The unavoidable gun fight. Are you confident with your handgun choice?

[URIT]

Yes, I'm confident with my handgun CC choices - S&W models 3953 & 4053.

 

[Smoke]

People eaten up with concealed carry live and breathe these "what if" imaginary situations. That's unrealistic extremism, far beyond reasonable preparedness.

Apparently the situation in the opening post really happened so it's not imaginary.

In your opinion, what constitutes reasonable preparedness?

 

[ken158]

I don’t carry for a gun battle. Just to get out of where I shouldn’t be. I call the guys that train and are equipped to do it. They have friends who will join them.

What do you carry for? Calling the cops will not be an option if you are staring at a bad guy with a gun but if you manage to accomplish that, then they will get there in maybe 5 - 10 minutes... The cops have arrived and are outside and now you are a hostage… Now what?

 

[biku324]

Isn't that kind of the bottom line?

FWIW I don't buy guns from pawn shops specifically because I know the quality of guns I've sold to pawn shops.

I don't do business with pawn shops simply because of the amount of time I've spent recovering stolen property from them. The best pawn shops are very careful about the items they allow and require the seller to provide real identification. That is assuredly not true for all - any burglary investigator can name the slimy ones in their areas pretty quickly.

A burglar/fence I interviewed told me 'his' pawn shop told him not to bring stuff likely to have recorded serial numbers or having unusual value, as those items could be identified unmistakably and he would lose money.

 

[Shibadog]

The best fight is the one you can avoid. If you’re trapped w/o an exit, seek the best cover you can find and prepare to defend yourself. If you’re not confident in what you carry, either practice more or change pistols.

 

[Bald1]

I was thinking about this yesterday. When something like this happens I wonder how long it takes people to process what is happening. And secondly, to react? I would imagine there would be hesitation from some. Afraid what is happening isn’t what they think. Afraid to shoot because you can’t take that bullet back. Some might think “ am I really seeing this”.

 

[rockquarry]

Apparently the situation in the opening post really happened so it's not imaginary.

In your opinion, what constitutes reasonable preparedness?

Yes, that happened. But all following that incident have not.

I don't know how you can further break down "reasonable preparedness" in terms that are simpler. Having one handgun that you are very familiar with is a start which includes being able to shoot well at varying distances. Ammo matters little if you become proficient; just shoot the ammo that works best for you and that's not necessarily what the YouDupers recommend. Far less emphasis on gunfighting, second guns, lots of ammo, multiple armed bad guys, shooting through walls, cars, bullet proof vests, etc. and other preposterous and incredibly unlikely imagined schemes.

A law enforcement or military role is not what civilian concealed carry is about, but it's almost impossible for some to limit their imaginations to such a parameter. I guess it's boring to do so, hence the extremist and unrealistic attitude toward civilian concealed carry.

 

[375hh1973]

Yes I am confident.

I practice regularly.

Have been in stress situations .

If I am gonna get shot regardless, I am not going out tryna hide. Gonna take someone with me

 

[Smoke]

Yes, that happened. But all following that incident have not.

I don't know how you can further break down "reasonable preparedness" in terms that are simpler. Having one handgun that you are very familiar with is a start which includes being able to shoot well at varying distances. Ammo matters little if you become proficient; just shoot the ammo that works best for you and that's not necessarily what the YouDupers recommend. Far less emphasis on gunfighting, second guns, lots of ammo, multiple armed bad guys, shooting through walls, cars, bullet proof vests, etc. and other preposterous and incredibly unlikely imagined schemes.

A law enforcement or military role is not what civilian concealed carry is about, but it's almost impossible for some to limit their imaginations to such a parameter. I guess it's boring to do so, hence the extremist and unrealistic attitude toward civilian concealed carry.

I most frequently carry a glock 19 and two reloads. I chose that because it's the same gun I carried at work.

I carry it because that's what I already have set up. I carry it with no expectation that I'm ever going to need the second and certainly not the third magazine.

As I said that's what I carry because that's what I had set up.


At the end of next month when I live here I fully intend to carry the exact same thing

Is that reasonable?

If it's not reasonable in your opinion what is?


What can I carry that would meet your approval?

 

[pharmer]

My "close to the house" FFL is a pawnshop; I get all my Palmetto State stuff through them as "preferred FFL." The layout is "L shaped", nothing over say 50 ft max. I'd like to think that after the perp has killed 2 victims prior that I can unholster and make lethal hits before becoming corpse #3. What do I know, I'm an old man. Joe

 

[smithman 10]

You know I was just thinking about dropping by my local pawnshop, where the owner and I usually talk about investment opportunities and trade stock tips, etc.

When I do drop in I am always armed with a .38 J-frame and a folding knife but then that is always the case everywhere I go except where prohibited by law.

Of course I could strap on my hi-cap 9mm semi-auto for the trip but the darn thing is too heavy and a heckuva lot harder to conceal. And I've put way more rounds through J-frames than all the semi-autos I've ever owned.

To be honest, I have not given a lot of thought to whatever danger I put myself in when visiting the local pawn shop. Or gun shop. It's just something I've been doing for the last 40 years or so.

Without incident I might add. So far.

For me this post is a very useful reminder to not let my situational awareness lapse, wherever I may find myself.

Thank you Dump 1567.

 

[Greyman50]

I deal with 3 or 4 pawn shops. 1 is close and have known the owner for 20 years. He and his co owner are armed and little chance of 1 person taking them out due to layout. The other shops are up the road and have 3-4 armed guys running them so seriously doubt there would be any trouble. Other shops I usually drive by as they are in really bad parts of town(s).

