357 Mag Snubnose questions

[TXSlade]

I have desired a 2.5 inch Colt Python for a long time. I just don't want to pay the crazy prices that they are commanding now.

So, I am buying either a 686 or a 19/66. I am leaning to the 686+ because it is more like the python. I have a j-frame 38 special, so I really don't need another smaller 38 cal. But, I do love how the 66 looks, especially a 19 with awesome grips.

I found a regular 686+ with round barrel and fluted cylinder, also the 686+ PC but I don't know if I like the unfitted, slab barrel.

Is there truly a difference between the reg and PC?
Should I keep searching for 66/19?

Any opinions, observations would be appreciated. Accuracy potential, first hand experience with any of these models, etc.

FYI, I won't be carrying it a lot.
Thanks for your help!

 

[dusty3030]

686 and 19/66 have the same grip size - so wash. Some will be square / some round butt I'd opt for round as it is more versatile grip wise.

For a shooter the 686 is a little more rugged, that's why the came out with it was a "beefed up" model from experience with the K frame 19/66. For that reason alone I'd lean towards the 686.

PC vs regular. Whatever floats your boat but I prefer the regular.

 

[PatriotX]

If you're not going to be carrying it so much, the larger-frame 686 absorbs Magnum recoil better than its smaller, lighter brethren.

You could do far worse than a 686 in either a 2.5 or 3-inch barrel length. My 686+ 3" is one of the best shooters in the safe.

 

[bigwheelzip]

Is there truly a difference between the reg and PC?

I've got the PC 2.5" 686+, and the non-PC 3" 686+.
The action on the PC is much smoother, and the wide, smooth, radiused trigger feels much nicer to me, but I carry the 3". The balance is slightly better, and it's slightly more accurate for me. The 3" features a full length extractor, which is helpful for quickly removing fired magnum cases, to aid in fast reloads.

 

[iPac]

I have desired a 2.5 inch Colt Python for a long time. I just don't want to pay the crazy prices that they are commanding now.

So, I am buying either a 686 or a 19/66. I am leaning to the 686+ because it is more like the python.

Back in May I was in the same predicament you are. I have 38spl snubbies, but wanted a magnum.

My first choice for any gun is a V spring action Colt, so naturally I wanted a Python. The prices are high, but they have dropped considerably and you can find decent shooters for around $2500 now, I know, still alot, and I agree 100%. Tell that to the other people willing to pay anything and creating these high prices though.

So I considered my other options for which the only one I found suitable was a 686 made in '86 or '87 with a 2.5" barrel. It was excellent condition and I could have had it for $900.

However, when you speak of being "like a Python", it is only similar in appearances, to an extent, and size. The action design is completely different and the two aren't even close to the same. It is like Pepsi and Coke to most people, you prefer one or the other. After working on both, I give the nod to the Colt design. Also, the tolerances on a Colt are amazing, for anyone who isn't aware. Barrel to cylinder gap runs .002-.005 and endshake is non existent, in a good working order gun.

It was this reason why I paid a significant amount more and got the 2.5" Python I really wanted. I have a 629 because Colt never really competed in that caliber, and I am not fond of the design, in terms of operation or smithing aspect. The Colt V spring action is second to none in my opinion, and I knew I would never be happy if I got the 686.

I now have a sweet '72 snub Python. Did my own custom action job on it, and tweaked a few things to make it better than factory and ready to last a life-time. It has a 2lb 10oz single action trigger pull, and a 7lb 6oz non-stacking DA pull, all of which are perfectly reliable.

So it is up to you what to get. If you really want a Python because of the design, I would say hold off and buy what you want. If you just want a snub nose magnum and don't care about the action design or you prefer a S&W, then a 686 would be suitable and much more cost efficient. I would personally go with one from the '80s though so you get all forged internals and no lock. That one I had picked out was attractive and they are good looking guns.

 

[epj]

The 19/66 is heavy. The 686 is heavier. I'd be hard pressed to carry a 686 all day. I can carry a 66, but my Colt Agent is a lot more comfortable. In a gunfight, I'd much rather have the 66.

