Would one really lose hearing firing 357 indoors in home defense scenario?

[BugBeard]

I keep reading on these forums that many people do not choose to load 357 for home defense due to the loud report of the cartridge.

My question is, is this really the gosh-honest-truth? I know that the decibels would cause hearing loss over enough time, but is 6 shots indoors enough for noticeable hearing loss? (i.e. Would one go from good hearing to tinnitus from one cylinder of 357 indoors?)

That seems a bit extreme to me, but what do I know. Anyone know for sure?

 

[flop-shank]

It could. Everyone's ears are different and the .357 runs at very high pressures. That's one of the big advantages of the .44 spl. and .45 ACP I rarely hear mentioned. They offer serious butt-whippage at low pressure.

 

[Andy Taylor]

I won't post details here, but my father lost his hearing in his left ear from one round of .357 magnum.

 

[SuperMan]

...depends who is pulling the trigger. I wish I had kept the article, and it was not in a gun rag, but several years ago it was discovered that under stress when the body knows it is about to be subjected to a loud noise the hearing shuts down to protect itself from damage.

This is why many officers and civilians who are in self-defense shootings report only hearing "pop,pop" instead of "BANG" when they had been firing their guns.

Hunters experience the same thing... Go to the range some time and shoot a centerfire rifle with no hearing protection...one round can get you permanent tinnitus...ringing of the ears. But yet jump a deer out in the woods and do a snap shot without hearing protection and all hunters remember hearing was a "pop"...and no ringing afterwards.

Could firing one round of .357 during a confrontation get you permanent hearing loss...maybe...but I would rather take that chance than shooting someone with a .22 or .38 and not have it end the confrontation there and then...

Bob

 

[JohnK]

I don't think the hearing "shuts down" as such.

Stress, and adrenaline may cause less PERCEPTION, of anything other than the threat right in front of you; "tunnel vision" is another example.

As to the shooting range/home, vs. shooting in the field; the field, or tree you are sitting in, doesn't have walls, ceilings, and structures, to reflect, and maximize the blast damage. There is a REAL, not imagined, intensification of the blast indoors.

Ask me how I know.

I have a one hundred decibel hearing loss above 1,000 cycles. Quite profound.

 

[ENH]

Yes. It is the sound pressure level that causes the damage even though there is auditory exclusion. It may be slight but there will be hair cell damage.

 

[RobO]

WHAT??

 

[ENH]

Sound travels like ripples in a pond when you drop a rock in the water. A larger rock results in larger waves. Louder sound (357 @ 140db+) creates more sound pressure. With auditory exclusion the brain does not interpret the result of the pressure wave striking the hair cells violently as sound. But the damage is still occurring. A good example is when hunting, you never notice the shot, but shoot the same gun from the bench and you will.

 

[BugBeard]

Nice to hear about someone's direct experience. Makes me consider using 38 but perhaps my short barrel 357 isn't so bad as full house. Which reminds me... Was at indoor range next to guy shooting some insanely loud rifle wrapped in camo. I had new over ear protection and earplugs on at the same time. After 30 minutes I left but my left ear ached for 2 days later! Now that is a loud gun, and next time I am next to one I am immediately moving. Made my 357 sound like a cap gun. Dont know what it was but 'flames' shot out the barrel and it sounded like a cannon going off in my mind. didn't know small arms could be that loud!!

 

[44forever]

Ever hear the expression"...the hair on the back of my neck stood up."? Under stress, as the body prepares to defend it's self, several things happen. One is the "tightening" of the scalp. A consequence of this is the outer ears are moved partially out of allignment with the internal hearing apparatus providing some limited reduction in the possible damage. This, however, assumes your body has time to tense up. The chances of damage to your hearing is greater if you have an ND while dry fring than in a defensive encounter.

I once was in a unit when a round (9mm) was fired from inside the vehicle. My hearing was no worse afterward than it was before but my ears have rung continuously since I was a kid - way too much target practice without hearing protectors.

 

[Chromedhearts]

Originally posted by BugBeard:
Nice to hear about someone's direct experience. Makes me consider using 38 but perhaps my short barrel 357 isn't so bad as full house. Which reminds me... Was at indoor range next to guy shooting some insanely loud rifle wrapped in camo. I had new over ear protection and earplugs on at the same time. After 30 minutes I left but my left ear ached for 2 days later! Now that is a loud gun, and next time I am next to one I am immediately moving. Made my 357 sound like a cap gun. Dont know what it was but 'flames' shot out the barrel and it sounded like a cannon going off in my mind. didn't know small arms could be that loud!!

Oh, there are some out there that will knock paint off the walls, just from their sound. Try standing next to some one touching off a .338 Lapua, or even a .300 Winchester, not to mention a .50 BMG or .416 Barret. Even with hearing protection, the concusion can give you, well, a concusion. I have had head aches after being around some one shooting one of them cannons.
Forgive the digression please.

 

[WR Moore]

Originally posted by BugBeard:
Nice to hear about someone's direct experience. Makes me consider using 38 but perhaps my short barrel 357 isn't so bad as full house.

