Where is the quality control......

[tiggen]

Just got home from picking up my 627, a gun that I have been thinking about purchasing for about 18 months. My carry gun (386) needs to go back to the factory for work, so I thought this would be the perfect opportunity to purchase the 627 and see if I am happy carrying a heavier gun.

This is what I bought. I saw it before I left.

On the ride home I decided to make a post in this forum. This thread happened to be at the top of the list so I opened it up and started reading. I hope the OP is ok with this slight hijack, but I think it is appropriate for two reasons.

One, it's a quality control issue, just like the OP's.

Two, I agree with the OP. How could this possibly leave the factory in this condition? His problem was internal. Mine was external. Neither gun should have left the factory.

I'll send it back. It'll get fixed. But now I'm out two revolvers with nothing to carry. Not to mention that after 18 months of thinking about this gun, I finally have it, for a day, before I ship it off for God knows how long.

To those who say I shouldn't flame S&W before giving them the chance to fix it, I'm not flaming S&W; I'm expressing my frustration. They already had one chance to fix it, and they CHOSE not to do so.

Interestingly enough, there was nothing wrong with the finish on the Bulgarian AK I bought.

 

[D Brown]

In my defense, as you saw in older posts I didn't bash S&W, I just made this post about quality control in these days, as for the date on my gun, I didn't pay attention till my gunsmith took out the fired case and saw the date, so i figured it was at the distributor or stored at the gun shop, if you could have seen the dust on the blue case, it did sit for awhile, as for the post why I got it when I noticed the issue, again in my defense, I had right wrist/hand surgery in 2007, I have a tendency to short stroke a revolver due to lack of mobility and strength in my hand, so I figured it was me and not the gun, also his issue only occurred in double action only, worked fine in single action, so hence I thought it was me. As for me not sending it back was simple to me, my gunsmith was a S&W warranty repair station as I stated before, I know him quite well and wholeheartedly trusted him for the repairs, which he did, I have in the past delt with sending guns back for warranty repair work, and got to them back only to send it back cause they were still not fixed properly. I was just making a statement on today's quality control, but all I got was slack for " bashing" S&W, that's why I haven't made posts in this forum for quite sometime. Lastly, my point in this post was that this should have not left the factory like it was, period, customers should never have to be a factory's "quality control inspector".

Annihilator,

Your point that the end user should not be the factory quality control inspector is probably shared by all of us, but in today's world, that is the reality with most products.

It's too bad that you missed the opportunity to express your sentiment to the folks at Smith & Wesson, which you could have easily done, had you given them a call to discuss the problems you were having with your new gun.

Best of luck with your new Model 66.

 

[MichiganScott]

Just got home from picking up my 627, a gun that I have been thinking about purchasing for about 18 months. My carry gun (386) needs to go back to the factory for work, so I thought this would be the perfect opportunity to purchase the 627 and see if I am happy carrying a heavier gun.

This is what I bought. I saw it before I left.

On the ride home I decided to make a post in this forum. This thread happened to be at the top of the list so I opened it up and started reading. I hope the OP is ok with this slight hijack, but I think it is appropriate for two reasons.

One, it's a quality control issue, just like the OP's.

Two, I agree with the OP. How could this possibly leave the factory in this condition? His problem was internal. Mine was external. Neither gun should have left the factory.

I'll send it back. It'll get fixed. But now I'm out two revolvers with nothing to carry. Not to mention that after 18 months of thinking about this gun, I finally have it, for a day, before I ship it off for God knows how long.

To those who say I shouldn't flame S&W before giving them the chance to fix it, I'm not flaming S&W; I'm expressing my frustration. They already had one chance to fix it, and they CHOSE not to do so.

Interestingly enough, there was nothing wrong with the finish on the Bulgarian AK I bought.

My opinion is that when you buy a firearm that you know has problems you have no right to complain about the problems. What you are doing is akin to buying a brand new truck with drips in the paint that you know about and then complaining about the paint job.

You should have CHOSE not to buy it.

