Why such a big difference in Lyman and Hodgdon Manuals?

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Looking at both manuals, the loads for S&W 500 using H110 powder with 500 grain fp (in Lyman) or sp in (in Hodgdon) bullet. The Lyman says starting load is 29.4 grains to max of 31 grains. The Hodgdon starting load is 31.0 grains and max is 33.0. I've always stayed within Lymans specs (30 Gr.), but why the big difference?
 
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Looking at both manuals, the loads for S&W 500 using H110 powder with 500 grain fp (in Lyman) or sp in (in Hornady) bullet. The Lyman says starting load is 29.4 grains to max of 31 grains. The Hornady starting load is 31.0 grains and max is 33.0. I've always stayed within Lymans specs (30 Gr.), but why the big difference?
I have been reloading since 1972 and early on learned to check several loading manuals before trusting any one manual for a max load just for that reason. I have also deleted Hornady from reloading data I trust. The only data I use now is Nosler, Sierra and Hodgdon.
 
My mistake. It is a Hodgdon, not Hornady. I'll see if I can correct original post. OK couldn't change main title .but after that is changed
 
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How about Lyman? They seem to have less of a charge than anybody else. Never had a problem with the load I described, but it is less than starting load in Hodgdon.
 
Different bullet, different rifle barrel vs test barrel 15" vs 10 "
Forgive my ignorance, but what is the difference between the fp (flat point) and sp (soft point?) The Lyman had a picture of the bullet which matched what I had. I was under the impression that they were the same, just called different by different companies. Thank you in advance.
 
Forgive my ignorance, but what is the difference between the fp (flat point) and sp (soft point?) The Lyman had a picture of the bullet which matched what I had. I was under the impression that they were the same, just called different by different companies. Thank you in advance.
Maybe the same bullet but different barrels
Different tests phase of the moon 😊
 
Variations between manuals is due to the use of different brass, different primers, different bullets, and different test firearms or test barrels. This is why you start your loads at or near the minimum powder charge and work your way up to what you desire or what proves to be the safe maximum in your firearm.
 
Looking at both manuals, the loads for S&W 500 using H110 powder with 500 grain fp (in Lyman) or sp in (in Hodgdon) bullet. The Lyman says starting load is 29.4 grains to max of 31 grains. The Hodgdon starting load is 31.0 grains and max is 33.0. I've always stayed within Lymans specs (30 Gr.), but why the big difference?
This is from the 11th edition Hornady manual. I too am reloading 500 mag with h110 but with a jacked 350gr bullet. I think Lyman has a cast bullet reloading manual maybe the info is from that. Not sure. Back in the day I had all the reloading manuals but now I'm just reloading 500 mag simply because of cost.
 

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If you are going to re-load I would suggest a minimum of 4 different manuals for cross referencing .
I like to look at all the data in 4 manuals and see if there is a consensus on what is max and what is min .
Two manuals are better than 1 ... but 4 manuals will give you a better idea of what is what ... as always , start low and work up ... Slowly !
Load Safe ,
Gary
 
I'm 110% in agreement with gwpercle regarding multiple PUBLISHED reloading data sources when developing a load. I've also found the LEE reloading manual to be very conservative on load levels. JMHO & YMMV
 
I'm 110% in agreement with gwpercle regarding multiple PUBLISHED reloading data sources when developing a load. I've also found the LEE reloading manual to be very conservative on load levels. JMHO & YMMV
All the Lee manual does is copy data from someplace else. They do not test anything.

As for H110/W296 it is a very slow powder and pretty much fills the case up. A grain or so is not going make a difference It likes to be at max load. Faster powders if over charged make a BIG difference.!
 
This is from the 11th edition Hornady manual. I too am reloading 500 mag with h110 but with a jacked 350gr bullet. I think Lyman has a cast bullet reloading manual maybe the info is from that. Not sure. Back in the day I had all the reloading manuals but now I'm just reloading 500 mag simply because of cost.
I have the 2023 and 2024 manuals from Hornady and the 50th addition Lyman and several others that predate the .500 cartridge. The one you have covers the whole range. thanks for the pic.
 
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Forgive my ignorance, but what is the difference between the fp (flat point) and sp (soft point?) The Lyman had a picture of the bullet which matched what I had. I was under the impression that they were the same, just called different by different companies. Thank you in advance.
Need more information - who makes the bullet for each load, is there a crimp groove or cannelure - how much of the bullet is inside the case (affecting air space).