I hate to break it to you, but short barrels intensify the muzzle blast over long barrels. The 2 1/2 inch model 19 was referred to as "the wax gun" during development. It was guaranteed to blow the wax out of your ears.

If your comment refers to loads for short barrel vs standard type loads, don't bet your hearing on it. Find yourself some of those electronic muffs and keep them on the nightstand. That way you can both hear the bad dudes and protect your hearing.

 

[GatorFarmer]

If you ask in the lounge, Bob the Palindrome might chime in. If I recall correctly, he's a medical professional and offered some good insights into the subject last time it was discussed.

Anyway, the gist of the discussion last time someone asked was that while one doesn't perceive the shots, that the damage is still being done.

Fortunately, there's a potential fix. Peltor makes a set of hearing protectors (as do many other companies) that will filter out the sound of gunfire while still allowing one to hear normal conversation and other sounds. I haven't tried them, but Surefire makes "in the ear" models that are small and relatively inexpensive.

 

[MCVenner]

I've long regarded this an interesting subject and consider the following articles to be particularly insightful:

http://www.freehearingtest.com/hia_gunfirenoise.shtml
http://www.keepandbeararms.com/downloads/SoundAdvice.doc
http://www.policemag.com/Articles/2008/08/Dangerous-Decibels.aspx
http://www.mh3tacticalheadset.com/pages/tpoae.html

As flop-shank suggests, the acoustic pressures associated with the .44 Special (15,500psi SAAMI) and the .357 Magnum (35,000psi SAAMI) are 156db and 164db respectively. It might not look like much of a difference but the latter is nearly twice the intensity of the former. More to the point, however, is that even the former is nearly three times the intensity of the generally accepted threshold of hearing damage (140db). One really ought not want to discharge any weapon without ear protection.

On the other hand, who hasn't been caught on the range with their 'ears' off? Certainly the .357 Magnum was the standard service cartridge of most U.S. police departments from the 1960s through the 1980s. That translates to a lot of cops, firing a lot of rounds, indoors, without ear protection. They didn't all suffer permanent hearing effects. There are, it would seem, many pertinent variables. Perhaps too many to fret about considering the alternative (dialing 911).

The nice thing about the .357 Magnum, BugBeard, is that only one shot is generally required.

 

[Wyatt Earp]

Originally posted by WR Moore:
Find yourself some of those electronic muffs and keep them on the nightstand. That way you can both hear the bad dudes and protect your hearing.

Excellent idea.

 

[DJINCO]

Only one way to know for sure...

 

[flop-shank]

As WR Moore suggested, SB .357s may be less likely to damage your hearing, but don't bet your hearing on it unless your life is on the line. While SB .357s probably don't run at much lower pressures, if at all, the use of smaller charges of faster powder will probably result in lower pressure when the bullet leaves the bore, thus a quieter (but by no means quiet) report. A 4" barrel would of course yield lower pressure than a shorter one.

One time I touched off a Remington 125 gr. SJHP .357 from my Taurus 605 2 1/4" and I would describe the feeling as being stabbed in each ear at once.

 

[BugBeard]

Originally posted by WR Moore:

Originally posted by BugBeard:
Nice to hear about someone's direct experience. Makes me consider using 38 but perhaps my short barrel 357 isn't so bad as full house.

I hate to break it to you, but short barrels intensify the muzzle blast over long barrels. The 2 1/2 inch model 19 was referred to as "the wax gun" during development. It was guaranteed to blow the wax out of your ears.

If your comment refers to loads for short barrel vs standard type loads, don't bet your hearing on it. Find yourself some of those electronic muffs and keep them on the nightstand. That way you can both hear the bad dudes and protect your hearing.

Yeah, I meant a short barrel load, should have been clearer. Will have to consider the electronic muff thing, that is a good idea. Probably simpler just to use 38, but I hesitate to bank on 5 shots of it in my 649. I would feel confident with the FBI load in my 8 shot 327 snub though. Time to swap out the loading...

Edit: Load in my handguns is now:

Speer Gold Dot 135gr short barrel tactical 357 in my 649 carry gun.

Buffalo Bore 158gr lead hollow point (LSWCHPs) 38 +P in my 'house gun' 327 snub. (Yes, I shouldn't have gotten a snub for a house gun, but at least I can carry it fairly easily for an N-frame and it will stash well for various things. (backpacking, etc.))

 

[tanksoldier]

Would one really lose hearing firing 357 indoors in home defense scenario?

Possible.

However, you'd have to survive the encounter to worry about hearing loss.

Anyone who chooses a HD weapon based on this criteria has their priorities misplaced.

 

[ENH]

MOONDAWG
The damage begins in the high frequencies and is progressive. It may or may not reach the speech frequencies for some time but damage is occurring. There are lots of examples including President Reagan and most of the older gun writers and veterans.

But keep shooting w/o protection if you want, IT IS JOB SECURITY FOR SOME OF US.