Not all of us are. The law, or the application of it, changes more than a little. Right and wrong don't change much, if at all.
Charles Askins, Jr,
- Thread starter THE PILGRIM
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mc5aw
Member
Different man from a different time.
Years ago, after tiring of hearing him talk about shooting while standing on your "hind legs", I asked him which of his "fore legs" he shot with.
I never received a reply.
I never received a reply.
153
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In these days when everyone who ever served in the military gets a "thank you for your service", seems to me that Col. Askins deserves better. Especially since he's not here to defend himself. I read his books and articles, and while he may have fallen short of "perfect" he deserves better.
Colonel, thank you for your service!
Colonel, thank you for your service!
OFT II
US Veteran
I have very mixed feelings about Askins. It seems that he went out of his way to get into a gun fight both on the border and during the war.
With all the problems that we have on the border now we might could use several like him today.
With all the problems that we have on the border now we might could use several like him today.
Texas Star
US Veteran
Was one "Jelly" Bryce? He was from OK and surely as deadly as Askins. But as far as I know, everyone he killed had it coming. He must have been remarkably fast and accurate.
Jeff Cooper told me that he (Cooper) killed only three men. But I think he'd be an asset in a fight.
Wyatt Burp
Member
No, but Bryce came to mind when I was writing that post.
Delft "Jelly" Bryce was promoted up to Special Agent in Charge (Albuquerque Division) before he retired, so he was not one of the gents referenced above. I walk past his portrait on SAC row about every day at the office.
feralmerril
Absent Comrade
IF only part of the stuff I have just read is true, Askins was over the top in any age of this country. I dug up this old thread I posted and read all 29 pages of the posters. Many of them claimed to have first hand experiances with him and his "Manners". Read all of it for yourselves and come back and give your imput.
So...how bout Charles Askins, Jr.? - 24hourcampfire
I wonder how many of us posted a few days ago about how "far over the top" and un nessary that guy Byron Smith was killing those two teenagers that had been stealing him blind. Remember that? How could anyone defend Askins and condem Smith for finishing off those two teenagers?
I really believe even in Askins day in the 30s and 40s his actions wouldnt have been tolerated had he been found out or not protected by several fellow officers. He brags about them long after the fact to where if some higher officals were to call him out on it all he would have to do is say, cant you take a lie? And just laugh at them. If NOTHING else, just read about the 8 or so posters that claimed to have interacted with him regarding him feeling their wives knees etc at partys or whatever in a manner that was dareing their husbands to try and do something about it.
He was my hero once too until I started reading this other stuff years ago. As my dad would say many years ago, "What a man!" And when he said that, it couldnt be mistaken for a compliment. If so, and nothing else, he ENJOYED killing. And if none of THIS is so, what would we call him?
So...how bout Charles Askins, Jr.? - 24hourcampfire
I wonder how many of us posted a few days ago about how "far over the top" and un nessary that guy Byron Smith was killing those two teenagers that had been stealing him blind. Remember that? How could anyone defend Askins and condem Smith for finishing off those two teenagers?
I really believe even in Askins day in the 30s and 40s his actions wouldnt have been tolerated had he been found out or not protected by several fellow officers. He brags about them long after the fact to where if some higher officals were to call him out on it all he would have to do is say, cant you take a lie? And just laugh at them. If NOTHING else, just read about the 8 or so posters that claimed to have interacted with him regarding him feeling their wives knees etc at partys or whatever in a manner that was dareing their husbands to try and do something about it.
He was my hero once too until I started reading this other stuff years ago. As my dad would say many years ago, "What a man!" And when he said that, it couldnt be mistaken for a compliment. If so, and nothing else, he ENJOYED killing. And if none of THIS is so, what would we call him?
cmort666
Member
I'd be a liar if I said I wouldn't enjoy killing Ayman al Zawahiri.
That having been said, if I killed him (or tried to), it wouldn't be to steal some liquor.
Here are a few facts about Askins:
He fought for his country in WWII and Korea and achieved the rank of Colonel(not necessarily an easy task if you are a screw up).
He worked many years as a peace officer and risked his life serving in one of the most dangerous parts of America.
His marksmanship and tactics very likely saved the lives of other law enforcement officers.
He arrested or ended the careers of many dangerous criminals.
He was a top level competitive shooter and national champion in skeet shooting and NRA bullseye(not an easy task either).
He was an accomplished author with many books and published articles.
There are a lot negative things that have already been stated about him, but a lot of the illegal activities was hearsay and no charges were filed, and Askins made his living writing so it was possible some of his stories were juiced up to enhance the entertainment value. Askins also like to say things that "shock people"(I must admit I also do that to certain people).
His family and especially his wife and granddaughter really loved him, and no one will ever know the real truth. He is no hero to me but he is now, a pretty interesting legend.
He fought for his country in WWII and Korea and achieved the rank of Colonel(not necessarily an easy task if you are a screw up).
He worked many years as a peace officer and risked his life serving in one of the most dangerous parts of America.
