A few questions for the old school bullseye shooters.

Gents,
Please educate me. Recently, I was rummaging around at my local shop found an old Remington-Rand 1911 that had been altered for bullseye competition. Bo-Mar rear sight, big angled front sight, stippling on the front strap, aftermarket trigger and hammer (I think), and the arched MSH had been ground down flat. Oddly enough, it had wood Colt grips on it. Initially I thought it was a shame a nice old 1911 had been altered. But after I looked it over and saw the price ($425) I figured, I couldn’t get a new Philippine made 1911 for that, and an inexpensive American made 1911 is always a good thing to have so it came home.

After I took it apart, I became really impressed with the workmanship in this thing. Little tweaks here and there, wonderful trigger, and extraordinarily tight all around. After I took it apart, I discovered it was built by a fellow named R. L. Shockey (stamped inside the slide) and it does have what I’ve since learned is called a “mousetrap” recoil spring plug.

Anyhow, I’ll get to my question. What was the usual maintenance and cleaning routine from those of you who used these kinds of altered 1911s? Were they cleaned often, rarely, never? I ask as this thing is a challenge to disassemble and it was fairly dirty. The barrel bushing is so very, very tight that some damned fool before me used a pipe wrench on it (seriously). My bushing wrench gets the job done, but it is a chore! Additionally the reassembly is difficult too due to the mousetrap recoil spring plug. These are not big deals, but I was just curious as in all honesty, I dread taking it down after shooting it.

Anyhow, I popped a fresh recoil spring in it and the pistol shoots very accurately and I’m glad I have it. Sorry for the long post and thank you for any information.

Frequency of cleaning varied.

I knew a few guys who cleaned after the season. Others cleaned more frequently: some as often as after every match.

You have to remember that active Bullseye shooters put a lot of lead down range each season. These competitors generally weren’t the obsessive clean freaks I sometimes read about on this forum.

Serious competitors were more interested in consistency rather than squeaky clean guns. Since the gun is only spotless for one round, spotless cleanliness wasn’t desireable.

My rifle team coach made me do countless pushups for cleaning my 52-C once during the season. That view wasn’t unique to him and I’ve adopted it in the ensuing 50+ years without any problems.

I’ve frequently run over 500 rounds through pretty tight 1911’s without a problem.

I shot bulls eye back in the 60s when I was a small arms tech in the AF. From what you describe, you picked up a 1911 that had been modified for competition and you got it for what I call a Jesse James price and he wore a mask. The gunsmith shop at Lackland AFB used to build our 45s and let me tell you, they were tight and shot like a dream. Basically they would tighten everything up, match a match grade barrel to a barrel bushing (tight), add Bor-Mar rear sights, a target front sight and a great trigger job and you were off and shooting. We put many thousands of rounds through them before we'd have to send them back for a tune up. I had two of mine go full auto during matches after many thousands of rounds. Sent them back to Lackland and they came home like new pistols. I field stripped and cleaned mine after each practice or match and rarely did a complete takedown.

I was issued a similar gun as a member of my squadron pistol team. It had been reworked by the armory and in addition to the sight and trigger mods, it had a flat mainspring housing installed. The barrel bushing could be removed by hand, but it would hold the 10 ring at 50 yards. I cleaned and lubed about every time I shot it. Probably didn’t need to though.

Maintenance varied with the shooter. For me, when I felt it needed cleaned I simply removed the grips, soaked the whole pistol in 90% rubbing alcohol then blew it out with an air hose. The bore got a little extra care, maybe a bronze brush or Lewis lead remover (rarely). Then oil and blow the extra out and go back to the range. Blacken the sights using a paper or wooden match and you were ready to go. A little lube never hurts.

Save that old spring, it may come in handy in the future.

I remember the name Shockey but never competed against one of his pistols that I know of. My hero was Amend Swenson, he did fantastic work and shot every week in competition.

I congratulate you and wish you luck.

There's a bunch of information on R.L Shockey on the internet. Seems to be highly thought of. You may have found a diamond in the rough.

Google is your friend.

R. L. Shockey was one of the leading bullseye smiths back in the '60s and '70s. He is not as well known as but his work is certainly on par with Jim Clark's, Swensen's, etc. I would not be surprised if that wad gun you've got went out and won a match tomorrow. I bet it will put 10 consecutive shots into 2-1/2 inches at 50 yards out of a Ransom Rest.