 

[Cocked & Locked]

I vote for the 66

 

[Neumann]

I have a 686+ 3", which has been in my carry rotation for a couple of years. Recently I picked up a 686+7 PC, 2-1/2". How do they compare?

The PC has a much smoother DA trigger pull, about 10#, and a fixed trigger stop. The hammer spur is oblong, and a bit longer than the standard 686. It also has a dovetailed front sight. I will keep the front sight, which has a red insert with a black border (smaller than the blade width), which improves visibility against light and dark backgrounds. The PC has an unfluted cylinder, which doesn't appeal to me, but is perfectly functional in practice.

The PC cylinder is also cut for moon clips. 7-round moon clips are not that common, but the revolver comes with 5 and I bought a few more from Deluxe Moon Clip Tool, along with a bushing to fit the tool. I have no trouble using the short extractor, with or without moon clips. Loading is very quick with moon clips or an HKS Quick Loader (the same for both models).

There's no difference in accuracy. On the first range run, I was shooting 3" groups at 10 yards SA, and 8" DA. With practice, I can get those groups down.

I think the extra $150 is worth while. Between the trigger and the cylinder, you get about $300 of gunsmithing included with the PC compared to the standard 686. It's at the top of my carry list (for revolvers, anyway).

While I like the 66, the difference is very small: 1/8" and 35 oz v 39 oz. The 3" is 42 oz. I use a Sparks VMII holster (3") for either 686, or an Alessi Bodyguard shoulder holster. I carry a .357 for the energy and velocity. Otherwise, it's .45 ACP for me.

 

[dwever]

Ok, so nobody's mentioned the Performance Center 586 L-Comp 7 Shot? Great action, and, like the Python, no MIM parts, the hammer and trigger are drop forged steel. None of the other weapons mentioned on this thread can say that to my knowledge.

The 586 L-Comp in the second picture is between a PC 627 2.625" Barrel 8 Shot and a PC 686+. The 686+ is easily the least favorite of mine of the three; and, the 627 and 586 are both awesome weapons; given the OP's post, I think the 586 L-Comp merits consideration.

 

[Ashlander]

For carry, I prefer the 66/19. I have one of each and both are very accurate. I have a 3" fluted 686-6 Plus that is a bit more accurate if only because it's added weight helps it stay of target once on. And as bigwheelzip said the full-length guide rod is a plus. Likewise, I like the extra round in the cylinder. If I could keep only one, I'd have to pick the 3" 686 Plus. I'd probably make the same decision if it had a 2.5" barrel.

 

[DD357]

I've carried 2.5 & 3" K & L frames over the years. I find The K to be MUCH nicer as a CCW. If you want it just to shoot then get the L would be nicer with full power loads. I'd go 3" for a house/range gun. For a CCW I can't deny the advantage of the 3" for ejection/reloading; however I just prefer the 2.5" for carry and I admit that is nothing but personal preference.

 

[BB57]

My EDC now is a 2 1/2" Model 66.

I prefer a 3" K-frame but my Model 13 doesn't do well with the sweat from long, hot summer days in an IWB holster, and it shoots a bit low with 125 gr .357 Mag loads, where the adjustable sights on the Model 66 allow for regulation of the sights to the load.

----

In both cases it is not much larger or heavier than a 3" SP 101, and while it's noticeably heavier than a 3" Model 60, it isn't enough difference to reduce all day comfort, with a good IWB holster and belt.

-----

I agree that the .357 Mag does better in a 4" or longer barrel, but with good load selection you can still get 1250 to 1300 fps with a 125 gr bullet in a 3" barrel.

My preferred load produces an average of 1,296 fps in my Model 13 with a SD around 17-20 fps. I have not gotten around to see how much of a hit I'm taking in the 2 1/2" barrel yet.

It's something of a moot point however as in most cases I'm carrying a .38 +P load anyway.

 

[Vom Brunhaus K9]

I prefer the S&W Model 19 in 2 and a half barrel

 

[guskody]

66 or 686

i have some experience with pre lock snubbie 686's, 19's and 66's.

I personally would not automatically favor the newer 686+PC version over a standard model pre-lock 66 or 686.

