4513tsw rail frame revisions photo request &Q’s

[f0X_h0uNd]

I've read about some revisions on here but would like to request photos of it please .
Need a photo of the frame rail top view .
I have a pre-rail 4513tsw with the short frame . Great shooter . Recoils great .
Information on the 4513tsw barrels and frames is very vague . I included of a photo pre-rail and the railed variant revision circled in red .
Top photo is tsw 4513 pre-rail barrel.

What are those cut out pockets purpose ? All I can gather is that it rides on the inner inner rail .
I ask because they are different in size the pocket .
Thanks

 

[armorer951]

The photographs aren't super clear, but I've never seen artifacts like that in any of the variants I've examined or worked on over the years.

 

[f0X_h0uNd]

The photographs aren't super clear, but I've never seen artifacts like that in any of the variants I've examined or worked on over the years.

Here are some clearer photos I took today .

 

[armorer951]

Again, I apologize, but the photos are not close enough to show a lot of detail. In one photograph, the area is underexposed, in the second image, it's overexposed.

What I am seeing appears to be damage to both of the barrels, under the chamber area, by someone improperly using a milling machine and an end mill. These marks are not uniform in depth or shape, and don't appear to me be factory. As I indicated in my previous post, I have never seen such a cut on any of the pistols I have owned, examined, or worked on. The results of this apparent "milling" or damage may compromise the intergrity of the chamber itself, depending on the amount of material removed, it's depth and exact location.

As to the "cut-outs" purpose, I cannot say. Perhaps someone else here on the forum will be able to provide some additional info, based on the photos you have provided.

For an expert opinion, you should send the photos, details concerning the pistols, serial numbers and measurements, if you have them, to S&W .

 

[f0X_h0uNd]

Thank you ,Not sure if my question was answered? I have 4 S&w 3 gen diff cal too and all have those grooves where the barrel rests on the frame .
I'm seeking a photo of a top view of the 4513tsw full 7rd grip with rail frame after they did the revisions
?
I want to prove a theory as to the photo request . I want to swap slides on the 4513tsw made in 1997 6 round grip shortframe with the newer updated 4513 tsw slide and barrel .
These are two different S&w barrels pictured I have the receipt from S&w for all firearms that I own .

sorry for the miscommunication.
thanks

 

[BLUEDOT37]

I recall seeing those "notches" on one or more of my 3rd Gens.

In checking through my pictures it seems most pics of their barrels are not a side view, however here's one of my Shorty 40 (mfd. Oct-1993) that is & clearly shows that notch.

I looked at my 4013TSW & 4056TSW, both pre-rails, & they do not have that notch. These were made in 1997.

I see no difference in the frame rails, where that notch is, between the three very similar pistols.

I believe the notch was just a machining "over-run". On the pre-rails you can see where that angled machining cut stops right at the edge of the barrel's lower outside chamber area, where on the Shorty 40 it starts to go into it, creating the notch.

.

Shorty 40 Mk.I - (disassembled & cleaned)

(-01a)

.

 

[JohnHL]

Welcome to the Forum, f0X_h0uNd!

I examined several large frame, compact barrels including the two you mentioned.
I hadn't paid much attention but sure enough, I observed all three variants of the radius cut at the top of the barrel unlocking ramps.
By all three I mean the small and the large cuts you illustrated and a third variation in which there was no cut.
I assure you, all these barrels are unmodified but I can offer you no concrete explanation for the cut other than the supposition that they are clearance cuts to allow fouling or gas to escape when the barrel is slamming down against the frame during recoil.

As for swapping slides between the pre-rail and railed versions of the 4513TSW models, I believe they are close enough in design that if the pistols hand cycle with the swapped slides, they should be OK to shoot.

John

 

[JohnHL]

Thanks for the picture, BLUEDOT.