 

[GregVS]

This is an incident that happened in a Pawn Shop I was in a few weeks ago. It just as likely could have happened at any store you entered. There's only one way out. Take out the shooter or die. Are you confident and proficient with your carry choice to get out alive?

To give a summary based on the article, it sounds like the shooter entered the pawn shop & fired a round into the air. The armed clerk working the counter grabbed his gun to engage the shooter and was killed. Some shopper who was in the store hiding after the shooting started was shot in the head as the shooter left with some stolen guns. The shooter and getaway driver were later arrested and charged with murder.

New details about moments before, after deadly shooting at Tucson pawn shop

As I mentioned, I was in this Pawn shop a few weeks ago looking at guns. It isn't in the nicest area, but most Pawn shops aren't. And Pawn shops in my area, do have some good deals on used handguns. But this could have happened in any business. When you come through the door of this place, to the left is the gun counter. So, this is going to put you in the corner of the store and your back to the door. You probably wouldn't know what was happening until you heard a shot and turned around. I don't know if anyone else was in this shop during the shooting, but it doesn't sound like it. Every time I've been there, they've had at least two people working. Maybe someone went to lunch?

This is one of those situations where you can't avoid a gun fight. Do nothing, and you're still shot in the head. Sure, stay out of bad neighborhoods and pawn shops. But as I stated, this could have happened in any store. The chances of this situation are slim, but I missed it by a few weeks, so you never know. And this is why we carry.

And now it comes down to your carry choice. I know a lot of people like their small low cap pocket carry guns. But if you were in this situation, do you feel confident and proficient with your choice of carry gun? Situations like this really make you think and evaluate your carry choice, training, mindset, & tactics.

See my posting in: re: Anyone Using a Glock with a Manual Safety? about a friend getting shot and his mother killed in a Phoenix gunfight just last week. Dwayne is proficient in firearms and I was really surprised he woke up and investigated w/o arming himself.

BTW: I'm VERY confidant with my EDC (Sig P-365) and nightstand guns (SA XDM 45 acp), as well as my wife's Glock G-43 and Sig P-365.

 

[rockquarry]

I most frequently carry a glock 19 and two reloads. I chose that because it's the same gun I carried at work.

I carry it because that's what I already have set up. I carry it with no expectation that I'm ever going to need the second and certainly not the third magazine.

As I said that's what I carry because that's what I had set up.

View attachment 770694
At the end of next month when I live here I fully intend to carry the exact same thing

Is that reasonable?

If it's not reasonable in your opinion what is?
View attachment 770696

What can I carry that would meet your approval?

View attachment 770697

Relax. No argument from me; sounds as if you know what you're doing. I did my best to explain reasonable preparedness but I think we all know what it is.

 

[Smoke]

Relax. No argument from me; sounds as if you know what you're doing. I did my best to explain reasonable preparedness but I think we all know what it is.

This is my opinion and I'm not trying to extend the (for lack of a better term) argument.

Reasonable is an incredibly subjective word.

There are people on this forum who carry a J frame with six rounds and maybe a speed strip that think a Glock 19 and two reloads is unreasonably excessive.

I doubt very seriously that you pay a whole lot of attention to what I post but I frequently talk about how I don't top off my magazines when I load my pistol. I put 15 rounds in my glock magazine load the magazine into the gun chamber a round and go about my business.

I don't think the effort of dropping the magazine and putting another round in it and putting it back in the gun is worthwhile.

I've had people on this and other forums tell me that I'm going to be KILT in the streets for lack of that one bullet.

They think I'm unreasonable for not taking the extra 10 seconds.

There are people in my life who think the very fact that I carry a firearm at all is unreasonable and it makes me insane

So no, I can't say that "We all know what reasonable means".

 

[SFury79]

I don’t carry for a gun battle. Just to get out of where I shouldn’t be. I call the guys that train and are equipped to do it. They have friends who will join them.

Sometimes the fight finds us. Either you can try and fight to live, or get killed like the customer did. If I end up in a similar situation I hope I can fight and live.

My $.02, no one else’s money or stuff is worth me getting in a gun fight, to include an ambulance or narcs or anything else. Shoes I can run in and the ability to say “we’re cool bro” go a lot farther than anything else.

How did that flawed thinking work out for the customer? Oh, he's dead... Which would have been your fate.

 

[Brush2000]

I think this conversation has gotten a little out of hand. At the end of the day I think we would all fight for our lives some of us may view other options before hand some may jump to the rescue without a second thought the focus needs to remain training is what's important not the tool at hand

 

[fiasconva]

In the situation described I am confident in my choice IF I get the chance to use it.

 

[Model29-26.5]

Everyone only imagines what they would actually do unless they have been there.
I have not and hope I never do.
Hope the perpetrator gets life or death.
It’ll be interesting to see his prior record and judgements on previous offences which I’m assuming there are many.

 

[rockquarry]

This is my opinion and I'm not trying to start her extend the (for lack of a better term) argument.

Reasonable is an incredibly subjective word.

There are people on this forum who carry a J frame with six rounds and maybe a speed strip that think a Glock 19 and two reloads is unreasonably excessive.

I doubt very seriously that you pay a whole lot of attention to what I post but I frequently talk about how I don't top off my magazines when I load my pistol. I put 15 rounds in my glock magazine load the magazine into the gun chamber around and go about my business.

I don't think the effort of dropping the magazine and putting another round in it and putting it back in the gun is worthwhile.

I've had people on this and other forums tell me that I'm going to be KILT in the
streets for lack of that one bullet.

They think I'm unreasonable for not taking the extra 10 seconds.

Her people in my life who thinks it's a very fact that I carry a firearm at all is unreasonable and it makes me insane

So no, I can't say that "We all know what reasonable means".

I've done my best, but this is not my whole life. You win through attrition.