My 10mm Saga

CP38 · May 6, 2022

My new MP 2 10mm is currently in transit back to the factory to hopefully resolve a chronic failure to feed issue with fully loaded factory ammunition. The note and photos below have been provided to Smith and Wesson in this regard:

Gentlemen;

With a variety of factory ammunition that is rated to produce standard 10mm 1200ft/sec plus velocities with 180-200 gr. bullets, I am experiencing repeated failure to feed issues (see photos). These failure to feed issues generally occurs with 4 or fewer rounds remaining in the magazine and regardless of bullet type. Ammunition that is rated below 1200 ft/sec, lightly loaded range ammo with low recoil, functions through this firearm with far fewer failure to feed events.

Your attention to resolving this firearm’s unreliability issues is appreciated.

Through some recent internet research, I have discovered that more than a few other people are experiencing this same issue with higher pressure 10mm loads and their MP 2s. I certainly hope that there is not an underlying engineering issue with these pistols.

Alk8944 · May 11, 2022

Well,

Since the pistol is already on the way to S&W it's a bit late, but that is a magazine issue, not the gun or ammunition. Do you have more than one magazine, and did you try both/all of them? Your second photo appears to be a double feed, from your attempt to clear the problem incorrectly.

CP38 · May 11, 2022

I experienced the same issues with both magazines. The photos depict the immediate failure to feed events prior to any effort to clear or manipulate the firearm. Make what you will of it, but that is how it is sugaring-out.

jhgnag · May 21, 2022

Same problem, both my 4" and my buddies 4.6".

They both went back and we just got back. They polished the feed ramp. Haven't had a chance to try them yet.

PowerDemon · May 21, 2022

I’m having the same FTF issue with my 4.6” model. Mine runs the range ammo fine, but once you step up to the higher powered 10mm loads (Underwood and AA9 reloads) it has the failure to feed issues. Specifically on the last few rounds like you mentioned.

It’s such a shame too because I really enjoy the pistol. But I don’t want to have to doctor on my gun to get it to run right. Hopefully smith and Wesson offers a fix soon.

1sprinklerman · May 23, 2022

Get in line. Still trying to get my 380 EZ from 2018 fixed for the same issue, plus the manual safety on mine won't stay in the off position. Seems like S&W can not put out a new model and get it right.

colt_saa · May 23, 2022

So far my M&P 10MM Auto pistol is just fine, however I only have around 800 rounds of assorted factory and hand loads through it.

I do not shoot ammunition from the small boutique manufacturers. Only my hand loads or stuff from the major players

This includes the Federal P10T1 which is a 180 grain JHP at 1275 along with the SIG 180 V-crown that moves at 1250. I have run lots of the Federal XM1003A which is what the Federal Government buys for the aging MP5/10 inventory but I have not shot it through the M&P 10MM Auto. The Hornady Custom ammunition is also nicely loaded

My favorite 10MM Auto hand load is a 200 grain XTP over 11.7 grains of AA#7 for 1175

CP38,
Did you offer to send Smith & Wesson some of the actual ammunition that is giving you problems?

Remember they are going to test fire with whatever ammunition they have on hand. They may not duplicate your issue

CP38 · May 23, 2022

Yes, on the FTF photos forwarded to Smith, I provided the ammunition detail for their review. I also test fired all of the same ammunition lots through my old Gen. 2 Glock model 20 and experienced no issues whatsoever. The following is a list of ammunition with which my MP 2 routinely failed to function:

Fiocchi 180 gr. FMJ rated @1250 FPS
Underwood 200 gr. Hard Cast rated @1250 FPS
Hornady 10mm Auto 180 Grain XTP rated @1275 FPS

I believe that Smith has a design failure with the MP 2 in 10mm and a remedy will only come with a focused reengineering effort.

As an aside, Underwood and Buffalo Bore ammunition is very commonly used in woods-carry handguns in the northern Rockies.

Sevens · May 23, 2022

This is getting to be a known issue and in my opinion and I'm sure S&W won't agree, they should be also be writing checks to folks for the money they have thrown toward ammunition in attempts to get a brand new pistol to function properly.

Disgust. That's the word.

mark_lives_things · May 24, 2022

Thanks for sharing your disappointing experience.

