3rd Gen parts - I'm afraid we're on our own Gents

Joe F · May 26, 2014

I don't think it's so much about the warranty as it is about S&W treating 3rd gen customers differently than they treat their other customers. I think most everyone here is willing to pay for the parts. But the parts don't exist.

There are plenty of great stories out there about Smith taking good care of folks with older guns. It's not uncommon to hear that work was done under warranty even when the gun is on its second or third owner. This doesn't apply if you have a 3rd gen gun. So, in this instance, they are acting contrary to their reputation, not contrary to the warranty.

Some of these guns can still be found from dealers NIB. I wonder how warranty issues would be addressed on a "brand new" 3rd gen that was sold for the first time a month ago?

blujax01 · May 26, 2014

Has anyone attempted to send a 3rd Gen back to S&W and been turned away due to "we got no parts" or is this a "we aren't providing the public any more parts" scenario?

There's a big difference from a warranty standpoint.

GaryS · May 26, 2014

I seem to remember reading that someone sent a 3rd generation gun in that had a frame crack. The response from S&W was that they couldn't repair the gun, but would make him a great deal on a M&P. Of course my recollection could be faulty.

A couple of observations about S&W in general over the past 2-3 years.

I've gone to several factory tours over the last several years. The last one was in 2012 and shortly after that, they closed their Shooting Sports Center. Then they stopped doing tours "temporarily". Even though a member here and his son got a tour when they drove up from Texas, my understanding is that the group tours they used to do are over.

Then last year they took their parts lists off line.

No they appear to be discontinuing parts sales for 3rd generation guns and again I've read that there are parts that they won't sell to end users.

In semi autos S&W seems to be interested only in making and selling 1911 pattern and polymer frame guns. Maybe that's where the real money is and they can't compete against Glock in the public safety market and make 3rd generation guns as well.

Whatever is going on in the corporate offices seems to be alienating a good segment of their loyal customer base. I think it's a mistake, but what do I know?

In the meantime I'm going to shoot and enjoy my 3rd generation guns. When the time comes that I need to replace them, I'll look at options including those from other manufacturers.

Joe F said:
I don't think it's so much about the warranty as it is about S&W treating 3rd gen customers differently than they treat their other customers. I think most everyone here is willing to pay for the parts. But the parts don't exist.

There are plenty of great stories out there about Smith taking good care of folks with older guns. It's not uncommon to hear that work was done under warranty even when the gun is on its second or third owner. This doesn't apply if you have a 3rd gen gun. So, in this instance, they are acting contrary to their reputation, not contrary to the warranty.

Some of these guns can still be found from dealers NIB. I wonder how warranty issues would be addressed on a "brand new" 3rd gen that was sold for the first time a month ago?

dkelly27 · May 26, 2014

I will never buy an M&P. I would rather have a Glock or Sig.

GaryS · May 26, 2014

dkelly27 said:
I will never buy an M&P. I would rather have a Glock or Sig.

I had a Glock 23, but didn't care for it much. I also had a M&P 9c, which I liked a lot more. I just decided that I like the 3rd generation guns a lot more.

I'd look at a Sig P239 except that I've heard that Sig won't warranty guns not owned by the original buyer.

I looked at a Walther CCP and was impressed even though it has a polymer frame.

I'll worry about that when the time comes.

timn8er · May 26, 2014

I own a couple of M&P's & have nothing against them. They are my carry guns because I will not carry one of my highly valued 3rd Gens for reasons I've stated several times on this Forum. In the future I may consider Sig. Glocks are just plain ugly to me, & yes I know its only a "tool". I've never been able to regard a pistol as such;more power to those who can. And I just prefer metal guns. I will never forget the first 3rd Gen I saw. It was on this Forum & when I saw it, I was lost. Just love those 3rd Gens!

vigil617 · May 26, 2014

I too started out in the modern M&P series, first with an M&P 45 full size LEO turn-in, then with one of the newest Shields in .40. Frankly, I found not one thing wrong with either. I enjoyed shooting them, and found that for the money compared to other brands they were top notch.

I thought so much of them that I gave my son a 9C that I bought from a member here, as his first pistol. He can decide from there if he wants to continue in the polymer line, or follow his old man into the classics.

A like-new 4006 turned my head early on, and I got into the Third Gens and haven't looked back. For financial reasons, I have had to sell guns to buy guns, so I've progressed through several Third Gens on the way to where I am now.

I say all this just to reiterate that I want to be a loyal S&W customer, and that I think highly of the products. Other manufacturers have their good points too, but I like buying American and I like owning Smiths. I'll keep shooting -- and occasionally buying -- them as long as I can.

rbmcmjr · May 26, 2014

GaryS said:
I'd look at a Sig P239 except that I've heard that Sig won't warranty guns not owned by the original buyer.

That's hardly surprising. Isn't that the standard approach? Even watch manufacturers won't extend the warranty to a second owner.

With the passing of the 3rd Gen guns, I have been drawn more and more to SIG's P2XX series since it is just about the only non-polymer option out there, unless you want a 1911. I just wish they had more models without the rails.

GaryS · May 26, 2014

No, it's not surprising. Then again, I haven't heard a lot of stories about Sigs breaking. My only experience was with an issued 2340, which was a polymer framed gun. I wasn't impressed.

rbmcmjr said:
That's hardly surprising. Isn't that the standard approach? Even watch manufacturers won't extend the warranty to a second owner.