As to cleaning. In competition, I cleaned my guns before and after every match. Before because I had been practicing all week, and I don't routinely clean after every practice session. After, because after a couple of hundred rounds of reloads most 1911s are full of crud. I would also swab the barrel out and blow out accumulated crud between the centerfire and .45 matches. Enough crud, and function is compromised, and alibis don't win matches.

Rpg said:

Frequency of cleaning varied.

I knew a few guys who cleaned after the season. Others cleaned more frequently: some as often as after every match.

You have to remember that active Bullseye shooters put a lot of lead down range each season. These competitors generally weren’t the obsessive clean freaks I sometimes read about on this forum.

Serious competitors were more interested in consistency rather than squeaky clean guns. Since the gun is only spotless for one round, spotless cleanliness wasn’t desireable.

My rifle team coach made me do countless pushups for cleaning my 52-C once during the season. That view wasn’t unique to him and I’ve adopted it in the ensuing 50+ years without any problems.

I’ve frequently run over 500 rounds through pretty tight 1911’s without a problem.

Click to expand...

What Rpg said. I recall that gunsmiths name and my vague recollection is that he made some real tack drivers. Basically, back in the day (early 80s), I would clean about every 500 rounds unless I got superstitious (like I had an amazing run and didn't want to change anything even though it was 500+ at that point).

Ray Shockey lived in the eastern Cleveland Ohio area and did great work for a fair price. He tightened up different models of bullseye guns in different calibers. Great reputation and guns modified by him would be a good find. Yours seems to still be tight from yrs ago. Some guns by him may have been shot a lot and are loosening up by now.

I would shoot it 5 times and see how dirty it is inside then go accordingly. To keep the tightness of the gun, lube the rails, the barrel bushing area and all the parts that move when fired. Don’t be afraid to use too much oil and a good oil. Someone in the yrs past told me the oil from the gun should hit you when you fire it, then you know you have enough. He is from the Shockey era. I maintained my model 41 in the same manor but not to the extent of over lubing where it splashed when fired.

Enjoy your 1911, just started shooting my 1911 Para Ordanance again and having fun. Larry

Sounds like a steal to me.. Some of those old gunsmiths and old 1911's were really good.

I had my 1960s Colt Government models accurized by Alton(Al) Dinan of New Canaan CT.

Al would take your government model and return it to you in about a month.

Bill Allard and myself would drive from NYC to Al's Ct home,workshop and range to deliver and pick up the pistols.

The finished guns would be Random Rested at 50yds to demonstrate the accuracy before Al handed to you to shoot yourself.

Bill used his to get his legs for his Distinguished Pistol award.

I could squeak past 2600 in 2700 matches but never achieved a leg.

Clean your pistol when the accuracy drops off. That is the gun telling you things have changed. Clean it when you change ammo or lube as the barrel will need to re-accommodate itself to those changes.

When I was on active duty in the Army, I personally owned a beat-up Ithaca M1911A1. I had it accurized and re-blued by a gunsmith recommended to me by other members of our post pistol team.

He tightened the slide to the frame, carefully welded up and fitted the barrel perfectly to the slide, modified the feed ramp to digest semi-wadcutter lead bullets, installed a fitted match bushing, put in a full-length recoil spring guide, modified the plug to use it and did a great trigger job. A Bo-Mar adjustable rear sight was used, and in later years I replaced the Patridge front sight with a sloped one when the original front sight detached and flew off into never-never land during informal plinking. I also installed a new manual safety with a larger lever when these became available. I've had a variety of grips on it; the picture below shows my current taste for nice wood and the original double diamond pattern. Somewhere along the way I put in a new lightweight trigger with adjustable overtravel and a long-tang grip safety. Skateboard tape gives me a great gripping surface. Wilson mags now complete the ensemble.

After every outing with that pistol, I religiously field stripped it, cleaned and lubed it, and reassembled it. The barrel bushing remains tight, and I use a barrel bushing wrench to remove it. It was thus always clean, lubed and ready to go. I even used it as my personal .45 in the field, preferring it to my issue Colt. I did the same during my National Guard service. It has never once failed to function in over 50 years, and is still as tight as when I received it from that gunsmith. It maintains exceptional accuracy.

