1917 served with the US Army in Russia

[rayb]

Purchased this some time back from a muzzleloader dealer.
A 1917, made in 1917, according to Arms Collectors web site. Serial number 58XX. What caught my eye was the inscription scratched on the holster, reporoduced below:

Corp. H. A. FENNER

Co. D 339 Infantry

John's Express to HELL

Russian

Dream

571OR

SEPT – 20 – 18

The above is as best I can reproduce it. Some additional markings can't be deciphered.

From previous sources I knew that the 339th Infantry was part of the US Army forces sent to Russian after WWI during the Russian Revolution period. The 339th Infantry Regiment was part of the 85th Division, primarily manned by soldiers from Wisconsin and Michigan. They trained at Camp Custer, Michigan before being sent overseas. They left Camp Custer, went to Camp Mills, Long Island, and then on the USS Plattsburg to Liverpool, England. They were at Camp Cowshot in England from 4 – 26 August 1918. While there they were issued "Russian" rifles. These may have been US manufactured Mosin-Nagent rifles, but that hasn't been verified. They left Newcastle, England, 26 August and arrived Archangel, Russia September 5. The 339th served in Russia until June 1919. There were several engagements between the US and "Red" forces. I haven't found Fenner's name in any of the reports read to date.

Corporal H A Fenner is listed as a member of the 339th Infantry in the histories put together at the Bentley Historical Library, University of Michigan. His home of record was listed as Norwalk, Conn. The original activation roster of Co D, prepared by Sergeant Gordon Smith, does not list Fenner. Since the unit was activated in Michigan, and Fenner was from Conneticut, it would appear that he joined Co D after activation at Camp Custer; either before deployment overseas or while in England. After they returned, veterans of the 339th formed a unit association. I found a mention of Corp. Fenner that said " Reported dead since 1956 reunion".

So I conclude that Corporal Fenner was part of the 339th, and did serve in Russia. I haven't been able to verify that this pistol and holster in fact were physically present in Russia with the United States Army, but I believe there is a good possibility. Research continues……..

rayb

 

[rayb]

Purchased this some time back from a muzzleloader dealer.
A 1917, made in 1917, according to Arms Collectors web site. Serial number 58XX. What caught my eye was the inscription scratched on the holster, reporoduced below:

Corp. H. A. FENNER

Co. D 339 Infantry

John's Express to HELL

Russian

Dream

571OR

SEPT – 20 – 18

The above is as best I can reproduce it. Some additional markings can't be deciphered.

From previous sources I knew that the 339th Infantry was part of the US Army forces sent to Russian after WWI during the Russian Revolution period. The 339th Infantry Regiment was part of the 85th Division, primarily manned by soldiers from Wisconsin and Michigan. They trained at Camp Custer, Michigan before being sent overseas. They left Camp Custer, went to Camp Mills, Long Island, and then on the USS Plattsburg to Liverpool, England. They were at Camp Cowshot in England from 4 – 26 August 1918. While there they were issued "Russian" rifles. These may have been US manufactured Mosin-Nagent rifles, but that hasn't been verified. They left Newcastle, England, 26 August and arrived Archangel, Russia September 5. The 339th served in Russia until June 1919. There were several engagements between the US and "Red" forces. I haven't found Fenner's name in any of the reports read to date.

Corporal H A Fenner is listed as a member of the 339th Infantry in the histories put together at the Bentley Historical Library, University of Michigan. His home of record was listed as Norwalk, Conn. The original activation roster of Co D, prepared by Sergeant Gordon Smith, does not list Fenner. Since the unit was activated in Michigan, and Fenner was from Conneticut, it would appear that he joined Co D after activation at Camp Custer; either before deployment overseas or while in England. After they returned, veterans of the 339th formed a unit association. I found a mention of Corp. Fenner that said " Reported dead since 1956 reunion".

So I conclude that Corporal Fenner was part of the 339th, and did serve in Russia. I haven't been able to verify that this pistol and holster in fact were physically present in Russia with the United States Army, but I believe there is a good possibility. Research continues……..

rayb

 

[digi-shots]

Very nice find!

I think you'll enjoy researching the Polar Bear Expedition during WWI.

Here's a link to some info on them:

http://www.ur.umich.edu/9899/Apr05_99/14.htm

A year or so ago, I researched a 1st Lt. that was stationed at Camp Custer during WWI. He was born in Eau Claire, Wisconsin and served in both WWI and WWII.

You may luck out and find some information about your "soldier" from WWI draft registerations.

 

[bummer]

A great find. I have a few books about the Allied Intervention and one of my favorites is Fighting the Bolsheviks (isbn 0891416315).Great read. Does anyone know if a book was wriiten about the Infantry regiment sent to Italy? and were they issued Carcano rifles

 

[Deacon KC]

Very nice find, hope you can find more info!

 

[DHENRY]

rayb,
Now THERE'S a real interesting gun and holster, and you've researched the provenance quite well, IMHO !
With gazillions of M 1917 Army Models out there, it's neat to see an early-hammer-grips, low serial # model in such remarkable shape.
Glad you've given that 'old soldier' a good home.
Don

 

[sgt dun]

There is a great book named "Quartered in Hell" about the expeditionary force by Dennis Gordon. Lots of first hand accounts.

