Mid Range .357

[Snapping Twig]

I've got lightning bolts and I have +P's, but what I needed today was a mid range magnum for my new to me K frames.

I thought about W231 and IMR 4227, but when I looked at my powder stash, Unique jumped out at me.

Consulting the books, I saw that the range of 6 ~ 8.4g would go from 900 ~ 1300fps, so I settled on 7g to push a 160g 358156 w/o the gas check somewhere in the 1100fps area.

What do you think of that load?

I have some 358156's that are loaded with 15.5g W296 that I will bring, but I'm not certain I'll use them in the K frame. They're good in the 586, and I'm toying with the idea of a round or two in my 65 to see where they land according to the fixed sights.

I'm also going to try some 358156's that I loaded into magnum cases over 5g W231 since they are +p 38 equivalents and should be fun to shoot in a 3" K frame.

Lemme know what you think of the 7g Unique load.

 

[bogman]

I shoot 6.0- 6.7 gr's of unique & a 158gr. cast SWC & get excellent accuracy. all of my S&W's like unique for cast bullets.

 

[pete950]

I shoot 6.0- 6.7 gr's of unique & a 158gr. cast SWC & get excellent accuracy. all of my S&W's like unique for cast bullets.

Im in the middle 6.5 of unique works great.

 

[Snapping Twig]

So you approve?

Fixed sights and all, I didn't want them to print too high to the sights, so I figured over 1000 and closer to 1100fps would be the ticket.

I have this 65-5 3" to try them in tomorrow and a 4" 13-3 I'll be picking up Tuesday (California waiting period) to see how they work out.

I'm of the opinion that since they're not making barrels for these anymore, I should treat them with respect. That and the fact that they're smaller and lighter then the N frames I shoot.

I have a 3" 629-2 that gets fed 265g cast over 22g W296, so recoil isn't a bad thing in my world, but for the mission of the 65 in particular, controlling the follow-up shot is an issue.

Fingers crossed for tomorrow.

 

[amazingflapjack]

158 gr LSWC over 7gr of Unique is my Goldilocks load. Flapjack.

 

[sjmjax]

158 grain LSWC or LRN and 6.0 grains of Unique.

You know you're out of the .38 special range but not abusive to gun nor shooter.

 

[txbirdman]

I use 6.5 gr of Unique with the 358429 (173 gr) and 7 gr. with the RCBS 150 gr. (actual weight with air cooled wheel weights 157 gr.)

 

[jibjab]

I have used Unique for 38spl/.357mag, 44spl and 45acp with good results, but I had a hard time getting it to meter well in my powder throw.

I tried AA#5 as a substitute, it meters perfectly and performs very well in 45acp and 9x18 Makarov. #5 also did well for me with heavy 38spl loadings, 44 spl and mid range .357 mag.

I am not trying to bash Unique as it is a great powder, but for now I am exploring other options.

 

[358156hp]

I've come back to Unique many times. I won't give it up again. I know it can be dirty, but I have to clean the guns anyway, and a quick wipe down is usually all it needs. It meters okay through my Dillon powder measure.

 

[Dragon88]

"Flammable dirt" is a mainstay isn't it? I always come back to Unique or W231 for my mid-range loads, they just work so well.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I use W231 for light midrange .357's and for heavier midrange loads it's all about HS-6. HS-6 is very accurate with lead bullets and the pressures are on the low side for the velocities it develops.

 

[jimkim]

10.0gr of AA#7 under a 158gr SWC

 

[Mule88]

Im using 6-6.5 gns Universal clays, with 158 gn cast, burns cleaner than Unique and very accurate

 

[Snapping Twig]

OMG!!!

I told you these were 358156 and that I loaded them w/o GC.

THEY TUMBLED! No ****! At 7 yards, 2 out of 6 tumbled.

This was in my 3" 65-5.

I tried them in a 4" 586-1 and a 5" 27-0 and they shot fine.

They went where I pointed the barrel, but they tumbled, so these are a no-go for the 65-5. I expect the extra barrel length made the difference with the other two revolvers and this gives me hope of the 4" 13-3 I'll be trying them in next week.

The best news is that I shot near 100 full power 160g cast (358156 wGC) over 15.5g W296 and it ate 'em up! One big hole at 7 & 10 yards.

I also used a magnum case and 5g W231 under the same bullet w/o GC and they shot just fine. No tumbling, no issue, accurate as sin.

So, souping up these bullets and not using the GC doesn't work in my 3" 65. I bet if I used the GC they'd work, so further experiments to follow.

 

[txbirdman]

You might try sizing the bullets about .001 larger and trying again. I've found that when cast bullets tumble it's usually because they are undersized for that particular firearm.

 

[Snapping Twig]

They're sized to .358 and can't pass through the cylinder unless I smack 'em with a dowel.

Like I mentioned, the other loads shot straight and true, just not these.

I will keep an open mind, but I am leaning to the no gas check on a checked bullet design at moderate speed as a contributing factor.

All the loads I put through it were the same bullet, sized the same made from the same alloy. The magnums with the gas checks installed were fantastic as were the +P loads w/o the gas checks, but boosting the speed and no check didn't work out so well.

 

[jibjab]

I told you these were 358156 and that I loaded them w/o GC.

THEY TUMBLED! No ****! At 7 yards, 2 out of 6 tumbled.

This was in my 3" 65-5.=QUOTE]

Could the bullets be skipping the riflings ? Not enough bearing surface (driving band) for a short barrel. I guess this kinda go along with post #15.

Without the GC there isn't much for the barrel to hold on to.

 

[Snapping Twig]

I'm leaning that way.

At +P velocity they spin up nice and go exactly where you want them to, but go past 900fps and the dynamics change.

Same bullet with the GC was a laser at full magnum velocity.

This mid range magnum out of the other 4" & 5" S&W's we had there today shot well, so IMO, the 3" barrel and no GC made for not enough stabilizing.

I'll be loading up some with the GC to compare.

But... seems my worries about needing a mid range magnum were not valid. The 15.5g W296 rounds (same bullet WITH GC) shot just fine.

If I can get these midrange mags working, and I believe it's an easy fix, they recoil a lot less and are worth the effort to have.

 

[jibjab]

Maybe a different bullet is needed ?

I am thinking of these for a 2.75" Ruger Sec. Six

.357 Keith 170 gr. SWC-FB per 500 .357 Keith 170 gr. SWC-FB [SWC] - $36.00 : Rim Rock Bullets, Premium Cast Lead Bullets

 

[Charliee]

For my mid range loads I use a 158 gr lead swc on top of 7 grains of Unique. I figure its about a 3/4 power load. I find it snappy but fun to shoot.