New Reloader: Instead of Unique?

[doc540]

I won a pound of Win231 yesterday at the silhouette match.

If I use Missouri Match 158 grain lead SWC to shoot through my no dash 6" 686 AND 8" 14-3.....

what Win231 powder load do you recommend to avoid leading and knock the living fire out of steel pigs and rams?

I won't be shooting paper or bullseye matches, just steel silhouette.

Here's what I bought:
.38 Match
.358 Diameter
.38 Special
158 Grain SWC
Brinell 12

Thanks! Can't wait to start tuning loads for my Smiths.

One other question:
Is it possible to create ONE LOAD that will work well in both guns OR should I reload two different loads, one for EACH gun?

 

[TAROMAN]

4.0 grains of 231 is my standard .38 Special load with the same bullet from Missouri.
Shoots well in a variety of revolvers.
Only way to be sure in yours is to try it out.

 

[4barrel]

I get a 158 gr. bullet with a hardness of 18 & resize them to 357 over 4.9 gr. of 231. Good for 100 yard pigs. Actually I make my own and send them down range with my Royce Weddle 6" bull barrel model 15. Good luck.

 

[doc540]

I get a 158 gr. bullet with a hardness of 18 & resize them to 357 over 4.9 gr. of 231. Good for 100 yard pigs. Actually I make my own and send them down range with my Royce Weddle 6" bull barrel model 15. Good luck.

Well, since I already have the bullets posted above, what amount of Win321 do you recommend that won't lead my barrels, knock down steel silhouettes, and work in both guns?

Thanks

btw: I have two loading books but neither addresses the hardness/charge/leading issue.

 

[tappedandtagged]

Leading is different with each gun.mi have a Tarus 357 mag that pushes the soft and hard (12 and 18) MO bullets with no leading no matter how fast I push them. I've pushed them with everthing from 5.5 grains of Unique on up to 12 grains of AA 9 and haven't seen any leading. As far as my 44 mag goes, the 12 bhn bullets lead my barrel no matter what. The faster I push them, the more leading I got. Even with 7.5 grains of Unique I was getting leading. I got some 18 bhn ones and haven't had any.

As far as one or two loads for your guns, an accurate load in one gun is usually accurate in another, but it just may not be the most accurate. To find out, you are just gonna have to try several loads yourself and see which ones give you the accuracy you want without the leading.

My load for my .357 is 12 grains of AA 9 with the MO 357 action bullet (158 swc at 18 bhn). As far as the W231, sorry, never tried the stuff.

 

[smithnframe]

What velocity are you gonna shoot that Brinell 12 hardness bullet at?

 

[doc540]

What velocity are you gonna shoot that Brinell 12 hardness bullet at?

I guess that's one of the questions I didn't exactly know how to ask.

What's an optimum velocity to shoot a Missouri Match, 158 grain, Brunell 12 bullet and not have it lead my barrels?

 

[4barrel]

Well, since I already have the bullets posted above, what amount of Win321 do you recommend that won't lead my barrels, knock down steel silhouettes, and work in both guns?

Thanks

btw: I have two loading books but neither addresses the hardness/charge/leading issue.

I would say run some down the pipe & check every 10 rounds or so. Missouri Bullet Co. has 18 hardness. If they lead slow them for plinking or sell them to one of your friends--and get some 18s.----I am talking 38 special in both guns. I dont think I would use 231 in a mag in a meet. For me 14 gr. of 2400 & a mag case is a better pig & ram knocker downer with your same bullets.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

My favorite .38 Special load is 4.0gr W231 under a 158gr LSWC bullet. It's a good accurate load for many uses. I get no leading at all when using a 12 BHN bullet.

 

[doc540]

My favorite .38 Special load is 4.0gr W231 under a 158gr LSWC bullet. It's a good accurate load for many uses. I get no leading at all when using a 12 BHN bullet.

straight answer

thnx

 

[Aticus]

Are you using 38 Spl. for pigs and rams? If so why?