The barrels on the small and medium frames interface with the frame on a pair of flat surfaces on either side of the chamber's bottom whereas the large frame barrels are rounded on the bottom and interface with their respective frames in a rounded trough.
I don't know why S&W used two different methods other than to allow the larger 45 barrel to sit lower in the frame.

John

 

[f0X_h0uNd]

I recall seeing those "notches" on one or more of my 3rd Gens.

In checking through my pictures it seems most pics of their barrels are not a side view, however here's one of my Shorty 40 (mfd. Oct-1993) that is & clearly shows that notch.

I looked at my 4013TSW & 4056TSW, both pre-rails, & they do not have that notch. These were made in 1997.

I see no difference in the frame rails, where that notch is, between the three very similar pistols.

I believe the notch was just a machining "over-run". On the pre-rails you can see where that angled machining cut stops right at the edge of the barrel's lower outside chamber area, where on the Shorty 40 it starts to go into it, creating the notch.

.

Shorty 40 Mk.I - (disassembled & cleaned)

(-01a)

.
.

Bluedot thank you for the pictures . johnHL you nailed it thank you .
I like the lci option on the later models

 

[JohnHL]

JohnHL you nailed it thank you.

I like the lci option on the later models

You are very welcome!

I also prefer the loaded chamber indicator barrel.

As a matter of fact, I believe the railed TSW models represent the culmination of a half century of S&W metal frame, center fire, semi-auto pistol design.

I think you will also find that your pre-rail and rail 4513TSW barrels will interchange, giving you even more versatility.

John

 

[f0X_h0uNd]

I saw a couple of those pc40 at decent price on gb.
I put 150 rounds through it with the updated slide . Every 50 rounds I took slide off and checked . No indications of peening or excessive rubbing on inner rails .

I'm super happy about this purchase .just won a S&w cs9 in Black and decent price .
I've been seeing a lot of these slides and barrels go for sale .
JohnHL that's a sweet pc in 40 how's it recoil ?
Thanks

 

[JohnHL]

I saw a couple of those pc40 at decent price on gb.

It is certainly refreshing to see the terms "pc40" and "decent price" used in the same sentence! (Or anything Performance Center, for that matter.)

I put 150 rounds through it with the updated slide . Every 50 rounds I took slide off and checked . No indications of peening or excessive rubbing on inner rails .

I'm glad it worked out for you.
I am also gratified you took the scholarly approach and inspected the slide/frame interface every 50 rounds to look for signs of mismatch.

I'm super happy about this purchase.

Can't say as I blame you...

just won a S&w cs9 in Black and decent price.

Congrats!
Sadly, "cs9" and "decent price" have also become an oxymoron.

I've been seeing a lot of these slides and barrels go for sale .

Are you referring to 4513TSW slides and barrels?
Where are you seeing them? E-bay?

JohnHL that's a sweet pc in 40 how's it recoil ?
Thanks

You're welcome!
However, that's not my pc40.
It belongs to BLUEDOT37. (Honest mistake. He and I look so much alike on this forum.)

The closest thing I have to the pc40 is a 4013TSW.
Recoil is fine, but I'm not very good at judging recoil.
My first S&W was a 629.
My first S&W semi was a CS40.
I've never shot the 460 or 500 so every other S&W model that I shot after the 629 and CS40 didn't leave me with any impression.

John

 

[GaryS]

I frequently see 2nd and 3rd Gen slides, barrels, and internal parts for sale on Ebay. Mostly used parts. Which makes me sad because I know that a complete gun has died to make those parts available. OTOH, it does make some parts available that are otherwise no longer around.

 

[JohnHL]

I frequently see 2nd and 3rd Gen slides, barrels, and internal parts for sale on Ebay. Mostly used parts. Which makes me sad because I know that a complete gun has died to make those parts available. OTOH, it does make some parts available that are otherwise no longer around.

Don't be sad, Gary.

Those were bad guns that deserved to be punished.

It's a good thing our elected leaders didn't do anything foolish or irresponsible like return them to the owners who worked to pay for them and from whom they were stolen.

John