 

[ACP230]

I have a book on the anti-Bolshie expedition too. It's When Hell Froze Over by I.M. Halliday. It was originally published under the title Ignorant Armies.

It's a good read.

 

[rayb]

Thanks all for the kind comments

sgt dun - thanks for the reference, the personal accounts would be very interesting.

ACP230 - thanks for the reference, I'd heard of Ignorant Armiesbut didn't know it had beed re-titled or reissued.

digi-shots - most of ny unit nformation came from U of Michigan. A good source for related information. Wish I could do as well with the photography as you. I'd like to get a good clear photo of the writing on the holster, but don't want to mess it up "enhancing" it for that purpose..

rayb

 

[digi-shots]

rayb..

The holster is a very nice find and makes the whole rig extra special.

Your pics are nice and sharp. You might want to try and take a bunch of shots outdoors in the shade to eliminate some of the glare. Once you get the "shot" you think shows the detail in the writing, you can enhance the digital photo on your computer. The enhanced photo might not look good overall but you'll be able to read and see the detail in the writing.

If you take some more shots and can't seem to get the "enhancing" the way you want, just post them here and I'll see if I can work on them a little and re-post them. I don't use any fancy programming (like photoshop! I still can't figure that one out!) just basic digital camera software that came with my camera and/or printer.

 

[John Deere]

I need to read up on this expedition.

Great holster, by the way!

JD

 

[Buford57]

Thanks for posting this great picture and for the leads on the research data. One of my grandfather's much younger cousins was from Michigan and died in the influenza epidemic of 1919. I recall his surviving brother talking about "Archie" serving in Russia during the war. It makes sense now. I guess it made sense to send soldiers from America's frozen sectors to Archangel.

 

[m-1911]

http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/isbn=9780689117138/

I have a copy of a book called "The Day They Almost Bombed Moscow" It tells the story of the Allied invasion of Russia during WW I. The link ablove is for a place selling the book

 

[3/4Flap]

I made that holster in 1991. I bought the 1917 at a flea market in Englishtown, New Jersey and felt it deserved a nice "period" holster. I've worked leather for many years and spent the winter "aging" it by alternatly soaking it in water with lemon juice added and then drying it by the hot fireplace, along with occaisional rubbings with a little neat's foot oil on top and in a couple spots dripping on a bit of motor oil. After about two months I had it pretty close, but decided to add the cryptic story with a Bic pen to give it a bit of sex appeal. That required another month of soakings and the heat treatment to get the writing to "soak" into the leather.

Where did you buy the setup? I sold it to a buddy of mine in about 1999-2000 who lives in Austin, Texas who had a diner where a lot of vets ate and he wanted it for a display he had in a side room. It is called "Frank's Famous" over on Carlisle Street between 23rd and Lopez. By the way, the grips I am sorry to say were chipped by my son Archie who dropped the gun on the garage floor when I showed it to him after getting home from the flea market. He was six at the time and we still get a laugh about it when the issue comes up. He said "Watch this, Dad, I'm Charlie Askins and there's a smuggler!"...and jerked the gun out of the holster and promptly lost hold of it and unintentionally flung it across the room.

 

[3/4Flap]

PS:

The above is a bunch of BS. That is one of the neatest finds I've seen.

That's a keeper!!!

 

[Muley Gil]

I guess it made sense to send soldiers from America's frozen sectors to Archangel.

My grandfather and one of his brothers joined the Army together in 1919. My granddad was sent to Camp (now Fort) Meade, Maryland. Uncle Clay was sent to Siberia!

Back in the '70s, Uncle Clay told me that "this South Alabama boy 'bout froze to death" over there.

 

[rayb]

I made that holster in 1991. I bought the 1917 at a flea market in Englishtown, New Jersey and felt it deserved a nice "period" holster. I've worked leather for many years and spent the winter "aging" it by alternatly soaking it in water with lemon juice added and then drying it by the hot fireplace, along with occaisional rubbings with a little neat's foot oil on top and in a couple spots dripping on a bit of motor oil. After about two months I had it pretty close, but decided to add the cryptic story with a Bic pen to give it a bit of sex appeal. That required another month of soakings and the heat treatment to get the writing to "soak" into the leather.

3/4 flap that possibility has been on my mind since I found it. It is a possibility that I can't dismiss. I'm continuing to look for verification; so far all that I know for sure was that the corporal was in D Co 339th, and the 339th was in Russia in that time frame. Research continues, as time and $ permit.

It may indeed turn out to be a fake, but so far it appears about 50% legitimate.

rayb

 

[3/4Flap]

I only threw out that load of BS as a thought-provoker.

This sort of find simply fascinates me, as do "theater" knives made by servicemen, etc. I wish you the best on proving its origins. A sample of the fellow's writing would sign the deal, no pun intended!

Good luck with that and if you make any more connections, please post the rsults!!

Great stuff.

 

[The Wizard]

According to "Quartered in Hell" the 339th was issued Webley No. 1 Mk VI's. This was done because the Brits had a strong presence there and to simplifiy supply issues. That why they had Mosin-Nagant rifles. Now there might have been some M1917's there but I don't know if a "Corporal" would be the person to get one.

 

[rayb]

Wizard, Thanks for the information, haven't got to read that reference yet, but will do so.

The Mosin-Nagant rifles were evidently issued while still in England, according to 2 sources. Do you know where / when the Webley's were issued?

Thanks

rayb