357 magnum ammo- no LSWHP or SJHP 158 gr?

[Dave Lively]

For years revolvers were made for 158 grain lead bullets. It's not that jacketed will hurt them but that they're designed with lead in mind.

What's the difference between a revolver designed for lead bullets and one designed for jacketed bullets? How deeply the rifling is cut?

A lead bullet in a high pressure cartridge like a full power 357 seems like it would be prone to leading. Given a choice between lead and jacketed bullets I would prefer jacketed for that reason. Doesn't seem to be a problem with 38 Special ammo though.

 

[Model19man]

In my casual research I am led to believe that 125 gr. loadings are not good for my Model of 1950 357 magnum and especially for my late 1970s 3" bbl. Mod. 13. I

It seems nobody is making lead hollow point or even SJHP, but tons of flat nose lead SJ.

Maybe you need to use a different website. Before the internet existed I shot thousands of rounds of 110 grain and 125 grain JHP's through my Model 19. Nowdays the internet scuttlebut is that doing so will surely result in a cracked forcing cone. My experience is that is BS.

Winchester SUPER-X HANDGUN .357 Magnum 125 grain Jacketed Hollow Point Centerfire Pistol Ammunition For Sale | Winchester Ammo Store

 

[Malysh]

Maybe you need to use a different website. Before the internet existed I shot thousands of rounds of 110 grain and 125 grain JHP's through my Model 19. Nowdays the internet scuttlebut is that doing so will surely result in a cracked forcing cone. My experience is that is BS.

Winchester SUPER-X HANDGUN .357 Magnum 125 grain Jacketed Hollow Point Centerfire Pistol Ammunition For Sale | Winchester Ammo Store

You don't realize it, of course, but I picked up that information ( whether true or not), from THIS website

 

[Malysh]

Well, all of you have provided me with some options and suggestions, which I appreciate, thanks!

 

[Malysh]

I think that part of your issue might be with naming conventions.

The term Semi-Jacketed Hollow Point was introduced by Remington more than half a century ago to describe their scallop jacketed ammunition like the 158s in this picture

All other designs of the day were called Jacketed Hollow Point regardless if the Jacket left lead exposed or not. BTW virtually all JHPs originally had exposed lead. It was not until pre-scored jackets became a reality that JHPs had jacketing extended to the tip of the projectiles.

While most Factories pretty much still differentiate the terms that way, many shooters have gone to calling any Jacketed Hollow Point ammunition with exposed lead "Semi Jacketed"

Plated bullets have further confused the terminology with some people using the word Jacketed with Plated projectiles

Technically there is no such thing as a "Fully Jacketed Hollow Point" though some plated bullets do have plating in the hollow points

If you are truly looking for the Remington 158 grain SJHP ammunition, Ammoseek returned 25 listings for it.

If you are just looking for anybodies 158 grain JHPs, Ammoseek is showing 182 listings

To help you with Ammoseek, if you put JHP in the box that says "Match these words in search" you will only return listings that include JHP

Jacketed ammunition is safe in any firearm

The Remington ammo you posted was what I was looking for.
Old guy - old ammo

 

[colt_saa]

Virtually all the rifle ammo in WW1 used jacketed bullets. Loading lead bullets into something like a full power 30-06 is a bad idea. Looking on the internet most WW1 9mm ammo was jacketed as well although I saw picture of what appeared to be lead bullets in some 45 ACP ammo of the era.

Jacketed bullets were not common in revolver ammo of the day but jacketed bullets were widely used in other small arms in 1935.

You are of course correct.

I should have said revolver ammunition as opposed to small arms and munition

It just shows I should not be responding to messages before going to sleep at night.

 

[colt_saa]

The Remington ammo you posted was what I was looking for.
Old guy - old ammo

Then go back to ammo sake and put JHP into the field for words that must be included.

Also select remington as the manufacturer

You will then get a list of what you are looking for

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

My place is not practical to set up reloading equipment, no matter how economical reloading is.

You really don't need a whole Room to reload. Cowboys kept their reloading gear in a saddle bag. That is all you need to make a few rounds.

 

[Borderboss]

It looks like Remington may have discontinued my preferred .357 Mag load, the SJHP 180gr. But the 125gr is a decent substitute.

I've put thousands of 125gr SJHP reloads through my competition guns with no ill effects. Granted, I'm pushing them at .38 Spl velocities. However, it's not the bullet that's the potential issue as much as it is the bullet/velocity combination. I also recall that the 125gr .357Mag issue was based on guns made in the '50s-'60s and not today.

 

[Doug M.]

I don't recall seeing .357 ammo with a SWC-HP. I used to shoot a fair amount and read about shooting a lot. That doesn't mean there is no such animal, just that I don't recall it and it is likely not very common.

I do recall the SJHP Remington ammo. I heard it referred to as "rose petal back in the day. Never shot the 180 grain that I can recall, but I did shoot the 125 grain out the 4" Dan Wesson I had. I also saw ammo demos at the academy. That stuff was pretty hot. The general consensus among folks in the 70s seemed to be that this load was the Hammer of Thor. I don't know about that, but it barked pretty good and in the dusk would generate on heck of a muzzle flash.

 

[rockquarry]

I don't recall seeing .357 ammo with a SWC-HP. I used to shoot a fair amount and read about shooting a lot. That doesn't mean there is no such animal, just that I don't recall it and it is likely not very common.