 

[bigpappa160]

Hey rwsmith, I don't think SW gives any priority to warranty repair guns! The reason I say this is I had to send my brand new model 60 never shot back to SW. They sent me a shipping label I shipped it back, they received and signed for it on 18 May. So, I waited a week, then I contacted them to find out about the repair, this is on 25 May, the lady said it was in the mail room waiting to be processed, I was like it has been a week that ya'll signed for and received the gun, crickets, crickets! I said ok I need it fixed. So I waited, on 5 June contacted SW to find out on the repair, the guy I spoke with said it was in the queue to be looked out to be repaired and it could take 2-4 weeks to repair. So I'm thinking to myself, there must be a whole lot of SW being sent back for warranty repair and I'm second guessing myself in getting a SW and I've owned different SW guns for the last 5 yrs and this is the first to be sent back. Now knowing it is going to take god know how long to get gun fixed, I would've spent my money to go to gunsmith to fix revolver. I've also researched about a month probably a couple hrs a day on different SW revolvers and only seen good reviews and I consider myself a SW gun guy so that's why I got the model 60. But with this gun when It comes back I may sale it.

 

[BigBill]

There's a reason I own RedHawks too. For me to send a s&w back for repair my ffl has to send it. More money spent on a new poor workmanship, faulty gun.

 

[Watchdog]

Why would anyone buy a new gun that exhibits a problem before it even leaves the LGS?

 

[xuout1]

The reality is that Smith no longer has the skilled craftsman's putting revolvers together any more. They only care about the cash cow auto pistols that can be assembled by a drunk monkey in a dark room. Last two new smiths I had were sent back several times and never were right so I got Rid of them. You can still get a good gun but I would say the chance of getting a bad one now is much higher. And as long as people keep buying them they will not care.

 

[rwsmith]

I was dismayed....

I was dismayed because Sig Sauer (America) is unable to produce a run of guns for a NJ PD, in spite of repeated attempts, to the point that a lawsuit is pending to refund the money for the guns AND the leather they bought with them, since it is useless w/o a working gun. We live in terrible times that seem to be getting worse. 25 years ago you could buy any Sig and be sure that you had one of the best guns in the world before firing it. It's like Rolex shipped everything they made, whether it worked or not and counted on the customer to send it back if it doesn't function.

I find these events extremely distressing. We are supposedly trying to make the US a competitor in manufacturing again and one of our top gun factories has difficulty screwing a barrel on straight.

 

[bigpappa160]

Watchdog, I was standing at the desk of the FFL when I called SW about the revolver. So I took SW word it was good. 1st revolver I've owned! It's also weird that when someone actually goes to a gun store and looks at a SW revolver the barrel isn't canted and the front sights aren't canted and I've looked at a lot, but when someone orders a revolver from a web store it comes with a canted barrel and front sight and There's a lot of people out there that has reported canted barrels after the revolver has come in from a web store they order from online. Only thing people ask for is Good Quality for the price people pays for SW products

 

[ladder13]

Better check those "quality" RedHawks too since many people report the front sights falling out due to improper staking.
And Sig? Hah, nuff said.

 

[American1776]

I *know* that the folks at S&W are *capable* of building a super tight revolver. They just don't want to put in the time and effort. Case in point:

At my LGS, they have a new M57 classics series. It is the tightest, most perfectly fitted revolver I've ever handled. The cylinder almost feels welded to the frame in lock up. Zero endshake, perfect yoke seam, straight barrel.

So it's clear that they can do this; they just don't want to put in the time.

 

[Ashlander]

The *vast* majority of gun owners who buy S&W revolvers new will shoot the gun a few times, put it in a safe or carry it, and not shoot it much at all again. Many gun owners buy the gun, load it, and stick it in a drawer where it sits for 50 years untouched.

Amen. My father-in-law's employer gave him a Colt snubbie in the 1970s for protection when he had to go to "the city." He never fired it (I don't think he ever loaded it). In 2010 or so I suggested he take it out and have a little fun shooting it out at the farm. It would not cycle. It turned out to be a burr in the action. Thank God he never needed that thing to work.

 

[Muss Muggins]

I keep seeing posters saying why buy a gun that had issues, if you read the whole post, I didn't know the gun was the issue, so please before you go and say things like that, take time and read, thank you.

What would have been wrong with handing it back to the shopkeep and saying "Cycle this and tell me if you think it's catching . . . "

?

 

[Capttjk1]

When people see problems with guns before they purchase and still buy them, I just don't get it. I have bought 15+ NIB S&W revolvers over the past couple of years. Only problem I have had was with a new 629 Classic 5". I bought it from Bud's. I noticed BEFORE I accepted the firearm and did the transfer that the finish was scratched up and timing was off on 4 of the 6 chambers when checking cylinder rotation. I refused the weapon and my FFL sent it back to Bud's. Bud's had a new one to my FFL in 6 days that was perfect.