Barrel lentgh on both? type of barrel (an actual firearm or is it a universal test receiver), Overall Loaded length?

Lot # of powder can make that big a change in a large case.

Riposte
 
The more paper manuals the better. Even the old ones are very good reference material. No two are just alike, but after doing many comparisons, extrapolations, and averaging, you'll get a good feel for what is a safe load with the velocity you're looking for. Much better than getting stuff off the Internet unless it comes from a recognized bona fide powder distributor or bullet manufacturer.
 
Thanks to all who have contributed to this thread so far. I also support the practice of starting on the low end of the AVERAGE load data from at least 2 or 3 different reputable published sources. I rarely start at the starting load, unless developing a light target load. I usually start around the middle of the averaged load data. NOTE: I'm not suggesting starting near the middle, just saying what I do.

I always check Lyman 50 (or Lyman's Cast Bullet, if appropriate), the annual magazine-like Hodgdon manual, the Lee manual (yes, they copy data from other places), and the website for the manufacturer of the powder and or projectile being used. Even though Hornady and Speer state that their data is specifically for their projectiles I check those manuals just because I have them and one can never have too much data.

Shortly after Hodgdon purchased RamShot, some of the 357 load data was lowered. I called Hodgdon and asked why. They said they did some testing and stand by their lowered numbers. I now have a few hundred 357 cartridges that are .5 grains above the new max for True Blue. I will not be putting any more of those through my S&W 19-2 just because it's precious and hard to replace, but my GP100 loves them.

Bottom line: My practice is to look at data from several relaible sources, never start near any published Max load, increase loads incrementally by .2 gr., and carefully inspect cases and primers before increasing a charge.

Note: Every 327 Fed. Mag. load I have tried flattens and expands primers somewhat, but so does every FACTORY 327 Fed. Mag. load I have shot. It's just a high pressure round. Other than 327 Fed. Mag., when a case or primer shows pressure signs, I back off .2 gr. and call that my personal max load. Again, I am not recommending anything, just saying what I do.

Happy hand loading to all!
 
The pic in post #11 has different load data for H110 and W296 which are the exact same powders. A lot of load data appears to be more like a journal of results rather than pressure tested absolute maximums and minimums. Always cross reference multiple sources and then make an educated decision based upon your goals for the load.
 
I have been reloading since 1972 and early on learned to check several loading manuals before trusting any one manual for a max load just for that reason. I have also deleted Hornady from reloading data I trust. The only data I use now is Nosler, Sierra and Hodgdon.
I started loading in 1972 also, we are old guys. One comment. I agree, always consult more than one manual. But a key legal point for safety.

ONLY the powder company who sells a product is required to file a federal safety data sheet about the powder that they create and sell. Companies that sell reloading manuals as just selling us their test results from their test guns at that time.

When you create a product, such as Dove soap to wash dishes, or Round-Up to kill weeds, or H110 powder, you must ensure the government that is safe when instructions are followed. As such there are certain hoops a powder company must go through to put the product on the market. Those legal hoops are what makes H110 powder safe to use, if you follow directions. No reloading manual, has that direct requirement. If they publish something that blows up guns, of course they can be sued, but name one case where that has been successful.

My point is we can choose what manuals we "like" and we all do. The most current manual out there is the Nosler manual, from 2023, I like it because it has the most current powders listed.

You mentioned Nolser, Sierra and Hodgen manuals. My point is only Hodgen makes powder, they would be your safest source of data, because if they make errors, they can be sued directly for putting a dangerous product on the market.

An example. Alliant has an online source of recipes for all of their powders, That is the safest place on the planet to find load data to start with and then create your own loads watching pressure data.

For example, if you go to the Alliant site and look at the 300 powder and the 500 SW, it only gives one load. That load is the safest source you will find.

1749567759250.png

If you prefer Power Pistol, they have a recipe too.

1749567853075.png

You get very different velocity all else being equal. But what you know is both of those recipes are going to be "safe". Both will be close to maximum loads.

And that is why the company that makes a powder, is the safest source of reloading data.

That said, once safety is satisfied, the various reloading manuals may tweak the recipes, However, they use different barrel lengths, test barrels and such that confuse the issue.


My point to any new reloader or when dealing with some new caliber, is to always start low and work up, but that the company that makes that powder is the source of the safest loads. It does not matter much if we are loading 38 or 357 or even 10mm. But when you get to to 454, 460 and 500 calibers, a little research would be worth the time.

My 2 cents.
 
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