Canted or over-clocked barrels.

Neversink n Klapperthal said:
you are correct.but its not just Smith.Having retired from manufacturing,I have seen the causes.Companies get behind on work due to heavy incoming orders. Experienced employees retiring,companies hiring new/ part time help. Often times after a company puts time and effort into training new guys they quit and go elsewhere. The result is a binch of employees with not enough experience to make a quality product. For every ten employees hired,one will stay past a couple years
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Pay and working conditions. Working conditions covers a lot of ground, mutual respect between management and labor, job satisfaction or being able to take pride in your product.
 
Vilkus said:
Several years ago I bought a new .357 bolt action rifle. While drifting the sights the barrel started to unscrew. It was only hand tight.
I returned the rifle to the manufacturer. When I got it back the barrel was screwed in tight but overclocked enough that the sights were beyond adjustment.
I sent the rifle back again and it was fixed correctly. CS was good, but it makes you wonder about the folks actually assembling and inspecting.
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what your saying is correct. Incredibly,there are manufacturing companies who have completely eliminated their inspections as a cost saving measure. I worked for one.Quality went downhill and customers were furious. And still no inspections.
 
steelslaver said:
Pay and working conditions. Working conditions covers a lot of ground, mutual respect between management and labor, job satisfaction or being able to take pride in your product.
Click to expand...

Yeah well employers have seen to it that employees are put on the commodity list like raw materials.

Actually I just read the other day that there is a growing tend to put employees ahead of shareholders. I am sure that is a long term uphill battle.

I was a contractor, I had some things pointed out to me very early in my career, and I am glad I did. Both of these concepts were foremost in my approach to business.

1. The #1 responsibility of management is to develop subordinates.
2.Nobody in the mfg plant or field works for management. Management exists to support the field.

My favorite quote is from one of the founders of Chemlawn
" Our first responsibility is to our customers. Our second responsibility equally is to our employees. Our third responsibility is to profit. However if we take care of 1 and 2, profits are automatic."

When the high dollar CEO's and MBA's finally get this, we can profitably move our industry from China and Vietnam back home where it belongs
 
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I have recently bought a 686 international with a straight up non canted barrel that was NOT CENTRED in the frame . That made me sick to look at ,so I sold it .
This was a lesson for me to wear my glasses when purchasing firearms or vehicles ... or pretty much anything I guess
I have a Ruger new vaquero with a slightly canted barrel ,can’t see it until you concentrate on a target ,but it’s there . Used to bug me .I’m over it now after 20000 rounds or so it’s proven itself
 
Narragansett said:
Yeah well employers have seen to it that employees are put on the commodity list like raw materials.

Actually I just read the other day that there is a growing tend to put employees ahead of shareholders. I am sure that is a long term uphill battle.

I was a contractor, and I has some things pointed out to me very early in my career, and I am glad I did. Both of these concepts were foremost in my approach to business.

1. The #1 responsibility of management is to develop subordinates.
2.Nobody in the mfg plant or field works for management. Management exists to support the field.

My favorite quote is from one of the founders of Chemlawn
" Our first responsibility is to our customers. Our second responsibility equally is to our employees. Our third responsibility is to profit. However if we take care of 1 and 2, profits are automatic."

When the high dollar CEO's and MBA's finally get this, we can profitably move our industry from China and Vietnam back home where it belongs
Click to expand...

I will go another step. When I do business with a company and the employees I deal with seem genuinely happy, I almost always have a good experience as a customer. Good product or services. When I deal with disgruntled acting employees I am most likely not going to be happy with the product or service. The mental condition of the employees is usually a very strong indicator of the business including their product, their support and ability to do the job.
 
Having done barrel work on a fair number of S&Ws, I have a degree of sympathy for the guys in assembly. They've got 2 newly machined and finished surfaces that have to be turned to a specific point within a given torque spec range.

It's not uncommon to get the barrel oh-so-close to vertical alignment, give it a smidgen more effort and have the barrel move past vertical. Or, in some cases, have the barrel stop short and risk over torqueing the barrel/over stress the frame. (Those J frames with threaded boss cracks in the frame window.)

What can help when fitting a new barrel/frame is burnishing the contact surfaces by tightening-not to final position-and loosening the barrel several times before trying to get final alignment. The effect of burnishing can really be seen when doing custom barrel installations. A touch of moly chassis grease on the surfaces doesn't hurt either.

What I'd do if I had to set a properly aligned barrel back was break the barrel loose, maybe tighten/loosen a couple times, then see where it lined up when firmly hand tight. Duplicating that would pretty much always get the barrel aligned right at full torque. At one time, I had a chart that gave me rough hand tight positions on the K & N frames.
 
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Part of the problem is the + and - tolerances that are part of anything that is manufactured. The barrel won't always be vertical at a given torque because the shoulder where the barrel meets the frame will vary slightly in length on every barrel. The exact length of the frame will vary by small amounts. The combination of which barrel is on which frame creates a multitude of variations. Lining it up by Mark I eyeball creates variations. Making thousands of anything creates variations. Many people assume that all the parts are exactly alike. They are not.

There is an acceptable torque range, but it has to be aligned by geometry, not torque, to be exactly vertical.
 
How do they fix a canted barrel on a nickel gun? If it’s under canted they need to tighten it more if it doesn’t need more fitting on the frame. If it’s over canted we’re done because they don’t do nickel plating anymore that sounds like a refund towards a blued gun.
 
Pinned barrels don't have a darn thing to do with barrel installation. You can turn a barrel a startling amount before the pin affects anything. The barrels were always installed to a torque value (either by ft/lbs or by specified rotation after hand tight.) I've always had a sneaking suspicion that the pin was a sales gimmick as Colt had issues with barrels shooting loose.
 
WR Moore said:
Pinned barrels don't have a darn thing to do with barrel installation. You can turn a barrel a startling amount before the pin affects anything. The barrels were always installed to a torque value (either by ft/lbs or by specified rotation after hand tight.) I've always had a sneaking suspicion that the pin was a sales gimmick as Colt had issues with barrels shooting loose.
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Post WWII revolvers at any rate. The barrels had a "pin groove" cut before installation. I've seen plenty that still had intact bluing, meaning the pin never touched the groove!

And I have seen canted front sights on pinned revolvers. Not to mention plenty where the barrel rib is offset from the frame sight cut.

There is a thread feature one the new barrels I really don't like, but unless you are someone who pulls apart their (and others) revolvers to this degree you'll never see it. But it is important to the discussion: the thread relief cut at the the thread terminus. The old revolvers don't have one.
 
lihpster said:
Joe, got the gun. Looks perfect. Hope yours is the same.
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lihpster, I received my 617 today!
6-17-21 HA! 😁
The barrel is properly clocked, the barrel/frame finishes match!
I am overall happy with it but the sights are a little blue worn on the edges and a couple minor scuffs.
I bought it on GunBroker: New in Box, but the manufacture date is
Oct. 27th 2015! So I guess it's been waiting for me for awhile!
Very nice trigger, I like it!👍
 
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Jalopiejoe said:
lihpster, I received my 617 today!
6-17-21 HA! 😁
The barrel is properly clocked, the barrel/frame finishes match!
I am overall happy with it but the sights are a little blue worn on the edges and a couple minor scuffs.
I bought it on GunBroker: New in Box, but the manufacture date is
Oct. 27th 2015! So I guess it's been waiting for me for awhile!
Very nice trigger, I like it!👍
Click to expand...

I love it when a plan comes together! Smoke 'em if you got 'em, cowboy. It's time to celebrate!!
 
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