I do everything I can to keep from having to send a new weapon back to S&W because I thoroughly check the weapon before I buy, and if there is a problem that is noticeable at the store, I certainly won't accept it. Saves a lot of trouble down the road.

 

[bigpappa160]

Here's another prime example of SW Quality Control, got this off a review I just read about the 642 pro this guy bought, Everything was great until I realized this cylinder was never cut for moon clips! The revolver is currently back to S&W to install the proper cylinder. I guess when you order online it's a dice roll if you get a good QC'd gun or one that slipped in between the cracks, but there's a lot of slips in between the cracks here lately! But like I said I'm not going to give up on SW, I'll drive on and I'm going next Friday to LGS and get a 642 which is going to be 10% off, so out the door it will be $360, plus when I send in the mail in rebate total cost $330. Love the sales and mail in rebates SW gives.

 

[Mr.Harry]

Watchdog, I was standing at the desk of the FFL when I called SW about the revolver. So I took SW word it was good. 1st revolver I've owned! It's also weird that when someone actually goes to a gun store and looks at a SW revolver the barrel isn't canted and the front sights aren't canted and I've looked at a lot, but when someone orders a revolver from a web store it comes with a canted barrel and front sight and There's a lot of people out there that has reported canted barrels after the revolver has come in from a web store they order from online. Only thing people ask for is Good Quality for the price people pays for SW products

I've wondered this myself - if more of these flaws turn up in on-line purchases and if so, why? Because the potential customer at the LGS notices flaw, doesn't buy the weapon, and thence doesn't write about their disappointment? Are their an equal amount of flawed guns sitting on shelves at the store, or are more of them somehow being channeled into on-line sales? I don't know but wonder. I have never bought a gun from on-line. Neither do I handle revolvers at stores as frequently as many here do, though I do handle them more than your 'average joe'. I still have not discovered a canted barrel or conspicuously flawed smith and Wesson revolver in my foraging. Albeit I'm still relatively new to doing it. Yes, I have read where posters do see them on shelves. But I don't read this frequently, and as I said, I have yet to discover one myself.

 

[Mr.Harry]

Mr Harry, a few years ago I purchased a 629 with the 6" inch barrel, ordered it online and shipped to my dealer, it shot fine but I noticed the barrel wasn't screwed in all the way to the frame, you could stick a feeler gage between it and the frame, sent it back, after some time got it back, but with a canted barrel, after S&W fixed it, so it went back again, maybe this will explain why I didn't send my 66-8 back but had my gunsmith fix it instead, so yes, I have seen canted barrels.

I in no way doubt or discredit your or other's experiences. I've seen the pics here, clearly it's happening. I'm literally just wondering aloud if a proponderance of the bad eggs somehow find themselves in the stock of on-line brokers. Probably not a logical conjecture.

 

[D Brown]

S & W Quality Control

Thanks D. Brown,
My gunsmith has taken several pictures of the internals on the gun, and explained in detail what needed to be done to it, he is sending a detailed email to S&W about this issue just to let them know, like I said before, he used to be a repair station for a them, it's not going to do any good, but he felt they should know of this, anyway I am happy it's fixed, as I said it shoots great, it's just one of those things in this day & age that happens a lot, not just to S&W, but most manufacturers nowadays.

It's good to know that Smith & Wesson will be made aware of the issues with your new Model 66.

Thank you.

 

[MichiganScott]

I keep seeing posters saying why buy a gun that had issues, if you read the whole post, I didn't know the gun was the issue, so please before you go and say things like that, take time and read, thank you.

Annihilator, I read the whole thread. The post I commented on was #22 by tiggen. I read your post and realize that you had no idea about the defects. There is a reason I tend to copy posts when I respond.

For the record, I've sent a few S&W's back in over the years and have always been well satisfied when they came back. The first one was a Model 29-2 purchased new in 1977 when they were still difficult to come by after "Dirty Harry". I would no more pay a local 'smith to work on my handguns while they are under warranty than I would a local mechanic on my new truck.

 

[Watchdog]

Watchdog, I was standing at the desk of the FFL when I called SW about the revolver. So I took SW word it was good.

No offense, but why are you telling me this?

I haven't said anything to you, about you, or about you buying a gun. Now have I? This is the only comment of yours that I've replied to in this thread.

I wasn't referring to you, period. If I'd been referring to you, I would have quoted you. Okay?