His marksmanship and tactics very likely saved the lives of other law enforcement officers.
He arrested or ended the careers of many dangerous criminals.
He was a top level competitive shooter and national champion in skeet shooting and NRA bullseye(not an easy task either).
He was an accomplished author with many books and published articles.
There are a lot negative things that have already been stated about him, but a lot of the illegal activities was hearsay and no charges were filed, and Askins made his living writing so it was possible some of his stories were juiced up to enhance the entertainment value. Askins also like to say things that "shock people"(I must admit I also do that to certain people).
His family and especially his wife and granddaughter really loved him, and no one will ever know the real truth. He is no hero to me but he is now, a pretty interesting legend.
cmort666
Member
Is it "hearsay" if HE admitted to them... IN WRITING?
When's the last time YOU admitted to being involved in an armed robbery? If you weren't why WOULD you?
- sociopath
- pathological liar
- both
You have no control over how others portray you.
You have TOTAL control over how you portray YOURSELF.
What I have a hard time beleiving that there are so many people out there that claim to have had personal experiance with him! The guy has been dead for years. I think there is a lot of BSing going one here.
John
John
BLACKHAWKNJ
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A lot of the negative attitude towards Askins seems to come from his manners-or lack there of. Interesting that many in the shooting community hail Seal Team 6 for taking out Osama Bin Laden or snipers in the current and past conflicts-for their skill and daring. But IMHO it's one thing to bust in on an unarmed man with the World's Finest by your side or drill someone from 300 yards away and another to do it in a dark alley with the bullets already flying and the odds against you.
He made money by selling books and magazine articles. People don't want to buy uninteresting reading material, and he says he did all these things but it was never anything he could be later charged with.
Heck, there are loudmouth guys at my gun club who have killed more men than he did, just ask em'. ....and all were shot right between the eyes!
Golly, we sure have been beatin' this topic to death, and I'm sure the Colonel is turnin' in his grave as we speak.
Having known a few good ol' boys of that generation, I have to echo the sentiments of some folks on this thread who have pointed out the fact that it was a different time.
Not too many decades ago, there was an old boy who lived in a town just south of my place. His name was Bill Carson, but for some reason, everybody called him "Base Bill." Bill always rode his horse into town, and he was never seen without a long-barreled .45 Colt strapped to his hip.
One day, Bill was going up north for a week or so to visit his daughter and he asked his closest neighbor to watch his ranch while he was gone. "What should I do if I find anybody messin' around your place?" the neighbor asked Bill. Bill's reply was fairly typical of that age and generation. "Just shoot 'em," he said. And, by golly, he meant it. Like I said, that wasn't too long ago, and people at that time just accepted that type of behavior...at least in this part of the country.
I never met Colonel Askins, but have read some of what he wrote and some of what was written about him. I know many of his colleagues in the "outdoor writer" world had a few misgivings about him, but not knowing the man, I can't say. I think I can say, however, that he was definitely a product of his environment, which was pretty darn rough, to say the least.
I guess the bottom line is...I'm a little hesitant to say something derogatory about a guy when he's not there to take a swing at me if he's offended by the truth.
Having known a few good ol' boys of that generation, I have to echo the sentiments of some folks on this thread who have pointed out the fact that it was a different time.
Not too many decades ago, there was an old boy who lived in a town just south of my place. His name was Bill Carson, but for some reason, everybody called him "Base Bill." Bill always rode his horse into town, and he was never seen without a long-barreled .45 Colt strapped to his hip.
One day, Bill was going up north for a week or so to visit his daughter and he asked his closest neighbor to watch his ranch while he was gone. "What should I do if I find anybody messin' around your place?" the neighbor asked Bill. Bill's reply was fairly typical of that age and generation. "Just shoot 'em," he said. And, by golly, he meant it. Like I said, that wasn't too long ago, and people at that time just accepted that type of behavior...at least in this part of the country.
I never met Colonel Askins, but have read some of what he wrote and some of what was written about him. I know many of his colleagues in the "outdoor writer" world had a few misgivings about him, but not knowing the man, I can't say. I think I can say, however, that he was definitely a product of his environment, which was pretty darn rough, to say the least.
I guess the bottom line is...I'm a little hesitant to say something derogatory about a guy when he's not there to take a swing at me if he's offended by the truth.
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He made money by selling books and magazine articles. People don't want to buy uninteresting reading material, and he says he did all these things but it was never anything he could be later charged with.
Heck, there are loudmouth guys at my gun club who have killed more men than he did, just ask em'. ....and all were shot right between the eyes!
+1 There are more retired smipers here where I live than have ever been in all the services combined!! Don't believe me just ask them! LOL Almost every time I go to one of my LGS I hear " I was a sniper in the military". Making claims that even they can't believe--I hope!!!
John
ColbyBruce
Member
He doesn't sound like the kind of person I would care to live next door to.
mjr
Member
There's a good chance that a lot of them were snipe hunters in the Boy Scouts.
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