Will you do this as a CCW?

Thanks Red, that really hits home.
Here in Mass, you have to be just about insane to exercise the CCW that you "may" receive. As I understand it, there's an "equality of force" provision which in essence means that if someone is attacking you with a knife, you will be prosecuted for using excessive force defending yourself with a legally carried gun. I can only imagine the consequences if a gun is drawn to try and protect someone else.
And also, hell will rain down on you if someone happens to notice somehow that you're carrying and report it to the police.
 
redlevel said:
No.

Everyone who is not a LEO and carries a gun should read the following at least once a month.

Commentary by Evan Marshall
Click to expand...
That is an excellent read. I'm going to save it.

Here is a quote from that article that everyone should heed:
Even if the situation is exactly as it appears and you're even in accordance with the law, you need to understand one simple fact-the law is what the local prosecutor says it is. Do you really want to spend 7 years in jail waiting for an appeal to be heard and your conviction overturned?
Click to expand...
Most want to be helpful. The problem is, things are rarely cut and dry. Witnesses are next to useless and an overzealous prosecutor with political ambition, doesn't care if he puts you in jail and it gets over turned later; he still gets a win.
 
Rastoff said:
That is an excellent read. I'm going to save it.

Here is a quote from that article that everyone should heed: Most want to be helpful. The problem is, things are rarely cut and dry. Witnesses are next to useless and an overzealous prosecutor with political ambition, doesn't care if he puts you in jail and it gets over turned later; he still gets a win.
Click to expand...

Great article...to a point. The author said "it's a fact that the law is what the prosecutor says it is". That is a GREAT over exaggeration!!! Many a defense lawyer can attest to this.

Curious (and surprised) that you say witnesses are next to useless. Please
elaborate?
 
Yes, I agree that the law isn't what a prosecutor says it is, but I'm not going to take chances that his interpretation will put me in prison for a number of years while I fight the unjust conviction.


As for witnesses, here's a little test to see how observant you are:


What do you think of eye witnesses now?
 
Rastoff said:
Yes, I agree that the law isn't what a prosecutor says it is, but I'm not going to take chances that his interpretation will put me in prison for a number of years while I fight the unjust conviction.


As for witnesses, here's a little test to see how observant you are:


What do you think of eye witnesses now?
Click to expand...

Seriously? You're using THIS as an example to support a case for witnesses being useless in a shooting??? Come on.
 
Rastoff said:
You'll have to do better than that. Why isn't this a good example of how people are not good at seeing what's there?
Click to expand...

LOL! I think it's YOU that has to do better. That video is intended to create an optical illusion...something entirelly different from witnessing a shooting incident.

You can do better...I know you can! :cool:
 
Protected One said:
That video is intended to create an optical illusion...
Click to expand...
Not at all. This is no illusion, but an example of how easy it is to miss important details. The difference is that an illusion is designed to fool the observer. The video above does no such thing. What they made is completely obvious and yet most people never see it.

Let me see if I can find another that is a better example of how poor the observation skills of the average person are.

EDIT:
It's not that the observation skills are poor, the human brain just doesn't remember things well. I can't find the other video.
 
Last edited:
Rastoff said:
Not at all. This is no illusion, but an example of how easy it is to miss important details. The difference is that an illusion is designed to fool the observer. The video above does no such thing. What they made is completely obvious and yet most people never see it.

Let me see if I can find another that is a better example of how poor the observation skills of the average person are.

EDIT:
It's not that the observation skills are poor, the human brain just doesn't remember things well. I can't find the other video.
Click to expand...

That's ok, I appreciate that you made the effort. Back to the issue: the level of detail required to be observed and remembered in the video exceeds that which is asked of MOST witnesses in the type of incidents that we are discussing. A witness who can provide extensive detail of an incident is of course desirable...but not often necessary. "Would you recognize the person who tried to rob the store, if you saw them again?" An affirmative answer to a question of this nature is often all that is required, NOT what color their pants were, etc...:cool:
 
Thanks for the lively discussion folks, but the question remains, and maybe thinking ahead could save our lives, the wellbeing of our families, our financial future, etc.
Would you draw a weapon to try and save someone else in a questionable situation?
After having read all of this, I have to say no, I would not. Being granted a CCW does not make us LEOs.
 
Johnmuratore said:
Thanks for the lively discussion folks, but the question remains, and maybe thinking ahead could save our lives, the wellbeing of our families, our financial future, etc.
Would you draw a weapon to try and save someone else in a questionable situation?
After having read all of this, I have to say no, I would not. Being granted a CCW does not make us LEOs.
Click to expand...

What if the situation wasn't questionable?
 
Protected One said:
Watched about 15 seconds...and didn't bother trying to count passes.
Click to expand...
Ah, I thought that might be the case based on what you said. Go back and follow the instructions. Count the passes, either team it doesn't really matter. Then post your answer here. This time, watch the video through to the end.
 
I had only skimmed this thread when I posted before. This time I looked at all the replys but still havent bothered to watch the video as I have seen those type before. The biggest thing I will add here is none of you brought up the danger of having a gun on someone laying on the ground. The danger lays in when the fuzz roll up its going to be YOU that is given the first attention. Hope it aint rookie eager beavers! Now I still would stand by my previous posts. Now, I once was in a similar situation and had two guys at bay with my gun in downtown Los Angeles about 40 years ago. They had hit and ran my car that a GF was driving. She followed them and we got them boxed up in a parking building. Trying to get away they deliberatly hit us two or three more times. Short story, I held them while GF drove my car looking for help. Soon some type plain cloths building security (two) started to walk past me but being a security guard myself I knew what they were. I noticed one had a pistol stuck in his waist band. I called them over explained a short version that I had a gun on the two guys and my gun and hand was in my pocket. I then told one I am now going to have you hold my gun because we are going to be hit with cops here very soon. I took my snub out of my pocket and gave it to him. Right after I think we got hit with over 20 police cars! This was in the heart of los angeles. Short version is after some PW we were given a courtesy ride back to my car, they gave me my smith and ammo back. I suppose it helped that the driver had warrants out for him, I didnt ask for what. No, I wouldnt want to have that happen again. But I still would do exactly the same thing too. Because of this "I wont get involved and mind my own business thinking" is the biggest reason alone the crime rate is as high as it is. I am not advising people that are weak or unhealthy etc here to hop in, but am talking about men that still think they are able and have that gun and permit.
 
I have to wonder what part of "self" defense, people have a hard time with.

I carry to protect my family and my self. Your emergency is not my emergency. I don't have an issue with being a good witness, but your personal safety is your responsibility.
 
I doubt I would have drawn in that situation.

I am glad it worked out for him.

I am not insinuating he is wrong, that I am right, or vice-versa; I'm only saying what I would have done.
 
Rastoff said:
Yes, I agree that the law isn't what a prosecutor says it is, but I'm not going to take chances that his interpretation will put me in prison for a number of years while I fight the unjust conviction.


As for witnesses, here's a little test to see how observant you are:


What do you think of eye witnesses now?
Click to expand...

Ha, that was fun.

I did count the correct number and also noticed the abnormality.:D
 
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