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Cratered primers/reloading for pistols

Miracle Man

Miracle Man

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Ok reloaders and/or pistol smiths. Have a couple questions for you?

So a buddy of mine recently gave me 2 or 300 mostly 9mm range pickup brass, have to sort out the 380, He doesn't reload. Just got done decapping them and they're in the wet tumbler.

While I was decapping them I noticed this one brand of brass was giving me a good bit more resistance than all the rest. Headstamp is S&B 9x19 20. I'm assuming Sellier & Bellot made in 2020?

Anyways, after 2 or 3 like that I got to looking closer and the primers on every one of them are the same. They're cratered very badly. The basically entire primer is hooved up like a volcano and the firing pin strike is almost flattened all the way out. The empty cases will not sit flush on a table.

So are cratered primers/badly deformed fired primers a sign of high pressure like they are in rifle cases? Could they just have been fired in a gun with suspect head space? Is S&B ammo junk?

I'm mainly asking because I noticed a couple of my 357 mag relaods with Blue dot powder few days ago had some cratered primers.

Thanks
 
Without pics anything is just a guess. Even with pics you'll get a variety of answers.

Assuming the primer isn't crimped in place (which it might be with S&B brass), every time around fires the first thing that happens when the primer ignites is that the primer backs out of the case. Once the gun powder ignites and pressure builds the case will be slammed rearward with the same pressure driving the bullet down the barrel and this should reseat the primer in the case. Depending on condition of the gun parts such as firing pin bushing, firing pin hole, type of hammer or striker used or other reasons like the firing pin has been damaged can cause issues like you are seeing Additionally too little pressure can cause the primers to not reseat correctly.
 
The S&B I have picked up as range trash is sealed with a red substance, or crimped like military brass. Who knows when it was made. Recommend you sort it out, deprime, and clean/ ream the primer pockets. Then you should be able to resize, reprime, and load normally.
If I miss this, I usually have trouble seating the new primers.
 
Wouldn't hurt to test them with a magnet.
vkRaHWN.jpg


As others have stated, I toss any s&b 9mm brass I find.
 
Gun manufacturers just want to sell cheap products that go "Bang!"

A lot of currently manufactured 9mm pistols, ie: polymer carry-type guns, are very poorly made from a reloaders perspective.
Chambers are oversized, headspace is excessive, etc. all in an effort to make the gun go "Bang!" with whatever ammo is used, from expensive defensive ammo to surplus steel case foreign-made junk.
The problem you describe is often related to an oversized firing pin hole in the breech face of the slide. When the gun discharges, there is a ring of empty space around the firing pin and breech face. In a revolver this would be a big problem as the primer would flow back into that ring and bind the cylinder. In a semiauto that issue doesn't exist. But there's still a risk of a pierced primer.
My guess is, manufacturers do this to supposedly assist reliability in case of dirt build-up? Or, maybe they want to reduce the chance of chain firing should a broken or seized firing pin tip get jammed in the fully forward position in the breech?

Personally, I frown upon built-in slop as a lousy way of enhancing reliability over stricter tolerances and quality control. But that's what you get when obliging manufacturers cater to a consumer base that demands nothing more than a cheap price and only the most rudimentary of utilitarian function. Also, the vast majority of new gun owners are woefully uninformed about analyzing malfunctions. They just get upset and frustrated. I'm sure a lot of manufacturers and dealers just want to sell cheap guns that go "Bang!" so they don't have to listen to complaints from customers that don't know any better.

As for your brass, so long as a new primer fully seats without undue looseness or tightness, you're fine to use it.
But, with primer scarcity pushing people to buy off-brand primers (at black market prices!) made in third world countries, you might still have problems even if the brass itself is OK.
 
I'll just sort out the S&B brass and toss it. I'll post a pic. Not sure if I can get a very good one with my phone though?
 
Any excess pressure loads I have had experience with, the primer would come out quite easily.
 
My Beretta 92FS always shows primers looking like they are cratered. No problem reloading the brass.
 
That looks pretty common. Another cause can be a soft firing pin return spring. But, it's possible the alloy swaged to make the primer cup us a little soft.
In a bolt action rifle, I'd be concerned about gas blowback in the case of a primer leak. In a pistol, not so much. In any case, that doesn't affect you if you just want to use the brass.
I don't think you need to toss the brass. S&B brass is pretty good in a lot of ways. They swage the interior of the flash hole which theoretically gives more uniform ignition. Also, their case walls tend to be pretty uniform. They don't thicken as abruptly as some other brands, so they work well with heavy bullets.
 
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Another vote to not tossing the brass. Process it like you normally do and then see how new primers seat. If they are tight, swage them then load.
 
9mm Luger bulging primers.

Chuck them if worse then these.
 

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STORMINORMAN said:
I can't even make out what brand of paper towel that is...!:eek:

Bounty vs. Brawny? Winchester vs. cci?

Cheers!
Click to expand...

Hahaha :) The wife won't use anything but bounty so I'd bet my last primer that's what it is.

I grew up so to speak in reloading as a rifleman. And from reading every page of reloading info I could lay man hands on they all stated examine the primers on all fired rounds when working up a load.

But I've never paid more than very casual attention to fired pistol primers. My recent experience with Blue Dot powder and cratered primers just got me looking a lot closer.

If I fired those rounds with that deformed a primer I'd blow a gasket !! And it just got me thinking more about pressure signs in pistol reloads.

I've learned a lot on here, thanks everybody.
 
Could be high pressure, could be low pressure, could be soft primers, could be an out of spec firing pin/bolt face, weak recoil spring, could just be from a blow-back operated pistol.

I have reloaded a bunch of S&B's without difficulty. I deprime before tumbling. Any stiff primers go into a separate bucket and get their primer pockets reamed.
 
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A little late to be party, but I just took a quick look though my 1x fired 9mm brass. This is picked up from my local range. It's easy to see the brass is fired through different pistols. I can find examples in all the different brands of brass that look similar to the pics that Miracle Man posted. I've loaded hundreds of range pick up S&B brass with zero problems.
 
Paul in Nevada said:
Could be high pressure, could be low pressure, could be soft primers, could be an out of spec firing pin/bolt face, could just be from a blow-back operated pistol.

I have reloaded a bunch of S&B's without difficulty. I deprime before tumbling. Any stiff primers go into a separate bucket and get their primer pockets reamed.
Click to expand...

Me too

And off topic a bit but I just started using a wet rotary tumbler with the SS pins and detergent. WOW

I couldn't believe the difference from the old dry media vibratory tumbler. And the pins and drying isn't that big a deal.
 
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