Here's my own: Problem with M&P 10mm + Customer Service Nightmare

Tannhauser · May 24, 2022

CP38 said:
My new MP 2 10mm is currently in transit back to the factory to hopefully resolve a chronic failure to feed issue with fully loaded factory ammunition. The note and photos below have been provided to Smith and Wesson in this regard:

Gentlemen;

With a variety of factory ammunition that is rated to produce standard 10mm 1200ft/sec plus velocities with 180-200 gr. bullets, I am experiencing repeated failure to feed issues (see photos). These failure to feed issues generally occurs with 4 or fewer rounds remaining in the magazine and regardless of bullet type. Ammunition that is rated below 1200 ft/sec, lightly loaded range ammo with low recoil, functions through this firearm with far fewer failure to feed events.

Your attention to resolving this firearm’s unreliability issues is appreciated.

Through some recent internet research, I have discovered that more than a few other people are experiencing this same issue with higher pressure 10mm loads and their MP 2s. I certainly hope that there is not an underlying engineering issue with these pistols.

Out of curiosity, are you using the factory recoil spring?

CP38 · May 24, 2022

My MP 2 10mm is entirely factory built, and I did not make any attempt to modify, replace or adjust any parts.

Euclid · May 24, 2022

I just sent my 4” M&P 10mm in for the exact same issue. Initially they sent me new mag springs and followers, but that didn’t fix it so they asked me to send the pistol to them.

I hope they fix it. I really like this pistol…

Euclid · May 24, 2022

Has anyone had this issue RESOLVED by S&W?

Tannhauser · May 24, 2022

CP38 said:
My MP 2 10mm is entirely factory built, and I did not make any attempt to modify, replace or adjust any parts.

I only ask because sone people have noted problems feeding resolved with a heavier recoil spring.

I decided to use a Wolff 22# recoil spring in my 4.6. I’m a couple hundred in with perfect function so far.

I haven’t tried the really heavy BB or Underwood hardcast yet. I suspect if a pistol is going to have an issue, it’s with these loads.

But I’m running full power 180 gr handloads without a problem.

PowerDemon · May 25, 2022

Tannhauser said:
I only ask because sone people have noted problems feeding relived with a heavier recoil spring.

I decided to use a Wolff 22# recoil spring in my 4.6. I’m a couple hundred in with perfect function so far.

I haven’t tried the really heavy BB or Underwood hardcast yet. I suspect if a pistol is going to have an issue, it’s with these loads.

But I’m running full power 180 gr handloads without a problem.

That spring is made for the 45ACP correct? Or did you use a different spring?

Tannhauser · May 25, 2022

PowerDemon said:
That spring is made for the 45ACP correct? Or did you use a different spring?

Correct, it is the Wolff M&P 45 guide rod and 22# extra power recoil spring.

I purchased the Wolff uncaptured guide rod and several different springs, all heavier than da Tory, when my gun was on the way to my FFL. I was planning from day one to try out different recoil springs.

The Wolff guide rod drops tight in, and since the springs are in sorted, it’s quick and easy to change recoil springs.

luvsmiths · May 25, 2022

Euclid said:
Has anyone had this issue RESOLVED by S&W?

So far, from everything I read here , or on Reddit, the answer is No.

Not even close.

Seems like a design flaw that cannot be fixed.

PS- just in case you thought off trying, don't do a thing yourself to try to fix, or they will make it YOUR problem.
There seems no fix at this point. Even by S&W.

Tannhauser · May 25, 2022

luvsmiths said:
So far, from everything I read here , or on Reddit, the answer is No.

Not even close.

Seems like a design flaw that cannot be fixed.

PS- just in case you thought off trying, don't do a thing yourself to try to fix, or they will make it YOUR problem.
There seems no fix at this point. Even by S&W.

I think it's very likely the design flaw is an underpowered recoil. spring. A stronger recoil spring seems to improve performance significantly with hotter ammo. I'm not saying it's the end all solution, because my personal sample size is 1. But among other M&P 10 owners on the internet, the common thread among all the users not reporting issues is using a recoil spring heavier than the factory shipped spring.

Their still could be issues, but I don't necessarily think it's a fundamental problem with the overall design, although it's possible the frame simply flexes too much for the very hottest 10mm loads.

I've swapped recoil springs and my 4.6" is happily chugging along with hot 180 gr loads without a problem. Maybe this changes when I jump up to hot 200 gr hardcast.

Biggfoot44 · May 25, 2022

Rule of thumb - Don't buy newly introduced firearm until it's been in production for at least 1 year .

My 10mm Saga

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