You do know that 231 is a fast pistol powder meant for bullseye shooting don't you? If you're looking for enough velocity and energy for rams and pigs I doubt that you'll get enough of either to do the job. You're going to have to go to a slower burning powder to do that job.

The post of 4 gr. of 231 behind a 158 LSWC is a great target load but I have a feeling it's going to have a little trouble knocking down rams and pigs reliably. Try it but I think you'd be better served with with 2400.

Just my two cents worth.

 

[MKT]

I run 4.0 of 231 pushing a 158 grain SWC cast from straight wheel weights. Works great and no leading, but then again I'm shoot targets not steel pigs.

 

[doc540]

I have Unique and Win231.

That's all I have to work with, boys.

Here is the factory +P ammo the 686 likes.

Muzzle Velocity: 945 fps
Muzzle Energy: 248 ft. lbs.

And it knocks 'em over just fine.

 

[Aticus]

If 945 fps works for you then check a few manuals to find a load in that velocity range and go for it Vern. I was just thinking that would give you enough power for the rams.

Have a ball dude!

 

[doc540]

If 945 fps works for you then check a few manuals to find a load in that velocity range and go for it Vern. I was just thinking that would give you enough power for the rams.

Have a ball dude!

Fun it is.

I won with high score overall last weekend shooting those Rem .38 +P's.

Lost about three points from knocking a target sideways, but the guy next to me was shooting 200 grain SWC's out of his Clark custom .45 1911. He turned a couple too.

My iron sight gun is on the way, a 14-3 8 3/8" and I'm looking for a common load.

compromises - I'll make them

 

[Jim Watson]

56 gr of Swiss 1 1/2 Fg and a 405 gr .411" Snover.
Oh, wait, that was a different herd of silhouettes.

I've loaded a lot of .38 158 gr SWC with 4.6 gr W231.
Knock down rams?
Hit turkeys?
Not lead barrel?
I dunno, you will just have to load YOUR bullets and shoot them in YOUR guns to see.

 

[ray45]

You have got lots of good advice. For mid range loads with 231 and Unique , try this.

38 special.. 158 gr lswc ...4 gr Unique or 231 and tweek

357 magnum.. 158 gr lswc ...5 gr Unique or 231 and tweek

 

[WR Moore]

The .357 load quoted just above is way light for Unique. Alliant lists 6.0 gr for the Speer 158 gr lead bullet and 4.7 gr in .38 Spl as maximum.

For decades 5.0 gr Unique was widely regarded as a fine .38 load for the 158 lead bullet. IIRC, I used 6.8 gr under the Remington factory 158 gr RNL (0.360 in diameter) without issue and no leading. Since I don't have access to my records, don't take the .357 load as gospel.

Lyman has a lot of lead bullet load data avaiable in their manuals. Worth the price. BTW, a lot of load data for lead bullets is lower than for a jacketed bullet of the same weight. This is due to the need to keep reduce/eliminate leading.

I looked at the Hogdon website for .38 loads with cast bullets and WW231 and don't recall seeing any. On the other hand, it's 0400 local and the concentration isn't what it could be.

 

[doc540]

Are you using 38 Spl. for pigs and rams? If so why?

cause I don't own a .39

 

[ray45]

The .357 load quoted just above is way light for Unique. Alliant lists 6.0 gr for the Speer 158 gr lead bullet and 4.7 gr in .38 Spl as maximum.

For decades 5.0 gr Unique was widely regarded as a fine .38 load for the 158 lead bullet. IIRC, I used 6.8 gr under the Remington factory 158 gr RNL (0.360 in diameter) without issue and no leading. Since I don't have access to my records, don't take the .357 load as gospel.

OK, 5 gr of unique in 357 cases should give aprox. 900 fps+ with 158 gr swc. This is a mild accurate load and I have used it for years. I still say it is a good place to start. Not way light at all.

I have taken the 38 special,158 gr swc and Unique to places only the brave/foolish dare go.