Police billy club for model 15 revolver

[DWalt]

It seems to me that the device was held onto the barrel by the front sight, somewhat like the socket bayonets of Civil War rifled muskets were retained by the front sight of the barrel. I would think that it had to be made to fit specifically either Colt or S&W revolvers and they were not likely to have the same barrel OD. In 1919, I believe there were considerably more Colts than S&Ws in police service.

 

[Rusty Shacklford]

Hey, I have a thought for you. The club is a multi use tool, it can be used as a normal club, but it has a secondary use. It's not used as a club on the weapon, it is a projectile weapon, an early version of the beanbag round. Yes if it didn't have a .38 hole through the middle it could shoot further, maybe 100 yards or more, but that would be too much. It doesn't have an attachment point to the barrel, it isn't a suppressor or flash hider. It is used with blank ammunition -flies through the air and hits someone-hard. I had an uncle who was a cop way back when, and they did stuff, regulations weren't so strict. Maybe it was a product sold, or it may have been produced in house, so to speak. Just my opinion, I have no documentation, only intuition, Thanks.

 

[elm_creek_smith]

It does have an attachment point to the barrel. The knurled collar turns and locks behind the front sight.

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[Dvan34]

It certainly would be both unwieldy and dangerous to use as an extension on the barrel in a brawl or physical confrontation. The pistol might discharge. Certainly would incapacitate using the pistol at close quarters.

 

[jw mathews]

If there is a patent NUMBER along with the date, it might be fairly easy to look up the patent info, which would describe the purpose of the invention. I do not think it was intended to be used as a projectile, like a dummy (rifle) grenade.

 

[nicky4968]

I don’t believe it was meant to be used as an impact weapon when attached. Looking at the patent paperwork, Mr. Moor first designed a barrel extension. Putting it in a billy club came later.
My SWAG is you carried the billy club as just that, a billy club. With that steel lining, it would be a bone crusher.
If one wanted to use it as a barrel extension, one could.
I just can’t figure out why anyone needed a barrel extension in the first place.

 

[DCWilson]

If there is a patent NUMBER along with the date, it might be fairly easy to look up the patent info, which would describe the purpose of the invention. I do not think it was intended to be used as a projectile, like a dummy (rifle) grenade.

Here's a link to the patent:

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/c2/4b/97/f006fd2ff7a0c8/US1297891.pdf

That link produces a warning message, but I consider it safe to proceed. The patent data base is a Google service, and you are unlikely to get a malware blast from any of their enterprises.

I think the inventor, E.N. Moor, had a basic purpose in mind of lengthening the sight radius to make long shots with a handgun more achievable. His wood-shrouded barrel extension could, by itself, be used as a billy club. Though he is silent on the point, I see no evidence in the patent language that he intended the device to be used as a club while attached to a revolver barrel.

As reported in one of the links above, this device fits a Colt revolver, but not a S&W -- certainly not a S&W with a four inch barrel.


EDITED TO ADD: I didn't realize when I posted this that the truncheon/barrel combination was the subject of a separate patent. Please see post 54 in this thread.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

While I admit it's pretty darned cool it looks like something a couple of LEOs thought up after during a long, hard night of heavy drinking.

Is this better?

 

[DWalt]

"I think the inventor, E.N. Moor, had a basic purpose in mind of lengthening the sight radius to make long shots with a handgun more achievable."

That is more or less the principal purpose explained and claimed in the patent, as there is no mention of the billy club. It is purely a method to achieve a longer sight radius for greater accuracy. So you carried the billy club for its normal purpose, and if you needed more accuracy, you attached the billy to the revolver barrel. But I guess the inventor must have forgotten about the need for a front sight as none is apparent from the picture of the billy. Even so, it seems to be a terrible idea with no real accuracy improvements to be gained.

 

[4barrel]

I am thinking about drilling a hole in mine.

 

[nachogrande]

SOME OUTSIDE THE BOX THINKING, RIGHT THERE.

Will it kill a bear?

 

[elm_creek_smith]

I am thinking about drilling a hole in mine.

Not me. Don't see it working.

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[DCWilson]

Another Moor patent, this one specifically for the device we are discussing:

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/e9/fa/61/b132fbed700238/US1281195.pdf

The language of the truncheon patent again suggests that the device is essentially a modified design for an ordinary truncheon in order to permit it to be pressed into service for increased potential accuracy while shooting a revolver at longer distances. I see no language that suggests or even imagines that the device is to be used as a club while attached to a revolver.

 

[jughed440]

Another Moor patent, this one specifically for the device we are discussing:

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/e9/fa/61/b132fbed700238/US1281195.pdf

...the creative 'inventor'.

 

[Muley Gil]

The sight radius is determined by the position of the front and rear sights. This device can not lengthen the sight radius, as it has no additional front sight.

 

[rwt1405]

Perhaps it's just me, BUT, I'm thinking that I REALLY need one of these!

Why, I have no idea, I just know that I do!

 

[DCWilson]

In the 1920 census, Edward N. Moor, 61, widowed, is a lodger at a large apartment building on California Street in Oakland. His profession is Salesman and his industry is Patents. His son, Edward N. Moor Jr., lives across the bay in Marin County. He has a wife and son. His profession is City Salesman and his Industry is Machinery.

Also living in Oakland is Harry C. Schroeder, 40, immigrant to US in 1881 and naturalized in 1900. His profession is Patent Attorney and his industry is General Practice. He is categorized as Employer.

Moor Jr. is categorized as Wage Worker, and his father works on his own account.

Moor was also granted patents on a fishing reel, several lathe attachments, and a "heaving plug" (whatever that is) for oil wells.

In the video link posted on the previous page, Jim Supica said the truncheon/barrel he was discussing had been produced by Automatic Screw Company of California. I found in old papers a reference to the California Automatic Screw Machine Company of Los Angeles, which is sort of consistent with the stamped C.A.S. seen in one of the photos in the original post.

 

[DCWilson]

The sight radius is determined by the position of the front and rear sights. This device can not lengthen the sight radius, as it has no additional front sight.

The provided photos of the actual device show no obvious front sight, but both patents describe new rear and front sights that would for the truncheon variety have a sight radius of 10-11 inches (my estimation), or 1-2 inches less than the length of the truncheon itself.

 

[Jim Watson]

It would serve as a foreend for a good grip on those long shots.

 

[mtgianni]

I would not let a gun auction site determine value but ask Sotheby's if it is a museum collectible.