I don't believe regular proper disassembly, cleaning and lubing after each firing have affected the performance of this gun at all.

John

I built up my own .45 from a DCM GI gun - added Bo-Mar sights and a wider front sight, a match barrel with tight bushing, and did a trigger job. Also added a trigger shoe. It worked OK. I also used a K-38 and a Colt Match Woodsman in the .22 stage. I cleaned them after every match and practice session.

You are very lucky to have bought an accurized hardball gun by R.L. Shockey. He was a top pistolsmith back in the day. Gil Hebard said about cleaning an accurized pistol, "If they shot better dirty, the manufacturers would find a way to sell them with gunk already inside!" Keep it clean. Grime can combine with lube to make a "valve grinding" like compound and accelerate wear. You can learn to disassemble and reassemble without removing the barrel bushing. Make sure that the recoil spring is still strong.

I tried often to shoot my S&W Model 52-2s in the centerfire matches but the scrores I shot with the accurized 45s were much better.

Al Dinan had his own machine shop in an out building and made a lot of the parts he used accurizing the pistols.He started from scratch making his own barrel bushings,barrel links and link pins.His long slides were works of art.

The Dinan pistols were the only ones I ever owned and was never aware of R.L.Shockey.

Clark,Behlert,Dinan and Swensen were the names associated with 45acp auto accurizing the most but that was 50 years ago for me so it's a bit foggy now.

Never ran my 45 wet enough to splash but with a tight competition pistol they definitely need to be oiled well.

R.L. Shockey (bio)

Birth: Mar. 19, 1909
Quincy Township
Franklin County
Pennsylvania, USA
Death: Nov. 9, 1981
El Reno
Canadian County
Oklahoma, USA

OBITUARY :
RICHARD L. SHOCKEY, 72, of 612 S. W. 26th St., El Reno, Okla., a native of the Waynesboro area, died at 3 p.m. Monday shortly after being admitted to Park View Hospital, El Reno. His death was attributed to a heart attack.

He was born in Quincy Township, March 19, 1909, son of the late Harry A. and Ann R. (Provard) Shockey. His early life was lived In the Waynesboro R. D. 1 and and he was a graduate of the Quincy Township High School with the class of 1927.

As a young man he was employed at Landis Machine Co. for several years. Following their marriage in June, 1933, he and his wife moved to York, where he was employed at the Naval Ordnance Plant.

The family moved to El Reno in 1948, when Shockey was employed as assistant superintendent of the tool, die and machine shop at the Federal Corrections Institution. He had been retired since 1955. Shockey was nationally known as a gunsmith and maintained the weapons of various law enforcement agencies in Oklahoma.

He was currently serving as a member of the El Reno City Council.

He was a member of the Wesley United Methodist Church of El Reno and the Methodist Men's Club of the church. He was also a member of York Lodge No. 266, F & AM, The Council, Chapter and Commandery, and the Knights Templar, all of York; the El Reno Country Club, the National Rifle Association, the AARP, and the Oklahoma Sheriffs' and Peace Officers' Association.

In addition to his wife, Mrs. Ethel (Bryan) Shockey, he is survived by a daughter, Mrs. Carolyn Kiddy, Littleton, Colo.; two granddaughters; and three brothers, Milton Shockey, Glen Burnie, Md.; Elmer Shockey, Tomstown Rd. and Gilson Shockey, Waynesboro.

The funeral will be held Friday at 1 p.m. in the Grove Funeral Hone in charge of the Rev. Lester Misner. Burial will be in Mt. Zion Cemetery.

The family will receive friends at the funeral home one hour prior to the services Friday.

Source : The Record Herald Newspaper - Waynesboro, Franklin Co., Pennsylvania - Wednesday, November 11, 1981

Richard Shockey's skills as a gunsmith were on par with the greats of the era. I would be tickled pink to have that pistol. Would love to see pic's of it.

When I was the 1st Cav. Division pistol team gunsmith in 1959 we had a bunch of Shockey's. Excellent shooters.

I only cleaned my Mike Curtis built 1911 when it stopped working. I ran it quite wet and the funny thing is, I don't ever remember shooting an alibi string based on gun malfunction, human malfunction sure, but not the gun.

Stu

anyone else notice the aroma of bullseye hovering around this thread?