With the passing of the 3rd Gen guns, I have been drawn more and more to SIG's P2XX series since it is just about the only non-polymer option out there, unless you want a 1911. I just wish they had more models without the rails.

Badkarma 1 · May 26, 2014

vigil617 said:
I too started out in the modern M&P series, first with an M&P 45 full size LEO turn-in, then with one of the newest Shields in .40. Frankly, I found not one thing wrong with either. I enjoyed shooting them, and found that for the money compared to other brands they were top notch.

I thought so much of them that I gave my son a 9C that I bought from a member here, as his first pistol. He can decide from there if he wants to continue in the polymer line, or follow his old man into the classics.

A like-new 4006 turned my head early on, and I got into the Third Gens and haven't looked back. For financial reasons, I have had to sell guns to buy guns, so I've progressed through several Third Gens on the way to where I am now.

I say all this just to reiterate that I want to be a loyal S&W customer, and that I think highly of the products. Other manufacturers have their good points too, but I like buying American and I like owning Smiths. I'll keep shooting -- and occasionally buying -- them as long as I can.

Couldn't agree more! Despite what others may think, I've dipped my toes into the M&P water and found it to a decent fightin pistol, it does beat the Glock in the grip department, was a .40 from the get, and yeah it's had a few bugs. BUT the thing works!
Since S&W may or may not be supporting continued use of or purchase of the 3rd Gen that means its either M&P, SD, or Sigma or another brand.
But it doesn't mean we can't continue to enjoy what 3rd Gens are out there! Or intro the "kids" to what was once a great design.
Dale

grumpyk35 · May 26, 2014

A lot of these parts look like they can be made in a small (home)machine shop. barrels,slids and frames thoese would be the only things I see not doing.

blujax01 · May 27, 2014

Big Shrek said:
Chances are higher that those customers might go elsewhere,
if they think that S&W won't do any better for the M&P line in the future...

SIG & Glock have an edge there...
not to mention all the bad press from the M&P Shield recall.

What Shield recall? Did I miss something?

blujax01 · May 27, 2014

GaryS said:
...

I'd look at a Sig P239 except that I've heard that Sig won't warranty guns not owned by the original buyer.

....

Technically, I don't think the S&W warranty applies to other than the original owner either. They have been pretty good about it in the past but if pressed, they could begin asking for proof of purchase when customers make a claim.

Texas40 · May 27, 2014

blujax01 said:
What Shield recall? Did I miss something?

The drop safety issue. That was a simple field test to see IF your forearm passed. If it passed no worries. If it failed the test it was to be returned and SW repaired it.
The two I have both passed the field test.

WR Moore · May 28, 2014

A couple of items here.

Defect in materials and/or workmanship. This doesn't mean the company will replace parts indefinately. Like all mechanical things, gun parts do wear. That's normal and the manufacturer has no obligation to replace said wear item (extractors, springs etc).

The second point is that if there is a market, there will be a supplier. Numrich has repeatedly let contracts to duplicate discontinued wear parts for many firearms (like friction sleeves for Remington 11-48 shotguns). Down the road, I suspect that 3rd generation extractors and such will be amoung those parts.

GaryS · May 28, 2014

I think some people are conflating warranty with parts support. I have a 2006 Toyota Tundra that is well beyond it's warranty. When I drive it in, I expect to pay for parts and labor. However, I wouldn't be very happy if I drove it in and the dealer said, "Sorry, the factory doesn't make that part any longer." I'd be even less happy if I wanted to replace a part by myself and the dealer said, "Sorry, but that's a dealer only install part"., especially if it was something as simple as a piece of trim or a headlight housing.

I hope that someone will make replacement wear parts for the 3rd generation guns. They are well made and will be useable for a long time to come. It's not like they are a Lorchin or other throw away gun.

blujax01 · May 28, 2014

Texas40 said:
The drop safety issue. That was a simple field test to see IF your forearm passed. If it passed no worries. If it failed the test it was to be returned and SW repaired it.
The two I have both passed the field test.

Oh, the Safety Alert. I didn't think there had been any recall. Funny how folks confuse the two.

ladder13 · May 28, 2014

blujax01 said:
Has anyone attempted to send a 3rd Gen back to S&W and been turned away due to "we got no parts"...............................................

Probably no one but it makes for good reading.

cpeblue · May 28, 2014

ladder13 said:
Probably no one but it makes for good reading.

I was told at the NRA show in Indianapolis that these guns are no longer supported by S&W. Perhaps they didn't mean it ? I for one could care less if they work on the guns or not but I would like to be able to get new grips or recoil springs even magazine followers springs and bases or even complete magazines.

Miami_JBT · May 28, 2014

Hell, no wonder why I had such a problem hunting down a new set of grips for my 5926. I checked ever part dealer I could think of and nothing. I then called S&W directly and they had two in stock so I ordered them ASAP along with a set of Hogue S&W marked grips for my 4566TSW. I paid a little extra and it took three weeks for the parts to get here but I got them.

What a shame though. I love the 3rd Gen series of guns just as much as Beretta and GLOCK. My three favorite series of guns are S&W 3rd Gens, Beretta 92/96 Series, and GLOCK in every variation. I guess times change. My M&P .45 is an okay gun but I love my 4506-1 and 4566TSW so much more.

3rd Gen parts - I'm afraid we're on our own Gents

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