every gun maker except Glock makes a 1911, so materials, construction and QA will vary widely.

If you need to keep it simple, get a Glock 21 or M&P45. Either will be more than enough for HD.

I own or have owned all of them, and have confidence in all of them. The 1911 remains my default setting.

 

[jtcarm]

I love the idea. I love the looks of the gun. I love its history. It's performance however.....

Answered your own question. That's probably why the majority of owners have them.

Should I depart from a revolver for SD, I'd be very torn. I love the feel of the 1911 in my hand (I do own one, a 1944 Remington Rand, but it's not a shooter.)

But a more modern striker fire would be more practical.

I might meet in the middle with an S&W 3rd Gen.

 

[Arik]

Most modern (I say most because I don't know each and every manufacturer who makes a one) 1911 will reliably feed modern ammo. My own Springfield TRP will run on rocks backed by dirt for powder. That being said a 1911 is not the type of gun you just stick in your desk and forget about. It requires training and muscle memory. It has safeties that you have to remember to engage. It has a light trigger that you have to be careful of. In a high stress situation you may not mean to touch it but if you do you will shoot, if you remembered to take the safety of.

For a bed side gun go with what you are used to. My bed side is the same as my carry gun. There really is no reason to have different designs for house and carry. If you can carry it you can set it on the night stand

 

[chaparrito]

I don't like tearing mine down and putting it together, but I adore shooting it. It's the pistol loaded in the house at night because it's the one I'm best with. Ball ammo. I'm not worried about the neighbors. Ain't any.

 

[Arik]

nvince me I am wrong. Despite my negativity, I love the idea. I love the looks of the gun. I love its history. It's performance however.....

Ask yourself why are you buying it? For collecting or for SD? This is how I buy a gun. History and looks have no importance in defense. And that is my only need and want.

 

[old tanker]

The 1911 was designed around military ball ammo and with USGI magazines there is controlled feed in any position. Now, many eons ago, as a tank company First Sergeant I insisted that the troops bring their magazines to the range and test them. The troops were instructed that any magazines that did not feed properly, hold the slide back when the last round was expended, or drop free when the release was hit, were to be taken to the "magazine maintenance point." When they did, a burly PFC from the maintenance section would take the offending magazine and smash it against the blade of the VTR (tank retriever) with a two pound ball pein hammer. The horrified trooper would be told that had he merely turned the magazine back to supply claiming it was defective, the Supply Sergeant would look and see nothing wrong with it. Thus he would reissue it to some hapless soldier who wouldn't test it and it would get him killed.

Now after half a century of carrying a 1911, in the military and out, I still do because I am used to it. I stack the odds by carrying one that has proven, with its magazines and ammunition, to be reliable.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

There are several types of ammo that will feed in finicky 1911's Winchester Silvertip Hollow Point, was the first mass marketed to do so, and several manufacturers have stepped up also. On a fixed sight gun, the sights are usually set for only one weight of ammo. I have owned 17 fixed sight 1911's (not counting the 40 or so I built), all of them but one shot 230 grain ammo to the sights (I use Federal 230 Hydo-Shok for SD). The one shot 185 grain (the Win STHP) to the sights.

Good magazines are also important! Wilson mags are expensive, but they don't sell a bad one. Chip McCormick's "Shooting Star" hold 8 instead of 7 and feed well!

I believe a Commander size or smaller 1911 series, in a inside the waste band holster is the best Concealed carry system. In fact, I bet my life and that of my wife on it! (she has a Glock but isn't suspicious enough to get it out quick enough!)

Ivan

 

[Hapworth]

OP, the 1911 either calls you or it doesn't. Nothing wrong either way. Don't try to convince yourself or look for others to. You've run a couple and are left wondering what all the fuss is about. It doesn't call you. Find what does.

 

[Highhawk1948]

Never had a problem with my Colt Commander made in 2011. Feed it ball and hollow points. I was always a revolver guy unti my wife bought the colt for my retirement. It is very accurate and carries great. You have to have confidence in your self defense weapon.