Measured response so far.....we will see.
Iran attacking Israel
- Thread starter DWalt
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Turned into target practice for the combined air forces of Israel and its allies. I wonder how many million dollar missiles were used on the Iranian drones.
LVSteve
Member
I have a begrudging admiration for the Iranians and their low cost cruise drones. They have mastered a form of asymmetric warfare that I've wondered about for decades. I find it amazing that this sort of thing wasn't tried many years ago.
I am reminded of a study regarding air defense of ships back in the days before the Aegis system allegedly made by the Rand corporation. The initial study showed that a ship with a single-ended missile system was killed every time by a four ship attack by F-4 equivalent attackers. Having a two-channel missile system kept the ship safe. Some wag then decided to program the attackers to be A-1 Skyraiders, and their numbers to be set by the cost of the four F-4s. As you might guess, that gives you a lot of A-1s. They put that data into the model and the ship died every time...along with lots of Spad pilots, but the exchange rate in financial terms was still good.
Puller
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I'm guessing Iranians don't have much experience with kicking a yellow jacket nest.
Attachments
What they’ve mastered is a form of warfare that doesn’t work against any organized military. I think 7 out of over 300 landed on Israeli soil. What’s there to admire ? They are cowards playing a cowards game.
smoothshooter
Member
Worries about WWIII are premature at this point.
I will admit that our enemies undoubtedly recognize the window of opportunity that is now wide open slowly closing the closer we get to the November elections. Either the Israelis or the US need to whack the Iranian oil fields. That will get their attention.
Very dangerous times ahead.
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SnidelyWhiplash
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Apparently the US gave Iran the green light as long as their attack was "within certain limits". Iran informed Turkey in advance of its operation against Israel - The Jerusalem Post
To paraphrase Winston Churchill: “Now this is not the beginning. It is not even the end of the beginning. But it is, perhaps, the beginning of the end.”
YeshuaIsa53
Member
I see this as a pre-planned power play for the media. Israel will continue its methods, and Iran will continue its shadow war to try and spread what probably 40% Persians have turned their backs on. This will be for a time the way it is.
And what are Israeli methods? What they decide to do.
The biggest change in the situation seems, to me, to be Iran has attacked Israel for the world to see: directly. It is proof of Iran's global spread of their new type of Shia.
It seems like Iran has now warned the USA about attacking our bases should we decide to help Israel on Iranian soil. Our response was we will support Israel.
And what are Israeli methods? What they decide to do.
The biggest change in the situation seems, to me, to be Iran has attacked Israel for the world to see: directly. It is proof of Iran's global spread of their new type of Shia.
It seems like Iran has now warned the USA about attacking our bases should we decide to help Israel on Iranian soil. Our response was we will support Israel.
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OP
DWalt
Member
The first drones (small unmanned remotely controlled aircraft) were developed and tested by both the British and American militaries during WWI but were not used operationally. So at least the idea of using drones for warfare goes back for over 100 years.
I have worked with a few Iranians who were able to flee the country before the unpleasantness of the late 1970s. They struck me as very intelligent and logical people, not Islamic zealots, nothing like how many of us view Iranians today.
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Puller
Member
More of a perversion of his quote than a paraphrase.
Actual quote on November 10, 1942, Winston Churchill said this: “Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.”
Interesting…..
Iran’s attack seemed planned to minimize casualties while maximizing spectacle | CNN
“The strike served as a retaliation against the Israeli airstrikes on Iran’s consulate in Damascus earlier in April that killed a top commander, and it was in keeping with US intelligence and analysts’ expectations. Iran’s leadership felt compelled to strike Israel in order to reiterate its position as a regional powerhouse and to dispel notions of it as a paper tiger. It doubled down on its show of force by launching the operation from its own territory and not by proxy in Syria, Lebanon, Yemen or Iraq.
Yet Iran also needed to try to avoid sparking an all-out war. Its economy has buckled under the weight of Trump-era sanctions, and there is growing discontent on its streets over the government’s repressive policies. On Sunday, Iran appeared not only to have factored in Israel’s robust air defense systems, but to have relied on it. The relatively high degree of US intelligence about the operation also suggests Iran may have engaged in back-channelling with Western leaders. Iranian Foreign Minister Hossein Amir Abdollahian said he gave neighboring countries, including major US allies, 72-hour notice. To contain the fall-out of their own operation, they appeared intent to foil it.
The style of attack is reminiscent of Tehran’s response to former President Donald Trump’s targeted killing of Iran’s most storied general, Qassem Soleimani, in January 2020. Tehran gave US troops 10 hours of advance warning before raining down massive ballistic missiles on US military positions in Iraq, including al-Asad airbase. The attack wreaked havoc, leaving gaping craters in the ground, but caused no known US casualties. In the process, Iranian forces accidentally shot down a commercial jet taking off from Tehran airport, killing over 100 passengers and fuelling public anger against a regime increasingly seen as incompetent”
LVSteve
Member
There are some caveats to their failure.
#1 Israel had help, and quite right, too.
#2 Israeli is a tiny place, only 92% the size of New Jersey, and almost exactly the same size as Clark County, Nevada, that contains Las Vegas. I suspect it has the highest density of surface-to-air assets anywhere in the world, probably more than the so-called "Moscow Ring".
#3 Defending a small space is much easier than defending a large space from air assault. Ask Ukraine, or the guy that was in charge of the Soviet PVO when Mathias Rust flew to Moscow.
That only seven out of an estimated 350 made it to Israeli territory is an extraordinary achievement, representing a 98% success rate. I guess the MIC of several countries is now about to make out rather well replacing the expendables used in this triumph. Well, I know how much store many of you here put on jobs, so you must be doubly happy.
Perverse times we live in, my man.
LVSteve
Member
Ain't that a fact.
bushmaster1313
Member
Israel is asked to exercise restraint after 60 tons of munitions are aimed and sent towards its territory.
Just imagine how much restraint the United States would exercise if Mexico or China aimed toxic chemicals at the United States that actually killed over 100,000 Americans last year.
Just imagine how much restraint the United States would exercise if Mexico or China aimed toxic chemicals at the United States that actually killed over 100,000 Americans last year.
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Drugs. Nothing happened. Nuff said.
Notions that Iran is near collapse from within are truly dangerous wishful thinking.
"Me against my brother; my brother and I against my cousins; me, my brother, and my cousins against the outsider."
"Me against my brother; my brother and I against my cousins; me, my brother, and my cousins against the outsider."
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More saber rattling similar to Kim Jung Un. They are doing everything in their power to bait the US into conflict that stirs unrest and destabilizes the social order of the US while their propaganda mills preach about how they are standing up to the evil westerners.
People will wake up when the cells within the US are activated. I will be interested to see how they feel about things then.
I hope it doesn't happen, but sincerely believe it is not if but when and how bold.
People will wake up when the cells within the US are activated. I will be interested to see how they feel about things then.
I hope it doesn't happen, but sincerely believe it is not if but when and how bold.
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Seems like this would be a perfect opportunity for Israel to take out all known nuclear sites in Iran.
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