I do recall the SJHP Remington ammo. I heard it referred to as "rose petal back in the day. Never shot the 180 grain that I can recall, but I did shoot the 125 grain out the 4" Dan Wesson I had. I also saw ammo demos at the academy. That stuff was pretty hot. The general consensus among folks in the 70s seemed to be that this load was the Hammer of Thor. I don't know about that, but it barked pretty good and in the dusk would generate on heck of a muzzle flash.

You may be right on the SWC HP .357; I don't really know. One of the big manufacturers many years ago used the term "open point". I don't know if this was what their company called a hollow point or if it was some other configuration. Perhaps more knowledgeable folks are following this and can add better information.

 

[smithra_66]

You really don't need a whole Room to reload. Cowboys kept their reloading gear in a saddle bag. That is all you need to make a few rounds.

Agreed. I reload at my range! All you need is a small table or bench. It's well worth finding a little spare room.

 

[Borderboss]

Remington shows in their catalog a .357 Mag 158gr SWC load, shown here.

You could then get this Forster Hollow Point "drill" for use in their case trimmer to hollow out the bullets.

 

[bmcgilvray]

What if a person is not a true believer in the efficacy of the hollow point?

Bears some thought when discussing the great .357 Magnum cartridge.

Have hollow points been oversold over the past decades? Does the hollow point really turn bad hits into good hits? Could the hollow point be overrated? Nice, but not absolutely essential? At least not as crucial as ammunition companies are wont to promote in their marketing.

Would save a lot of grief over selecting good bullets for handgun cartridges.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Agreed. I reload at my range! All you need is a small table or bench. It's well worth finding a little spare room.

I reloaders in my basement on an old desk. It is a very heavy desk probably made in the 50s or so. I don't have a reloading room either but it works well.enough for me.

 

[Doug M.]

What if a person is not a true believer in the efficacy of the hollow point?
Bears some thought when discussing the great .357 Magnum cartridge.
Have hollow points been oversold over the past decades? Does the hollow point really turn bad hits into good hits? Could the hollow point be overrated? Nice, but not absolutely essential? At least not as crucial as ammunition companies are wont to promote in their marketing.
Would save a lot of grief over selecting good bullets for handgun cartridges.

***
Answer: It depends. Modern service ammo is designed to perform in a predictable manner in a specific window (velocity, mostly) and reliably against a typical set of barriers. All of it is HP for good reasons - the goal is to dump the energy in a specific amount of penetration without the risk of penetrating the offender and jeopardizing the rest of the non-offending population. Take a look at the IWB Association work by Fackler and then Roberts. Some of it is summarized well in the 4th chapter of the Patrick and Hall book I have cited here before (3d edition).

For hunting, the HP is likely not as viable or needed, but that is not my world. Admittedly I don't bother with HP in .38; my M66 is loaded with .38 SWC at standard velocity. Placement and adequate penetration are the first and second things in personal defense. I'd say that a decent understanding of targeting for defense against humans is relatively new, certainly not addressed in anything I recall reading until the late 80s or even later.

 

[colt_saa]

What if a person is not a true believer in the efficacy of the hollow point?

Then do not carry a hollow point

You have been on this Forum for almost two decades. there is probably little that we can say in a few paragraphs that will alter a belief system that has built itself over decades

As Doug M. points out, hollow points and for that matter soft points are intended to slow down a projectiles travel through it's intended target, to alter the projectile's shape and to allow as much of the kinetic energy as possible transfer to the target.

I have always believed in the right projectile for the job

I was going to tell the story of my last firefight but it is too much typing this late at night

 

[Chuck Edwards]

Looking through Ammo Seek's 5 pages of 357 ammunition, I find no 158 grain loadings for LWSHP or SJHP. Lot's of SJ solid lead flat nose and fully jacketed hollow point.

In my casual research I am led to believe that 125 gr. loadings are not good for my Model of 1950 357 magnum and especially for my late 1970s 3" bbl. Mod. 13. I have also heard that fully jacketed projectiles are not good for revolvers, although I see a lot of offerings in 130 gr. fully jacketed 38 Special and 125 gr. 357. I have about 100 rds. of older Remington SJLHP ammo I could use in the rare event I might need it for self defense.
Ideally, I would like to find some ammo I described to use as target and self defense ammo in 158 grain.

It seems nobody is making lead hollow point or even SJHP, but tons of flat nose lead SJ.

Is the 158 gr. 357 LSWHP no long considered a good 357 magnum cartridge?

To the best of my knowledge, the only .357 Magnum 158-grain LSWC-HP ammo that has been offered are the long-discontinued Federal Nyclad and Hornady loads. I shot both of them (only at paper) back in the day, and don't remember anything special about the Nyclad load and found the Hornady load to lead terribly.

The R-P 158-grain .357 Magnum SJHP load is still in production, at least occasionally.

For your M13, I'd suggest trying the Speer Gold Dot Short Barrel load or the R-P Golden Sabre. They're both reduced-power .357 Magnum loads. They're also both hard to find. Another possibility would be to do what the FBI did when they issued the 3" M13 and use the .38 Special +P LSWC-HP load offered by Remington and Winchester.

 

[rosewood]

Agreed. I reload at my range! All you need is a small table or bench. It's well worth finding a little spare room.

I have a reloading room, but I started with just a microwave cart from Walmart with a butcher block top. I still use that cart. My progressive press is mounted on 1 end and I store supplies inside the cart. My single stage Lee (dedicated decapping/sizing press) is on the other end. It can be moved from room to room if needed. I made some modifications so I can easily swap out different presses.

Rosewood

 

[Malysh]

Please see post one. I only use 158gr. projectiles in my 2 older magnums.