Let's see your Centennials/Models 40/42!

[PALADIN85020]

I've been wondering for some time; do the 'dash one' and later versions have the pin under the grip that can be moved to pin the grip safety down to de-activate it like the original 40 and 42s did?

The "dash ones" made recently do not have a hole for the grip safety lock-down pin. My 40 no-dash made in 1966 does have the hole, but as usual on these, the pin is missing. I cobbled up a substitute pin from a small nail for it; works as intended.

John

 

[Hondo44]

The "dash ones" made recently do not have a hole for the grip safety lock-down pin. My 40 no-dash made (estimated) in 1967 does have the hole, but as usual on these, the pin is missing. I cobbled up a substitute pin from a small nail for it; works as intended.

John

Thank you. I guess a guy could drill his own holes to lock-down the grip safety. A drill bit shank of the right size and length with polished ends would be indistinguishable from the original pin. They weren't blued.

 

[PALADIN85020]

Thank you. I guess a guy could drill his own holes to lock-down the grip safety. A drill bit shank of the right size and length with polished ends would be indistinguishable from the original pin. They weren't blued.

The original guns also had a hole drilled in the frame and a matching hole in an extended part of the grip safety to accept the lock-down pin. I think modifying a "dash one" to match the old-timers would be an exercise in frustration. No sweat on making a replacement pin for the older ones, though.

John

 

[whitecoyote]

 

[Hondo44]

The original guns also had a hole drilled in the frame and a matching hole in an extended part of the grip safety to accept the lock-down pin. I think modifying a "dash one" to match the old-timers would be an exercise in frustration. No sweat on making a replacement pin for the older ones, though.

John

Hi John,
I would do it just for grins if and when I got a new model, but not without an early gun to measure and get the exact hole locations and pin size to make it look exactly like factory. No frustration.

 

[MAG-NUM]

Nice snubbies guys! Since John started off this thread with a 40-1 I figured I would add mine to the mix. Great little guns and a blast to shoot. Bob

 

[Engine49guy]

I have posted this one before but Its one of my favorites ,

Has a 4 digit serial number and upper sideplate screw which was deleted in 1955.
I believe these came in a red box with an end label that read:
"Chiefs Special Hammerless"

On a side not I removed the grips today for the first time, It does have the set pin but what was really interesting
was that the grips have differrent washers inside that are much smaller than any other S&W I have seen.
That in addition to the very high reach makes them specific to only this model.

Shown with a baby Chief also from about 1955, Both grips are shown with modern J grips in center.

 

[dthughes]

My centennial with stocks numbered to the frame. I was just looking for a "shooter" j-frame until I took a peak at the serial number. Guess this one is going to stay in the safe for a while as the FIRST piece in what may some day become a decent centennial collection!

 

[PALADIN85020]

Hi John,
I would do it just for grins if and when I got a new model, but not without an early gun to measure and get the exact hole locations and pin size to make it look exactly like factory. No frustration.

I'm not completely sure on this, but I think the original grip safeties were configured a bit differently. They have an extended section (having a hole for the lockdown pin), which protrudes farther into the frame to accept the lockdown pin at it's hole's location. That means that a new grip safety would have to be built up with welding, or an original grip safety obtained. Then the holes could be drilled. That's why I suspect it would be much more trouble than it would be worth. The new grip safeties also don't have a dimple with a white dot in the top. That was done so you could see if the safety was locked in or not. Dot showing: functional. Dot not showing: locked out.

John

 

[Hondo44]

I have posted this one before but Its one of my favorites ,

I believe these came in a red box with an end label that read:
"Chiefs Special Hammerless"
On a side note I removed the grips today for the first time, It does have the set pin but what was really interesting
was that the grips have differrent washers inside that are much smaller than any other S&W I have seen.
That in addition to the very high reach makes them specific to only this model.

Shown with a baby Chief also from about 1955, Both grips are shown with modern J grips in center.

That's an excellent illustration of the difference. It also clearly shows the difference in the I frame size grips on the Baby Chiefs; the back side view of the Standard J grip and the baby Chief I grip shows the extra 1/8" grip panel length under the locating pin hole of the J.

 

[Hondo44]

My centennial with stocks numbered to the frame. I was just looking for a "shooter" j-frame until I took a peak at the serial number. Guess this one is going to stay in the safe for a while as the FIRST piece in what may some day become a decent centennial collection!