Most pre lock Smiths have excellent triggers and if you weren't happy with the action of an older model as is, a good gunsmith could easily improve it to your liking for only a modest charge.

I would also favorably compare the fit and finish of the older models to the fit and finish on a newer PC model.

They really are all nice revolvers.

when deciding between the L frame 686 and the K frame 66/19, i think it comes down to:

-are you going to be shooting a lot more .357 than .38 special?

-if you were lucky enough to handle both the L frame and the K frame snubbies before making your decision, finding out which model feels, points and shoots better for you

-which one visually floats your boat the most. also whether you want stainless or blued.

-is the option of a 7 shot feature 686+ much of a draw to you vs. a 6 shot 19/66

-and how much you enjoy the search process for a used model vs buying a new one off the shelf. some of us really enjoy the search for the right used specimen

its always too easy to say buy them both or buy them all. but if you are in a financial position to purchase both an excellent condition pre lock 686 and a 19/66, you can enjoy the process of deciding which you enjoy shooting the most and then sell off what you don't want to keep.

Hope you have a great time.

 

[TAC]

I vote 686 Plus 2.5"

 

[Ranger514]

I own and concealed carried a snubby 66 for many years. I would highly recommend it to someone who wants a cc revolver; however, if it's just for shooting fun, IMO a 4-inch barrel 686 is a lot more versatile. The L frame is a workhorse, and in my personal experience, the 4-inch model has the best balance as well as better ballistics than the snubby version. I've never shot a more accurate revolver, and it absorbs recoil so well you can shoot it all day with full loads.

 

[AveragEd]

Another vote for the Model 66 - lighter is lighter and that difference, small as it might seem, over the L-frames is noticeable when wearing one for a day.

Having recently given our son my S&W E-Series 1911Sc and its shoulder holster, my carry gun for those few occasions when that seems necessary will be a 2-1/2" Model 66-4. But I won't load it with magnums. First, the muzzle velocity increase in that short barrel over good .38 Special shells is very minimal at best but the muzzle blast is deafening while the muzzle flash is blinding in the dark. I will carry mine with .38 Special 125-grain jacketed hollowpoints. I would even prefer full wadcutter target loads over magnum fodder.

One drawback to a Model 66 snubbie might be a higher purchase price than a Model 686 because the Model 66 is no longer made and those older ones are commanding very high prices these days. But if you want the best...

Ed

 

[sodacan]

IMO, the model 66 is as good as it gets for a 2 1/2" self-defense/carry revolver, even though it is a little heavy. I bought an early 2 1/2" 686 no dash with combat stocks a couple of years ago. It was (is) a great gun but I was offered a stupid amount of money for it and let it go. Really heavy short barreled revolvers are not my thing, and I didn't regret selling it (for once), but the 66 is going to hang around. As an aside, I have a 6" Python that I have owned for years. I really like the long barrel, but never cared for the short barreled model. I think short barreled 686 is a better looking gun.

 

[Groo01]

Groo here
I carried a Python for some 6 years at the SO.
Also put many thousand magnums through it at collage.
The claim that a python is weak ts totally false.
It is easily stronger than a K-frame.[much like it's copy the 686]
The action is DIFFERENT.
It does Not respond to home smithing.
The action works on angles not springs.[if you change an angle, you need a new part]
There are good smiths out there but don't let a part changer near one.
The 686 is a python clone with an S&W action.[I have both]
They even use the same holster.

 

[Terry]

Slade,

As far as Performance Center guns from S & W they are well worth the difference. Some of the biggest differences are in the trigger action. They are supper smooth and it is not done by installing spring kits but actually working and smoothing the actions

I have a 587 PC L comp and it has an trigger double action that is unbelievable. It is also machined for moon clips, compensated barrel. To me it was well worth the difference in price.

I also have a M & P 9 PC, once again a fantastic trigger and other nice features for only an average of $50 more.

On a lesser degree I have a 640 Pro series which has a few enhancements but not quite a PC but still a great shooting weapon.

I am also into 1911's and would love to get a PC 1911 but I will have to same some money up for one of those.