Very nice and as you'd expect, it has the earliest characteristics like the 1st style flat latch as compared to engine49guy's 4 digit # which has the 2nd style flat latch.

 

[Hondo44]

I'm not completely sure on this, but I think the original grip safeties were configured a bit differently. They have an extended section (having a hole for the lockdown pin), which protrudes farther into the frame to accept the lockdown pin at it's hole's location. That means that a new grip safety would have to be built up with welding, or an original grip safety obtained. Then the holes could be drilled. That's why I suspect it would be much more trouble than it would be worth. The new grip safeties also don't have a dimple with a white dot in the top. That was done so you could see if the safety was locked in or not. Dot showing: functional. Dot not showing: locked out.

John

John,
Thanks for the additional info. That certainly does complicate it. Maybe someone posting here that has a new model will post a photo.

 

[Art Doc]

This 1964 M40 has been my daily carry for 15 years. Got it cheap because of corrosion from storage near the ocean. Stags came from ebay for $6. Have the originals.

Got this 1962 M40 about 5 years ago but too nice to carry. No box but it does have the pin.

 

[PALADIN85020]

John,
Thanks for the additional info. That certainly does complicate it. Maybe someone posting here that has a new model will post a photo.

Well, I decided to investigate further. Since I do have both an older 40 and a newer 40-1, here's what I discovered.

First, here's a pic of both of them:

Next, here's an enlarged pic of the older Model 40 safety. You can see the tab, and that there are small pin-sized holes in both the tab and the frame.

Finally, here's an enlarged pic of the Model 40-1 safety. There is a tab, but the inside of the tab is hogged out into a very wide hole. That hole cannot be seen in this picture, but when the grip safety is depressed, it's apparent. Of course, there is no lockout pin hole in the frame.

It would therefore be impossible to drill a small hole in the area where there is a much larger hole in the tab on the new grip safety. Conclusion: It would be more trouble than it would be worth to try to convert the new safety into an older style that could be pinned down. I think S&W designed it this way so the grip safety couldn't be deactivated. That way they could justify the absence of the internal lock in today's litigious climate.

Hope this helps.

John

 

[Hondo44]

Well, I decided to investigate further. Since I do have both an older 40 and a newer 40-1, here's what I discovered.

Finally, here's an enlarged pic of the Model 40-1 safety. There is a tab, but the inside of the tab is hogged out into a very wide hole. That hole cannot be seen in this picture, but when the grip safety is depressed, it's apparent. Of course, there is no lockout pin hole in the frame.

It would therefore be impossible to drill a small hole in the area where there is a much larger hole in the tab on the new grip safety. Conclusion: It would be more trouble than it would be worth to try to convert the new safety into an older style that could be pinned down. I think S&W designed it this way so the grip safety couldn't be deactivated. That way they could justify the absence of the internal lock in today's litigious climate.

Hope this helps.

John

Thanks John,
That's very helpful, great photos. I can see it would have to be drilled in the tab above or below the hogged out area even if a smaller diameter pin had to be used.

 

[Engine49guy]

Found a 4 digit serial 4 screw locally with smooth high horns.
No box or docs in good condition but not nearly as nice as the one I already have...

 

[Gatorbaiter]

Mdl 631 Centennial Airweight in 32 Mag, only produced in 1991 & 1992:

 

[Engine49guy]

I dont usually get excited about engraved guns but that is a real work of art!
Thanks for sharing.

 

[S&W HE]

Let's see some Centennials! Either the originals or the models 40 and 42.

Let's see whatcha got!

John



Here's my 42.

 

[Hondo44]

Let's see some Centennials! Either the originals or the models 40 and 42.

Let's see whatcha got! JohnHere's my 42.

This may be a well known piece of information to Centennial owners, but the photos of your 'screamer' show me that the High horn smooth grip uasage extended into the "3 screw" period. Has anyone identified when the high horns transitioned out of use? And did it coincide with the elimination of smooth magnas?

Another question I've had that involves the Centennial model is since there is no engineering dash # for changing any of the J frames to a left hand extractor thread, as there was in '59-'60 for the larger frame sizes, were they all introduced with left hand thread extractors like most of the post war I frames were?